Forums > General > Traveling Mexico

robt65

Jun 18, 2010, 3:45 PM

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Readers Please Verify or Share Any Info on This

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My Mexicana wife (presently in Tamaulipas) has told me that her father and her both are somewhat worried about any Gringo now in Mexico. There reasoning for this belief is several fold. I do not read Spanish that well so for me to read the Mexican Papers without possible mistakes is a problem. It is my wife who is telling me that now the Mexican people in general are very upset about this boy who was shot and killed by the U.S. Border Patrol person last week. The Mexican people are also very upset by the Arizona problem and now there is a growing anti American or more accurate anti gringo movement afoot. Has anyone else heard any such talk in their own neighborhoods? Is there really a rapidly growing anti gringo feeling now in Mexico? Some of you gringos with good Mexican friends, can you share any such wisdom?

Peter

Jun 18, 2010, 4:26 PM

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I haven't seen or heard any such thing here, though such sentiments would not surprise me. It could be in the border states where such things might be more pronounced.

I have been out and about and visited by and with my local Mexican friends. None of them have expressed any concern or mentioned having taken notice of any such feelings.

La Isla

Jun 18, 2010, 4:34 PM

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While I can imagine Mexicans being angry about the Arizona law and the shooting of the Mexican teenager on the border, I don't see this as translating into generalized hatred of Americans living in Mexico, especially Americans who are their friends and neighbors. Maybe the anger is stronger along the border, but as far as my interactions with Mexicans here in Mexico City is concerned, I feel no difference at all.

robt65

Jun 18, 2010, 4:41 PM

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Re: [La Isla] Readers Please Verify or Share Any Info on This

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I feel the same way. It is good to also hear this from both of you (Peter & La Isla) as well. But you know . . . look at the way the Americans and Canadians act about this Arizona law and the shooting of the boy. No matter where in the world, there are a good many bigots that will grasp at anything to stir up the &^%&. My gut tells me that most of the Mexican people that I know would also feel the same way.

La Isla

Jun 18, 2010, 4:47 PM

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I wonder why your wife and her father are so concerned about this. Could they be basing their worry on things they've been reading in the news? I would imagine that I could find lots of reader comments on the issue in El Universal online that could make me want to head for the border!

Rolly

Jun 18, 2010, 4:54 PM

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Re: [La Isla] Readers Please Verify or Share Any Info on This

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I often read some of the reader's posts on my Torreón online newspaper. What a lot of crackpots! What an amazing amount of poor spelling and bad grammar.

Rolly Pirate

E-visit me http://Rollybrook.com
On Facebook as Rolly Brook

robt65

Jun 18, 2010, 5:04 PM

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Re: [La Isla] Readers Please Verify or Share Any Info on This

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Hi La Isla,

I am sure that you are right. The whole family are avid readers of the various newspapers. I think that coupled with the fact that we own a 2005 Tahoe and all the killings that have been happening right around the area of Altamira and Tampico where they live (for now) until I return, has them very worried not only for their safety but mine as well. Heck the past month alone . . . 4 killed in the historic square in Tampico and Wal Mart parking lot, two metro officers hung from the bridge where the wife and I would take the car to be washed, the school four blocks away from their family home closed for ten days due to Narco threats, several killed at the Oxxo across the street in Altamira from the Holiday where I fist stayed in Altamira and my wife and I would go to get some good coffee. 20 bodies found in Madero four blocks from where we rented our first house, count em up! Taht's a bunch not to mention the many more that were innocent people minf=ding their own business that were caught as we call it collateral damage", so yes, they are worried and I don't mind telling you that I also am concerned. It has become a very nasty area in a very short amount of time.

As a Viet Nam Vet, I can tell you that one of the things that I looked forward to was a peaceful and fairly quite retirement lifestyle. Well (pardon the pun) that got blown out of the water! I also must tell you that as a Viet Nam Vet, every time I go through a checkpoint, I am sure that I sweat (literally) a result of PTSD. At least in Nam I had something to use for retaliation. Here I have nada . . . . probably a good thing but none the less very unnerving. Until I get to where I am going this time, everything and everyone will be suspect.

(This post was edited by robt65 on Jun 18, 2010, 5:08 PM)

tashby

Jun 18, 2010, 5:40 PM

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Re: [Rolly] Readers Please Verify or Share Any Info on This

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Quote

I often read some of the reader's posts on my Torreón online newspaper. What a lot of crackpots!

Those online reply areas attached to newspaper columns seem to be particularly fertile ground for The Crazies, regardless of which side of the border you're on. It doesn't matter where I am in the world, it's those folks who are spooky.

To the original question in the first post: I don't feel any difference. But that certainly doesn't mean recent events haven't changed the way some people in Mexico feel toward the United States, and US citizens visiting or living here.

