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John T

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

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Private Schools Cost?

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I'm thinking about the possibility of relocating to Mexico. I have a 12 year old son (7th grade) who speaks minimal Spanish and I am wondering what realistic options I have in terms of education. This is my top priority in deciding upon a place to live. Are public schools even an option? Perhaps in the larger cities? How much does a decent Spanish speaking private school run? Bilingual? English? I'm mainly concerned with the quality of education and cost. Bang for the buck so to speak. For example I'd prefer a good Spanish only school for $100 a month to a mediocre English only school for $300 a month. I've searched but found very little in the way of tuition costs or first hand experiences.

jennifer rose

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

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In over a decade of Morelia life, I’ve only seen a few instances where parents who could afford otherwise sent their progeny to public schools:1. The child managed to get him- or herself kicked out enough private schools already, and the parents wanted the child to get a taste of public school. By the next year, the child was always back in a private school.2. The public school had a special offering uniquely suited to the child – like the Bellas Artes school or one for serious disabilities.3. The Birkenstock-shod, tofu-munching kind who live off the fat of the land, viewing their children’s education as yet another experiment – or they lived in a remote area where the only alternative was the public school. That usually fails, unless the parents were superhuman kinds who made an over-and-beyond effort to supplement their children’s education at home. Public schools in Mexico aren’t the equivalent of public schools in the U.S. They are bare-bones, suffer a high student-teacher ratio, and are an effort to deliver product to the broadest range of students at the least expense. Unless a parent is very, very integrated into Mexican culture and very committed to compensating for public education’s deficiencies, it would be unwise to submit a child to public schools.Private schools in Mexico aren’t bastions of elite education. There’s a broad range of private schools and educational philosophies. Parents make sacrifices here for their children’s education. My plumber sends his sons to a private prepa, and so does my taco vendor. I know American parents who’ve taught at private schools for less than a pittance, just so that their children qualify for employees’ tuition waivers. Yes, it costs. The price tag for private education in Mexico is still less than what you’d pay in the U.S.

Cynthia

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

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Private Schools

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We moved to Chiapas in 1997, where my daughter attended a Mexican private school (not bilingual) from the middle of 5th grade through 8th grade. We returned to the States last year for her to attend high school, as the prepas in our town in Mexico are not very good. The school where she went for prim/secundaria was great academically--she returned to the States and started to attend a Qualer school here; she is on level with everything, ahead in math and science, but has had no exposure to US history. I think the most important thing I learned, and what someone told us when we moved, is that it is a myth that kids pick up Spanish in a month or two. My daughter was ten when we went, and had some exposure to Spanish in her elementary school in the States. It was not until the middle of sixth grade that she began to feel comfortable communicating in Spanish, and was able to even begin to actively participate in classes. She now is completely bi-lingual, in both her oral and written skills, but if we had listened to the "6 month" time frame that I had heard so much about, we would have left Mexico after the half year in fifth grade disappointed. On the plus side, the school was used to having foreigners, and so it was easy to enroll her, and the kids were great, very accepting. She adapted much quicker socially than academically, language-wise. But it was a very difficult transition, and I have seen that with a lot of other (especially older) kids also: usually this idea to pack up and move to Mexico is ours, not theirs! In retrospect, I think there were things that could have been done to make the transition easier, the first being to hire a translator to help in classes so the one or two kids who spoke some English didn't feel burdened to do this all the time. We did eventually get a translator and a tutor; but I wish we had done it sooner. Bilingual schools were not an option in our town. They may be an easier transition for an older kid. Again, this is just our personal experience--as other readers have said, every kid is different. Cynthia
PS I think the school now charges a $1500 (peso) inscription fee and a 900 peso/month tuition fee. It may be a little higher...but not much. : I'm thinking about the possibility of relocating to Mexico. I have a 12 year old son (7th grade) who speaks minimal Spanish and I am wondering what realistic options I have in terms of education. This is my top priority in deciding upon a place to live. : Are public schools even an option? Perhaps in the larger cities? How much does a decent Spanish speaking private school run? Bilingual? English? I'm mainly concerned with the quality of education and cost. Bang for the buck so to speak. For example I'd prefer a good Spanish only school for $100 a month to a mediocre English only school for $300 a month. I've searched but found very little in the way of tuition costs or first hand experiences.

brad

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #4 of 22 (1681 views)

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Private Schools Cost?

