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esperanza

Jan 28, 2007, 8:17 AM

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Where does it come from?

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I'm probably delusional but I don't think there are large feed yards and hormone doctors in this part of the country. The cows are skinny and the beef tastes like cardboard (fat is oh so yummy!!). I like the range fed chickens, however. Also, the fruits and veggies I buy in the farmers' markets here have less fertilizer and pesticides used on them, I think. Many of the locals who live on small farms just can't afford the chemicals. Or maybe I'm seeing my life through rose colored glasses?

Rose colored glasses, Geri. Most of the beef you buy there probably isn't locally raised, unless you're buying directly from the person who butchered it. However, I'd say that if you're buying from a place that does not sell its meat already shrink-wrapped, you're probably buying from a local purveyor. Do you know where the rastro municipal in Oaxaca is? You might go over there and talk to someone about your beef, where it's raised and fattened (if it's fattened), etc. On second thought, it would probably be easier just to ask at the market where the beef comes from, rather than going to the slaughterhouse.

As for your farmer's markets, the produce most likely comes from the local mercado de abastos, which means it's shipped in from commercial growers all over Mexico. Here in Guadalajara, we do see some individual growers selling their veggies, but not many--and none other than at a tianguis. The individual growers will bring in a load of cucumbers, for example, and sell just cucumbers. Some indigenous women bring things like miltomates, huitlacoche, and flor de calabaza to sell.

Otherwise, the vendors who have tables of several varieties of veggies (cebolla, calabacita, tomate, jitomate, chícharo, porro, etc) buy them wholesale at the abastos and bring them to market at a small markup. Ask the vendors where the produce comes from.

Fruit vendors are the same. Ask, please, and report back.

I'd be really interested to hear what you find out.




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(This post was edited by Rolly on Jan 28, 2007, 9:13 AM)



Anonimo

Jan 28, 2007, 8:34 AM

Post #2 of 6 (1256 views)

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Re: [esperanza] It must be in the water

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As for your farmer's markets, the produce most likely comes from the local mercado de abastos, which means it's shipped in from commercial growers all over Mexico. Here in Guadalajara, we do see some individual growers selling their veggies, but not many--and none other than at a tianguis. The individual growers will bring in a load of cucumbers, for example, and sell just cucumbers. Some indigenous women bring things like miltomates, huitlacoche, and flor de calabaza to sell.

Otherwise, the vendors who have tables of several varieties of veggies (cebolla, calabacita, tomate, jitomate, chícharo, porro, etc) buy them wholesale at the abastos and bring them to market at a small markup. Ask the vendors where the produce comes from.

Fruit vendors are the same. Ask, please, and report back.

So, what do you think is the situation in the Pátzcuaro mercado, Esperanza? I know the manzanas often are from Washington state. The berenjenas and bean sprouts are from away. but I'm confident that the women seated on stools or on the ground are selling their own, locally grown produce.

Inside the carnicerías, I'm fairly confident that the meat is from locally raised and (freshly) slaughtered animals. (Which doesn't make it superior, of course. Just fresher.)

Buen provecho,
Anonimo


geri

Jan 28, 2007, 8:55 AM

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Re: [esperanza] It must be in the water

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Actually, I don't eat much beef here. It tastes so bland. I haven't tried it from our "new" Sam's Club, but even the shrink wrapped in Gigante isn't all that flavorful. I doubt that the sides of meat hanging in the open tiendas on Calle 20th de Nov. are from feed farms, but maybe. Anyway, I don't know if the diesel fumes add to the flavor or not, but I'm not inclined to find out. However, I have friends who have their favorite, local butchers.

And I KNOW some of the women who sell veggies in the markets I go to. They trudge down from mountain pueblos (well, they ride in the back of pickups actually), and, as Anonimo mentioned, sell whatever they happen to reap that day or the day before, including wild flowers by the roots!!! The bigger product stands, of course, get their product from "away," obviously the apples, grapes, etc. There's an organic market here Fri. and Sat. and I KNOW one gringa who sells there and am SURE her stuff is grown without chemicals, but I wouldn't trust all the vendors there.

The chickens come in from the Isthmus each day and are sold from the livingroom of my neighbor. Anyway, my cholesterol came down (without me consciously dieting for it) after a couple of years in Oaxaca. Doc in USA said it's rare to bring it down solely with eating habits. He needs to live in Oaxaca!!! tee hee


esperanza

Jan 28, 2007, 9:02 AM

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Re: [Anonimo] It must be in the water

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Investigate, Anónimo.