(This post was edited by tashby on Jun 18, 2010, 5:45 PM)

La Isla

Jun 18, 2010, 6:09 PM

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Robt65, considering where your wife and her family are living at the moment and all the horrible things that have been happening there, it's no wonder that they are worried. It's almost as though they are shifting their fears about the horrible security system in Altamira and Tampico to a fear for the safety of gringos in the entire country, perhaps as a way of dealing with a seeming collapse of law and order in the area. If things start to get this bad in Mexico City, I may have to rethink my retirement plans ) : .

robt65

Jun 18, 2010, 7:05 PM

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Re: [La Isla] Readers Please Verify or Share Any Info on This

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I still think that for the most part the problems are along the trade routes of the narcos. I really believe in time (not a short period of time) that Mexico will turn around. I think if it does not, there will be anarchy. I feel much safer in the State of Queretaro. Is it totally safe there . . . no absolutely not, but I think a lot less problem than on either coast or the west central mountains. I really don't think that Mexico City will have so much of a disruptive problem as for example the state of Sonora or Tamaulipas does now. I hear and see a lot of stupid false bravado on this and other such sites. This is not the time for false bravado but more the time for a good honest evaluation and reporting of the facts as much as possible for all our friends here. Hiding the truth is stupid approach to any repair of anything. Know about it and deal with it better. Sure I am scared when I drive in Tamaulipas now. I have a family and a new daughter that I have not even seen yet. If I tell you that I am not afraid for them I would be lying to you and all the others here. I simply will not do that with or without elegance! Fear and bow to them and they win . . . . fear and use it for good knowledge as a preemptive weapon and they loose. Fear is not always running . . . . . remember the old adage, it still holds true . . . retreat to fight another day! a dead man can not rejoin his ranks. I had some of the best hand to hand combat training in the military . . . . . I am not stupid enough today to think that I still have the speed and agility that I had 40 years ago. could I still disarm a man bent on killing . . . not a chance. That's being realistic. All I can do is love my family the best that I can and try to outthink the bastards.

skier14

Jun 18, 2010, 8:21 PM

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My son-in-law's mother and father just returned Tuesday from the family rancho in Rio Verde, San Luis Potosi and said that Rio is still shutting down nighttime due to Narco threats.

mensamia

Jun 19, 2010, 6:47 AM

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robt65, did you ever get the feeling there was a big elephant in the room and nobody wanted to admit seeing it? Reading the responses to your very valid post makes me think of this big elephant in the room.
" to see the world in a grain of sand". W. Blake

robt65

Jun 19, 2010, 9:08 AM

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Re: [mensamia] Big White Elephant in the Room

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Thanks for your response mensamia. Yes, for sure, not only on this post but many times. Sometimes I think that maybe I rub people the wrong way. Oh well, in some ways that is the beauty of a forum . . . . . take what you will and leave the rest. For those who you wish would answer, because you respect their wisdom, and they do not answer . . . . . . well it is a disappointment for sure. For others who answer n a way one would not expect well that's their perspective and to be honest sometimes it gives me another slant to look at as well. Like Peter once said on some post . . . .sometimes a person just begins to feel a little alienated or even paranoid, then again maybe because the subject matter doesn't seem to personally concern them, it just doesn't warrant an answer from all or any of them. It is also interesting to see the amazing umber of people who read the posts versus the number of responses one gets . . . .will never know the answer to that one I suppose. I think for sure in all forums there develops certain cliques that one does not get accepted into and when some in these cliques see that answers are not forthcoming then they also do not answer in some kind of fear of being ostracized from the clique themselves. This is very evident in both American and Canadian societies NOB and I think that when all is said and done, that we all bring a lot of societal baggage with us, in one form or another, when we move SOB or to other places (not limited to Mexico). Never mind how much we believe we leave behind or want to leave behind NOB, whether we use a small trailer, pickup, or a larger moving van to move our material things, seems we all bring a lot of our own psychological and societal baggage. Apparently this doesn't take much room in a trailer! (smiling) Boy o" Boy . . . . . this is going to give some a lot to chew on!!! (smiling)

In reality . . . . .not much different than NOB, is it?!?! Forums are a real psychological primer for sure! :)) Robert

Manuel Dexterity

Jun 19, 2010, 11:50 AM

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How so, mensa? Because people haven't posted what you think they should? What you want to hear? Tell us...are you in Mexico? Have your friends if you have any expressed a desire to harm gringos because of what happened at the border? The OP was asking what others have noticed. What have you noticed?

There is treatment for paranoia, btw.

mensamia

Jun 19, 2010, 3:13 PM

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Re: [Manuel Dexterity] Readers Please Verify or Share Any Info on This

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thanks for the smile about the paranoia treatment... they have one for head in the sand syndrome also. :) You are correct, I did not really respond to the OP with what friends had said or my personal experience only because I had recently sharee one of my personal Mexico experiences on another post and I did not want to be repetitive. It is three quarters of the way down the page and I describe an event in Mexico City that was very prescient of what is happening now. At the time, I thought the reporter was being paranoid...Here is the link, robt..

http://www.mexconnect.com/...t_reply;so=ASC;mh=25;
" to see the world in a grain of sand". W. Blake

Manuel Dexterity

Jun 19, 2010, 6:50 PM

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In Reply To

I describe an event in Mexico City that was very prescient of what is happening now. At the time, I thought the reporter was being paranoid...Here is the link, robt..

