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Bloviator

Mar 30, 2007, 6:25 AM

Post #1 of 12 (4209 views)

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Learning Spanish

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One frequently sees people who are planning to live away from areas with other US and Canadian people saying that they do not speak Spanish, but intend to learn immediately. While I'm sure that living in an area with few English speakers accellerates the process, I wonder how successful people have been coming here and learning Spanish.

Several years ago, my daughter got on a plane, went to Chile, studied Spanish for a year - having only some Spanish from her mother's maid - and returned as a bi-lingual teacher, passing all the tests required for such a position.

I, on the other hand, armed with my superb high school and community college Spanish from 50 years ago (I actually achieved C grades), have lived here in English/Spanish speaking Ajijic for two years and have only become minimally able to communicate at the most basic level, though I do study on my own and try to speak Spanish as much as possible.

I'm now starting Spanish classes and realize just how minimal and basic my Spanish is. Being an old person, I have two real impediments to learning. One is that I can't hear the sounds as well as I could when younger. The other is that my memory isn't what it was fifty years ago - though, I'm constantly amazed to dredge up a word out of high school Spanish when in a real bind.

Are there super success stories out there that I can read to improve my flagging confidence?



jerezano

Mar 30, 2007, 8:50 AM

Post #2 of 12 (4193 views)

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Re: [dlyman6500] Learning Spanish

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Hello dlyman6500,

You asked:>>Are there super success stories out there that I can read to improve my flagging confidence?<<

I wish I could point to myself as one of those super successes, but I can't.

Like you I am old, but older still. Like you I am hard of hearing so I don't hear the sounds well. Like you I have a poor memory and if I am away from a Spanish environment for three months I am amazed, astonished, and somewhat terrified at the Spanish vocubalry that I forget.

Even so, I read and understand the daily newspaper in Spanish, I read Contenido in Spanish, I read Mexico Desconocido in Spanish, I have many Mexican friends who accept my fractured Spanish without question, although too many times they need to puzzle out what I am talking about. We discuss all sorts of things, mainly politics because all my friends are political and worry about México's future, Zacatecas's future. Jerez's future, and of course their own.
I am helping a graduate of the University of Zacatecas with his graduating thesis.

So, take heart. Don't let your confidence flag. Study, but above all USE your Spanish.

I have a good gringo friend here who has taken about two years of Spanish study from an excellent and now certified teacher (Mexican of course) of Spanish as a Foreign Language. and he understands Spanish very well, he speaks reasonably well but he is afraid to use his Spanish. Only in emergencies will he speak it. As a consequence he has no Mexican friends at all except for his housekeeper.

Don't be like that.

Adiós. jerezano.


quevedo

Mar 30, 2007, 9:24 AM

Post #3 of 12 (4187 views)

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Re: [jerezano] Learning Spanish

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On top of your Spanish accomplishments, you're a very helpful and welcome hand in this forum.

Saludos, amigo Jerezano.

Quevedo


dtracy8671

Mar 30, 2007, 10:23 AM

Post #4 of 12 (4180 views)

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Re: [dlyman6500] Learning Spanish

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I have taken classes, bought almost every book and course on speaking Spanish, and STILL cannot speak past a bare minimum! I find I do ok in class, replying to tapes and cd's, and even reading Spanish. But, once I am away from the teaching process, I tend to forget everything! Still living NOB is what I believe to be the problem, as I have no one with which to actually speak Spanish on a daily basis. When SOB, just about the time to go home, I start to catch on. I just need to get SOB asap permanently :)


Bloviator

Mar 30, 2007, 11:43 AM

Post #5 of 12 (4172 views)

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Re: [dtracy8671] Learning Spanish

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I find it very interesting. When I go NoB for a week or so, when I come back it takes me several trials before I can speak word one of Spanish. It just all seems to go away.

I'm very glad that I'm not afraid to try to speak Spanish even though mine is worse than either of the above persons, I'm sure. Usually, enough communication takes place that whatever I'm trying to accomplish gets done. Sometimes, though, I think I have done a wonderful job of communicating and the result is nothing like I think that I have said. Then I realize that my newly started lessons are essential.


sparks


Mar 30, 2007, 12:18 PM

Post #6 of 12 (4166 views)

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Re: [dlyman6500] Learning Spanish

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Don't know if you are single or married .... but hooking up with a Mexican family sure helps. None of the 6 I live with speak English except what the kids are learning in school and that's very little.

I still can't go down to the local pool hall and feel comfortable with 'the guys' .... but family and friends are very accommodating.

I should be studying a little but I find most classes and books are not geared around day to day conversation. Especially with kids (not exclusively) sentences are reduced to a minimum.

I'll breakout my 500 Spanish verbs next week !!!

Sparks Mexico - Sparks Costalegre


husker

Mar 30, 2007, 12:43 PM

Post #7 of 12 (4160 views)

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Re: [sparks] Learning Spanish

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Just found an other tool to help me increase my vocabulary

http://www.wordchamp.com/lingua2/ReaderResult.do


pez222


Mar 30, 2007, 1:48 PM

Post #8 of 12 (4155 views)

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Re: [husker] Learning Spanish

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I can certainly relate to dtracy's problem. I've been hitting the tapes,CD's and books off and on for 3 years. If I stay away from Spanish for a month or so, I forget much more than I'd like. While in the army serving in Japan during the 1950's, I studied Japanese. To this day I sometimes find myself throwing a word or two of Japanese into a fast moving Spanish conversation. Those early impressions seem to last longer than the ones we get when we're older.