I feel relatively certain that you're right in that the indigenous women you described who are selling at the market are selling their own products--but you never know. If embroidery is done by a co-op, why not hongos? On the other hand, all the other vendors are selling standard produce--both fruits and vegetables--from the nearest abastos, probably Morelia. The bulk staple vendors (beans, rice, pastas, pet foods, etc) also buy in larger bulk at the abastos.

Things I'd like to know about in Pátzcuaro: where does the pinole come from? Do the women who sell it, make it? Where in Michoacán (or elsewhere) is the chile manzano grown--the chile manzano that's sold in the Pátzcuaro market? Where is the huazontle grown, and the quelites?

I agree: at the local carnicerías, the meat is probably slaughtered at the local rastro municipal. If you're shopping at a supermarket, where the meat is pre-shrink wrapped or shrink wrapped when you order it, the meat probably comes from elsewhere.

Only one way to find out: ask. Ask the fruit/vegetable vendors (and try not to be surprised at what comes from Chile). Ask at the carnicería. Ask at the supermarket.

And report back, please.

Moderator, can all these food-oriented posts be moved over to the Kitchen? Thanks.




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wendy devlin

Jan 28, 2007, 9:11 AM

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Re: [Anonimo] It must be in the water

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Have spent much of my time in Mexico in the countryside, especially in pueblos with less than 3000 people. This is a little of what have noticed specifically in Colima and Jalisco.

Main point being, that although agriculture is still a primary activity in the countryside, the bulk of the food that people eat every day, is not necessarily grown in or near where they live/work.

The main exceptions to this seems to be fresh fruit, in season, largely from trees, limon, guava, mango etc. and freshly slaughtered meat, chicken, pork, beef etc. and maybe some eggs and dairy.(cheese)

The majority of people who live in these pueblitos once worked as campesinos.

Generally working as day-workers on plantations, in Colima, watermelons, corn, tamarindo etc. A generation or so back, many of these people also had their own ranchito, land where they also grew fruits, vegetables, livestock for themselves. A certain degree of food self-sufficiency.

Nowadays, more people rather hire out as obreros(workers) in construction, delivery, service industries etc. or buying low and selling higher, just about everything. Part of this is related to the steady flow of 'remittances' from relatives working NOB. Sometimes these particular pueblos seem home to mainly women, children and the elderly. There are of course still men about, but there seems a lot of movement, looking for work around other parts of Mexico, or illegal migration. It surprised me somewhat that so many of these men went north/south almost yearly, often getting back for Christmas and/or the summer fiesta. But there are, 'net-works' in place.

Working in the fields, seems to be thought by many now as what you do, if you can't make money doing anything else. In the past ten years, I hardly saw, anyone with anything resembling a garden where they grew their own fresh vegetables. Maybe some fruit trees, a few herbs but rows of vegetables, no.

So, (didn't think to ask about the sources) would surmise that most of the tomatoes, peppers, etc. would come from abastos or or other distributors. Although like mentioned above, someone might have access to a bulk supply of melons, limones, coconuts...from some source, perhaps local and set up shop, in a tianguis, out of the back of the truck etc.


We've had friends among construction jefes and many other walks of work, who always seemed to have their noses in the air, sniffing out the best sources of crops picked at peak perfection.

They seemed to be able to buy at a low price, the juiciest watermelons, sun-ripened pineapples, the cocos when the milk was just right etc. Women too, seem to often go to considerable lengths to find the best product for price.

later maybe will chat about meat, dairy, eggs etc.


sfmacaws


Jan 28, 2007, 10:39 AM

Post #6 of 6 (1224 views)

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Re: [wendy devlin] It must be in the water

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Although the meat may be slaughtered locally, from the number of trucks we see full of beef,chicken and pork on the hoof, the animals could come from anywhere. I'm guessing that the Mexican preference for freshly slaughtered meat means that a lot of it is trucked alive and slaughtered near the point of sale.

On our way over here to Mérida, we passed truck after truck full of watermelons heading towards the coast, also a couple trucks full of only pineapples. They were on the free road, and they were not big fancy trucks. Again, I'm guessing, but I think they are coming from ejidos in the interior and heading for the abastos in Chetumal or perhaps to a particular resort that they have a connection at. I can well imagine that any of the all inclusives along the coast could use a truck load of watermelon in a day or two. It would be interesting to know if the resorts make their own deals at the point of origen for this stuff, if I'm ever around one of these trucks that's not doing 90km down the road, I'll ask.


Jonna - Mérida, Yucatán


 
 
 
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