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ncferret

May 23, 2010, 10:57 AM

Post #1 of 11 (6655 views)

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El (o la) mar

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Just goes to show, you learn something everyday. I was corrected by my wife the a few days ago for saying "el mar". She insisted it was feminine. She's a native speaker, so I accepted her correction gracefully (as always jaja). Then I saw a sign that used the masculine - el mar. When we got home I checked the dictionary. Of course, we were both right. "Mar" can be both!

So, I have a question. Are there other words that are both masculine and feminine?

La Isla


May 23, 2010, 2:01 PM

Post #2 of 11 (6632 views)

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Re: [ncferret] El (o la) mar

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When I studied Spanish in university, I learned that it's el mar in everyday usage and la mar in literary contexts. Googling the matter just now, I learned that sailors usually say la mar and so do people who live near the sea, especially those whose livelihood depends on it.

eyePad

May 23, 2010, 2:32 PM

Post #3 of 11 (6627 views)

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Re: [La Isla] El (o la) mar

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According to DICCIONARIO PANHISPÁNICO DE DUDAS the latin root is gender neutral. The previous post is correct- anyone who has daily contact sometimes says la mar, or in literary context. "el barco sobre la mar, el caballo en la montana, verde, te quiero verde" - lorca.

esperanza

May 23, 2010, 2:43 PM

Post #4 of 11 (6623 views)

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Re: [ncferret] El (o la) mar

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la orden: an order or command, uses that mean "Yes sir!", court order, religious order, etc.
el orden: alphabetical order, straighten something up (poner en orden), nature of a thing

el Internet OR la Internet: a word that belongs to another language is usually masculine, but Internet is often feminine because it is la red--the net.

los or las lentes: glasses.

el radio: the radius of a circle.
la radio: the radio you listen to.

el sartén OR la sartén: the frying pan.




http://www.mexicocooks.typepad.com









(This post was edited by esperanza on May 23, 2010, 2:45 PM)

Rolly


May 23, 2010, 2:52 PM

Post #5 of 11 (6618 views)

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Re: [esperanza] El (o la) mar

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Don't forget the best pair

la papa and el papa

Rolly Pirate

E-visit me http://Rollybrook.com
On Facebook as Rolly Brook

La Isla


May 23, 2010, 3:14 PM

Post #6 of 11 (6613 views)

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Re: [ncferret] El (o la) mar

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Not to nitpick, but I will anyway, we are talking about two different categories of words: In the first (el mar, la mar) the use of the masculine or feminine article makes no real difference in the meaning of the word so designated. In the second (el papa, la papa), the use of el or la indicates two different words with two totally different meanings. I believe that in the second category, we can trace the use of el or la to two different sources for the words, or the etymology of each. If anyone cares to do some research, here's a good link: http://etimologias.dechile.net/ .


(This post was edited by La Isla on May 23, 2010, 3:24 PM)

ncferret

May 24, 2010, 6:34 AM

Post #7 of 11 (6572 views)

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Re: [La Isla] El (o la) mar

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"I learned that sailors usually say la mar and so do people who live near the sea, especially those whose livelihood depends on it."

This makes a lot of sense as most people born here in Mazatlan (on the ocean) use "la mar".

La Isla


May 24, 2010, 7:04 AM

Post #8 of 11 (6564 views)

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Re: [ncferret] El (o la) mar

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In Reply To
"I learned that sailors usually say la mar and so do people who live near the sea, especially those whose livelihood depends on it."

This makes a lot of sense as most people born here in Mazatlan (on the ocean) use "la mar".

Including your wife!

Manuel Dexterity

May 24, 2010, 7:13 AM

Post #9 of 11 (6563 views)

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Re: [ncferret] El (o la) mar

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In Reply To
"I learned that sailors usually say la mar and so do people who live near the sea, especially those whose livelihood depends on it."

This makes a lot of sense as most people born here in Mazatlan (on the ocean) use "la mar".

The opposite is true on the coast of Jalisco.

Then you have geographically speaking "los siete mares" and the individual names of the seas use the masculine article such as "el mar rojo" or "el mar muerto"


And the feminine version in the song that all Mexican children learn at an early age:

"A la víbora, víbora,

de la mar, de la mar

por aquí pueden pasar.

Los de adelante corren mucho,

los de atrás se quedarán"

tras, tras, tras, tras.

zaragemca

May 25, 2010, 8:14 AM

Post #10 of 11 (6523 views)

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Re: [Manuel Dexterity] El (o la) mar

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  Greetings, I think that in the original intellectual context it was masculine, history, made reference in the maps, 'El Oceano', 'El Golfo', etc. But then the Spanish sailors and fishermen started making reference to, 'la marea', (the seawave), and the Spanish sailors and fisherman, incorporated the reference, 'la mar'. Gerry Zaragemca
International Club of Percussionists

sioux4noff

May 25, 2010, 10:58 PM

Post #11 of 11 (6502 views)

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Re: [ncferret] El (o la) mar

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I asked a friend who was born in Puerto Vallarta. He said if you are talking about the ocean (in general) it is el mar. La mar, he said , is what you use in the context of "at sea" like a boat going to sea.
 
 
 
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