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I have 2 children in school here, my daughter starts her second year of college next month and my son will be in his last year of secundaria (jr. high). Both attended public schools in grade and jr. high. There were private school alternatives, neither my wife nor I wear Birkenstocks, we're not super-human and I hate tofu. Many of our friends here send their kids to private colegios. Their academic superiority over public school is debatable in some cases, all of my many nieces and nephews have gone to pricey colegios and none have really impressed me with the results. My daughter received a scholarship to study prepa at ITESM (considered one of the elite schools in Mexico) in Guadalajara and was given another to continue there at the university level. This must say something for the quality of education she received during 9 years of public schooling.In my opinion, one of the most important benefits for the students at the colegios is the social contacts they make which will help them later as adults. There are tons of college grads in this country that manage to just get by because they lack the "connections" needed to really get ahead when they enter the workforce. I know some real dummies that barely made it through the private school system that because of their social connections are doing quita well and vice versa. Very unfortunate but all too true. 
: In over a decade of Morelia life, I’ve only seen a few instances where parents who could afford otherwise sent their progeny to public schools:: 1. The child managed to get him- or herself kicked out enough private schools already, and the parents wanted the child to get a taste of public school. By the next year, the child was always back in a private school.: 2. The public school had a special offering uniquely suited to the child – like the Bellas Artes school or one for serious disabilities.: 3. The Birkenstock-shod, tofu-munching kind who live off the fat of the land, viewing their children’s education as yet another experiment – or they lived in a remote area where the only alternative was the public school. That usually fails, unless the parents were superhuman kinds who made an over-and-beyond effort to supplement their children’s education at home. : Public schools in Mexico aren’t the equivalent of public schools in the U.S. They are bare-bones, suffer a high student-teacher ratio, and are an effort to deliver product to the broadest range of students at the least expense. Unless a parent is very, very integrated into Mexican culture and very committed to compensating for public education’s deficiencies, it would be unwise to submit a child to public schools.: Private schools in Mexico aren’t bastions of elite education. There’s a broad range of private schools and educational philosophies. Parents make sacrifices here for their children’s education. My plumber sends his sons to a private prepa, and so does my taco vendor. I know American parents who’ve taught at private schools for less than a pittance, just so that their children qualify for employees’ tuition waivers. : Yes, it costs. The price tag for private education in Mexico is still less than what you’d pay in the U.S.

John in DF

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

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Private Schools Cost?

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We pay about 3,700 pesos a month for a good private elementary school. Some are more expensive, many less. Few people who could go private go public, that I know. That's a personal statement, but it is based on 11 years living in the Mexican capital, where the public schools should be pretty good. And if I went back to the U.S., I'd probably enroll my son in a public school there. Mexico's primary-secondary school system probably pushes students forward academically more quickly than does the U.S. system (at least where the curriculum is followed).

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #6 of 22 (1675 views)

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Along with some sound advice and information on this thread, I feel there are some sweeping generalizations in some of the posts regarding adolescent second language acquisition as well as the system or systems of education in Mexico. Keep in mind that each child is an individual, that there are many factors to consider, and that learning environments vary greatly from school to school.

John T

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #7 of 22 (1675 views)

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Private Schools Cost?

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If you don't mind... Is this a Spanish, English, or Bilingual school?

John R

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #8 of 22 (1676 views)

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It's "bilingual," which means they have a better than average English teacher but all of the other classes are in Spanish.

visitor

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #9 of 22 (1675 views)

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Most kids at 12 will learn Spanish very fast just by hanging out with local kids. If average, in a month or two, he will be almost fluent. If he is faster than normal, he may well understand most things in two weeks or less.I once met a retired government official, a compadre of a member of my family. His job had been helping assign foreign students to correct grades. He told me (and this angers a lot of North Americans) that most grade school students must be set back a year when they move to Mexico.
I knew a man from a rich family. When he was a kid, he attended a bilingual school, and came to the States each summer to special camps. He agreed with the retired man, except he said this was when they were still in general education. His experience was when they get to college and specialize, the North American students soar ahead, though he had no idea why this was.

