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gpkgto

Feb 27, 2010, 11:52 AM

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Tu/Ud

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I am old enough to use "tu" for practically everyone--but is that the standard? I hear various things from my friends--some use Ud. with their parents. Are all adult strangers "Ud."?



Papirex


Feb 27, 2010, 12:36 PM

Post #2 of 15 (7814 views)

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Re: [gpkgto] Tu/Ud

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Tu is the familiar, usted is formal. Generally speaking, you would use tu when addressing someone you know well enough to use their first name, and usted for someone you just met, respect, or a client,etc.


Sometimes, my wife will use usted when she is speaking to someone when she is a little bit angry with them. She will often tell me “I was speaking with usted”.


Rules are made to be broken, you won't go to jail for using an unusual form of address.


Rex

"The supreme happiness of life is the conviction that we are loved" - Victor Hugo

(This post was edited by Papirex on Feb 27, 2010, 1:04 PM)


esperanza

Feb 27, 2010, 12:38 PM

Post #3 of 15 (7809 views)

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Re: [Papirex] Tu/Ud

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Usted is the singular, ustedes the plural. No such word as ustede.




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Papirex


Feb 27, 2010, 1:03 PM

Post #4 of 15 (7805 views)

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Re: [esperanza] Tu/Ud

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OK Hope, you got me on a typo and you are right for a change. I will go back and edit my last post to correct the spelling now.


Rex

"The supreme happiness of life is the conviction that we are loved" - Victor Hugo


esperanza

Feb 27, 2010, 1:05 PM

Post #5 of 15 (7801 views)

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Re: [Papirex] Tu/Ud

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Gosh, Rex, for a change? <chagrin> Thought I was doing better than that...




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mazbook1


Feb 27, 2010, 2:26 PM

Post #6 of 15 (7793 views)

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Re: [Papirex] Tu/Ud

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Although all Spanish courses teach the Usted is the "formal" you, that isn't generally true in México, especially here in the conservative north. Usted is the RESPECTFUL form of you and should be used (at least in the north) in speaking with anyone unless they actually tell you to use tu and/or use tu when speaking to you, even when you are on a first name basis. I've been on a first name basis with my wife's parents for some time now, yet they always use Usted (or the Usted verb conjugation) with me and I certainly reciprocate when speaking with them.

One gringa, a lady who has worked here in Mazatlán for many years and speaks flawless, fluent Spanish (I'm green with envy LOL), took me to task for the advice in my little book to always use Usted or the Usted verb conjugation. A couple of months later, she bought a house in a purely Mexican working-class neighborhood. That week there was a neighborhood meeting about getting more of the dirt streets paved, which she attended. She called me right after that and apologized, saying that there were many folks that had been neighbors for 30 years and longer who still used Usted with each other.

Usted has three things to recommend it. 1. You just can't be wrong if you use it with everyone (excluding children). 2. You will always be considered more respectful than other gringos. 3. Since Usted uses the same verb conjugation as he, she and it, you have one less verb conjugation to learn at first. Also, the plural you in México is always ustedes, the respectful form, rather than the familiar vosotros that now seems to be used only in Spain.

I've only had one person tell me, "Por favor, tutéame.", since I've lived in México (nearly 13 years now), and she was from Buenos Aires.


esperanza

Feb 27, 2010, 4:52 PM

Post #7 of 15 (7774 views)

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Re: [mazbook1] Tu/Ud

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About six years ago, I met a very correct, well-bred woman from Mexico City, someone quite well-known in international circles. Although I am not nearly as prominent as she is, I do hold my own in the same circle of friends and associates. This person is just a bit older than I. Since 2004, we have spent a good bit of time together. We have always spoken to one another as 'usted'.

In mid-December, she and I were chosen to be on the same committee. Much to my astonishment, after six years of knowing one another, she said, "Cristina, por favor: háblame de tú. Ya somos amigas."

Claro que sí, con todo gusto! And I'm so glad that I didn't presume to use the '' form before she asked.




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morgaine7


Feb 27, 2010, 6:43 PM

Post #8 of 15 (7764 views)

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Re: [mazbook1] Tu/Ud

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La Paz is a laid-back seaside town, and my neighbors are about as casual as they come. But while they address each other (and me) by first name, they use usted with the same folks. I arrived here with fluent French and no Spanish, so I went around smugly applying the tu/vous conventions until I realized that they didn't quite work. Now I take the cue from others, using usted with all adults unless they me first. And boy, was I happy when I discovered I could recycle the 3rd person conjugations!

Kate


Rolly


Feb 27, 2010, 6:55 PM

Post #9 of 15 (7763 views)

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Re: Tu/Ud

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Almost everyone I talk with are Tú friends. I am so accustomed to that conjugation that I often slip and use it with waitpersons, gas pumpers, even a cop once. Then I'm embarrassed. Oh well, just another dunb gringo.

Rolly Pirate

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On Facebook as Rolly Brook


mazbook1


Feb 27, 2010, 8:18 PM

Post #10 of 15 (7755 views)

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Re: [Rolly] Tu/Ud

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Not to worry, Rolly. Mexicans are so polite, they will never, ever correct you, and they do understand that gringos don't usually have the fluency in Spanish they would hope that you would have, so they forgive you mentally for that "tu". But it still grates mentally, too, as it is, to their way of thinking, somewhat of a "put-down".


raferguson


Feb 28, 2010, 2:20 PM

Post #11 of 15 (7721 views)

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Re: [gpkgto] Tu/Ud

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I just ustead almost everybody. It is a bit more formal, but is safe and avoids anyone taking offence.

Mexico, in many ways, is a conservative and formal country, I don't think that you can go wrong with ustead, unless it is a family member or a very close friend.

Richard


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morgaine7


Feb 28, 2010, 6:07 PM

Post #12 of 15 (7703 views)

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Re: [morgaine7] Tu/Ud

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Well, aaarrrgh!!
My next door neighbor's sister just -ed me today, and she (and her sister) have always usted-ed me. So now I'm gonna have to pay closer attention!

Kate


gpkgto

Mar 1, 2010, 11:22 AM

Post #13 of 15 (7678 views)

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Re: [morgaine7] Tu/Ud

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This was what I wanted to know--does this mean she likes you or disrespects you?


morgaine7


Mar 1, 2010, 4:38 PM

Post #14 of 15 (7657 views)

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Re: [gpkgto] Tu/Ud

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Heh, dunno. ;-)
Could be that it was an unintended slip. But we're in the same age group and have all known each other for three years, so maybe they're working up to it.

Kate


sergiogomez / Moderator

Mar 29, 2010, 3:28 PM

Post #15 of 15 (7380 views)

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Re: [morgaine7] Tu/Ud

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In Reply To
Well, aaarrrgh!!
My next door neighbor's sister just -ed me today, and she (and her sister) have always usted-ed me. So now I'm gonna have to pay closer attention!

Kate


In my experience, the context gives it away. If there's some reason to be snide, using could be a slight jab under the belt. I've done that myself, although it's usually more gratifying to keep using usted and let your tone get cold and snippy, or loud and obnoxious, depending on your mood.

When it's someone I've known a while and starts slipping out from time to time, I assume the person is starting to relax around me. This rule can also apply when slips out as a one-time thing and the person saying it has had a cerveza or two.
 
 
 
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