The only thing you posted was the story of a single person, who I might add, and with much more time living here than her, seems was quite full of shit.

Peter

Jun 19, 2010, 9:14 PM

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Re: [mensamia] Readers Please Verify or Share Any Info on This

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What are you looking for? It sounds as if you did not feel any danger until that woman in Mexico city opened your eyes. Now that she has made you feel uncomfortable in Mexico are you just seeking validation? Do you have a personal experience of your own or is it just the news and the sight of graffiti that makes you uncomfortable?

I think robt65 trusts that I will tell him honestly what I feel. Quite honestly, those incidences at the border have not seemed to change a thing. I live downtown in a fairly large city and am out and about everyday and have not detected people being rude to me or muttering things under their breath that would give me an indication there is an undercurrent of resentment brewing. I have local friends who throughout the years have offered me Mexico survival tips and would be the ones who would tell me if they have detected any new growing resentment to Americans but thus far have not said a word.

When you live in a country that is experiencing a civil war of sorts there are some dangers that you want to exercise some caution to not stumble into. That is an internal matter and I have seen no indication that any of it is being directed against foreigners unless they just happen to be in the wrong place when something is going on.

I know there must be some Mexicans living near me that have some resentment toward Americans in general, there must be, I think the law of averages dictates it. What I experience is the Mexican people I run into want to talk with me and mostly want to know how I feel about Mexico; they want to know if I enjoy the experience of being here. It pleases them that Mexico pleases me, they want to feel like good hosts.

It is justifiable if the news and general state of affairs here in Mexico is a bit unsettling. In your case I would not recommend coming here. If you were to believe me that I thought my city in Mexico is safer than where I used to live in California and convince you it is relatively safe here you would be constantly looking over your shoulder for the boogie man. I don't think this is where you should consider coming to retire, you would never rest easy here.

Robert, I don't sniff out anything new in a shift of resentment here. C'mon back home, I'll be looking forward to seeing you.

robt65

Jun 20, 2010, 7:02 AM

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Re: [Peter] Readers Please Verify or Share Any Info on This

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Thanks for your reply Peter,

First let me say I plan on coming back home . . . . there was never any doubt about that. The only doubt there ever was . . . . was to which highway to take. I believe that my wife and faimly are more concerned in what they read about and for my safety. Newspapers are always going to be newspapers. They thrive on the bad . . . . I remember several years back some person was going to start a new newspaper called "The Good Times News" or something like that. In six months it failed and went bankrupt. As for me, I have experienced the exact same as you have Peter. The Mexican has always wanted to make sure that I enjoyed their country. To share their culture, no matter how little or how much they personally had. I am also sure, as in any other country, there are those persons that will always be bigoted. Nationality doesn't have a "corner" on that market! That is the nature of the human being. Not the nature of the Mexican or the American so on and so on.

It is my nature to learn as much as humanly possible about any given circumstance and then try to make the best decision (on my own) from what I have learned from all different sources. Usually, that has worked pretty well or me in the past . . . not perfect for sure . . . but pretty well. Sure I have had some bad and scary experiences in Mexico, haven't we all? But I can tell you from traveling over this world from Russia, Moldova, Tartarstan, Ukraine, Canada, Japan, Philippines, Germany, Poland, Hungry, Australia, Viet Nam, Cambodia, and a host of other nations that I have some very scary expierences in some of those countries also . . . . . for the most part, Mexico is pretty good over all.

I do not intend on staying away from Mexico . . . my Mexico. I have chosen above many other nations to make Mexico my home and this is where my family is, so YES . . . . for sure, I am coming back and will remain here as long as they will have me. I will try to be prudent in my decisions on which highway to take and what to be aware of, that is all.
Robert

robt65

Jun 20, 2010, 7:13 AM

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Re: [tashby] Readers Please Verify or Share Any Info on This

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Trashby,

Thanks for answering the original question . . .and I agree with your perception on the . . . . . . "reply areas attached to newspaper columns seem to be particularly fertile ground for The Crazies, regardless of which side of the border you're on. It doesn't matter where I am in the world, it's those folks who are spooky."

Robt65

La Isla

Jun 20, 2010, 12:32 PM

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Quote

It is justifiable if the news and general state of affairs here in Mexico is a bit unsettling. In your case I would not recommend coming here. If you were to believe me that I thought my city in Mexico is safer than where I used to live in California and convince you it is relatively safe here you would be constantly looking over your shoulder for the boogie man. I don't think this is where you should consider coming to retire, you would never rest easy here.

Mensamia's "big elephant in the room" is not invisible to most of use living in Mexico though she seems to think that's what going on. I agree with Peter's suggestion that she should look for another country to retire to because she appears to have made up her mind that no matter you run and hide the pachyderms will catch you out!