Of course my Spanish is basic, but I get much satisfaction being able to travel and converse a small amount with the people.


jerezano

Mar 30, 2007, 4:42 PM

Post #9 of 12 (4145 views)

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Re: [dlyman6500] Learning Spanish

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Hello;

dlyman6500 said:>> I find it very interesting. When I go NoB for a week or so, when I come back it takes me several trials before I can speak word one of Spanish. It just all seems to go away. <<

A perfectly normal reaction. Your ears need training. If you are away from Spanish a week or so, you lose that training. It affects your mouth too.

But it comes back right away. The words no longer run together in one horrible long sound. So when you come back and are having that trouble with your companions, listen to Television for a while. A real good ear training device.
The Spanish soap operas are perhaps one of the world's best Spanish training devices. You know what is going on, you hear everyday words over and over, and the hearing and repetition are grooved into your brain.

The damn commercials are even better. If you don't understand the one you are listening to, the same one 10, 20, 30 minutes down the road repeat ad nauseum. Only if you listen to the same commercial for a 100 times or so and still can't understand it do you have a problem. For that, there is probably no help. A tequilito will be in order.

A note of encouragement. After I spend three months in the USA and come back home I have to ask my Mexican friends with whom I have chatted daily for 18 years to speak slowly. They always do. It helps. And it is not because I'm stupid or have a bad memory either. It is just an unfortunate truth.

Adiós. jerezano


wendy devlin

Mar 31, 2007, 7:21 AM

Post #10 of 12 (4122 views)

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Re: [dlyman6500] Learning Spanish

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Dick,

As someone who applied as much effort to learning Spanish as anything else, am disappointed at the level of fluency so far achieved. Like you, though, started studying later in life.

Our teen-age daughter around the same time, became bilingual in just a few months of (only) social immersion in Melaque. Younger brain?

Needed some workable strategies to compensate for a lack of fluency.

Concentrated on become an effective 'communicator' not just a 'talker'. Certainly no expert on this topic. Need drove me to develop the strategies below.

Grammar may be wrong, vocabulary askew, but is there understanding?

After learning survival spanish...numerous words, sentences, expressions that allow a person to hop on and off buses, take accomodations, make purchases, ask directions etc. started building a stronger vocabulary around topics of interest. And topics that might interest others.


1)Communicate in context.

For instance then, when talking with fisherman, discuss fishing or futbol with a teenager wearing a Chiva jersey or recent games with a bus driver etc.
Talk about pets with children, music with musicians, that sort of thing.

When someone speaks only Spanish, (which was the situation often transpiring)can I catch enough words, to make sense(context) of the conversation. Pick up the feelings, tone behind the words. The body language. Seems much easier to follow the flow of conversation when both parties are sharing ideas and feelings about topics they are keen about.

2)Make friends with bilingual Mexicans, who can speak and understand English but are understanding/helpful with your efforts to learn Spanish. They seem to have more empathy with the process. Will slow down talking, repeat words, explain expressions when they read the puzzled look on your face.

3)Carry a small note-pad and pen.

This is especially helpful in places like Hardware stores, pharmacies and the like where you have a vested interest in a successful interaction like buying the right screw/tool/ or medication. Write down the name of item, show it to clerk and vice-versa. If they are speaking and trying to explain and I'm only getting the gist but not important info, get them to write it down.

4)Read everything and anything in Spanish or English about Mexico, listen to the radio, the TV, tune your ear. The more that a person has in their back-ground about the culture, again the more context you have for understanding what is being communicated.

That's a few strategies found to be helpful.


Oscar2

Mar 31, 2007, 10:06 AM

Post #11 of 12 (4106 views)

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Re: [wendy devlin] Learning Spanish

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Your suggestion about starting conversations whenever possible is definitely effective under a variety of circumstances. The more pursued, the better one gets at it. Not only do you elevate your level of Mexican communication but also it starts to do wonders to an affable, friendly type of personality honed by quick smiles, patience and a genuine interest in what they are saying.

Like radar it seems almost automatic when you approach someone and the first words uttered brings about somewhat of an inquisitive, anticipating kind of look with eyes asking, what’s next. A threshold entered where small and/or large discoveries wait.

Pen and pad is an excellent suggestion in earmarking the importance of given information. This has surprisingly worked very well for me and on a number of occasions opens bits and pieces of the nature of the locals. It’s as if they are just as curious about you as you are about them and everything in between. It’s not always this way but no harm done. It’s as if there is always a pair of eyes waiting to see something or someone with just as much interest shown in yours. It can be fun.


sfmacaws


Apr 1, 2007, 9:37 PM

Post #12 of 12 (4055 views)

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Re: [dlyman6500] Learning Spanish

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I can also really relate. As a "snowbird" who has spent half the year in MX and half in the US for the last 5 years, I felt like it was 3 steps forward and 2 steps back. It did start taking less time to get my ear, from up to 2 weeks several years ago to around 4 or5 days now.

I feel I've lost a lot of vocabulary in this last year, going straight to Akumal and staying there where I rarely use spanish compared to last year when I was in Guatemala for a month using only spanish and translating for my friends. I can still read enough to understand most things in the news or magazines, I just can't hear it as well and the words don't come to me when I want to use them in conversation.

I had the goal of taking at least a week of classes every year but I haven't done it. Like anything, I need to make it a priority or it will never happen. It's one of the things I look forward to about living in Mérida, the chance to take some more classes and to use spanish daily.

I used to say that I was very Zen in spanish, I lived only in the present tense. Now, I try to use simple past, the future using ir and imperfect but rarely the subjunctive unless it is part of an expression that I've heard a lot.

I've also noticed that my pronunciation has gotten worse, I'm just not listening to enough spanish. I've been really struggling since we got to Michoacán a few days ago, but now we are heading for the border and I'll just lose more. It's depressing.


Jonna - Mérida, Yucatán


 
 
 
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