Georgia

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #10 of 22 (1675 views)

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US system approach v. SA system approach

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My children have attended school in the US and in South America (Ecuador and Colombia). In South America the material they covered was more advanced at every level. However, the teaching methodology was, in great part, memorization and rote. The students were not encouraged, as they are in many US schools, to discover the answer themselves or to express their opinion or question the rule. So, while the students are inputting a great deal of information, they are not learning how to problem solve. When they get to more independent study at the university level, this seems to hamper them. American students think more "outside the box" if they haven't been stifled along the way. There are plusses and minuses to each system, I think. It would be interesting to see an integration of the two approaches, if that were possible.: Most kids at 12 will learn Spanish very fast just by hanging out with local kids. If average, in a month or two, he will be almost fluent. If he is faster than normal, he may well understand most things in two weeks or less.: I once met a retired government official, a compadre of a member of my family. His job had been helping assign foreign students to correct grades. He told me (and this angers a lot of North Americans) that most grade school students must be set back a year when they move to Mexico.:
: I knew a man from a rich family. When he was a kid, he attended a bilingual school, and came to the States each summer to special camps. He agreed with the retired man, except he said this was when they were still in general education. His experience was when they get to college and specialize, the North American students soar ahead, though he had no idea why this was.

donna/puebla

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #11 of 22 (1676 views)

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As is my son's case - his spanish language skills are hampered by the fact that all his amigos speak perfect english (plus german and french in some instances) and LOVE having the opportunity to practice and impress us! So, picking up the language isn't quite as easy for some children as one would love to believe.

Liz

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #12 of 22 (1674 views)

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I saw that other places too

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Swiss kids were pushed more when I was there, although not until about 3rd grade. I saw this all over Europe where Americans did very well on college level. I think part of it is waiting until the kids are older to push large volumes of information and more free time to just be kids. That is no longer the case in the US and I wonder if we will lose our advantage. It reminds me of my favorite Einstein quote, "Creativity is mroe important than knowledge." I found working in the US vs Switzerland that Americans are very creative. I have also found the Mexicans to be quite creative and I wonder if there will be more innovation here in the future. There is some very interesting research on delaying school. "Better Late than Early" by Dr. Raymond Moore is a good book on this subject. I think issues like this go way beyond grade level and are important factors in choosing a school you like for yoru kids. I talked to an English teacher here who did a teaching exchange with the US. She said she found American students rude and a bit aggresive, but was frustrated with the total doclity of her Mexican students. Mexican children are extremely polite and encouraged not to challenge adults. We chose a Waldorf school for its encouragement of creativity. We each need to think out these issues and decide what is important to us. I homeschooled in the states and saw everything from total unschooling to highly regimented homeschooling. All the methods worked, but not for every family.

Liz

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

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Our experience so far

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One of our primary reasons for choosing Guanajuato was the existence of a Waldorf school here. My kids were homeschooled in the US but I cannot provide them wiht Spanish immersion or cultural immersion at home. For us public schools in the US or MX were not an option. People who like public schools in the US ar emore likely to like them here as they have a socialist/colectivist political bent. If it doesn't bother you at home it won't here either. I did not go the collegio route as a prefer a more relaxed approach. Waldorf schools emphasize art, music and physical education (but not sports much) as highly as the academic subjects. It has a very different emphasis from teh colegios which ar emore like college prep schools. I figured my husband and I are intense enough that the kids don't need to get it at shcool too. All my kids are also late bloomers.Some people really like the public education here. As at home neighborhood is everything. Schools in this city cost $2,000 American per year when you add up fees and everything. This is for grade school.Anything you could want is available somewhere in Mexico. If you are not wedded to one location you should be able to find something you like.

John T

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #14 of 22 (1676 views)

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I don't discourage easily :)

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Actually this has been quite informative... I think what I need to do is assess my son's ability to learn another language as there seems to be a huge difference in both opinion and experience in this area.These colegios sound quite rigorous academically which is what he'd probably need being from a high ability background. I was under the impression that perhaps the English speaking private schools were academically more challenging (generally) than the Spanish speaking private schools. Apparently that isn't the case. Is my original assumption correct that Spanish only private schools are less expensive than their English only or bi-lingual counterparts?

John T

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #15 of 22 (1675 views)

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Our experience so far

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Wow these Colegios sound rather daunting. I'm not familiar with the Mexican educational system... are these private spanish speaking schools? at what grade levels? As for your neighborhood is everything comment. I assumed that anyone with even middle class $$ sent their kids to private schools?
Are there public schools that rival private schools down there?As you say I'm not married to any particular locale... I am really just looking for a change of pace and for a chance for my son to fully experience a different culture. I think I'd be happy (geographically speaking) anywhere that I can pick up Laker games via satellite and connect to the internet :)

Liz

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

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I hope we did not discourage you

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I think the Colegios are fine, just have your son placed by ability rather than age. I think being held back can be a very good thing for kids. My friends who have the kids in the Colegio here love it. I did not know that Colegios referred to private schools. In my town here in MX we refer to one provate school as "The Colegio and the other by its name, Villa Educare. If you prefer a more laid back type of education you may want to look into alternative schools like Waldorf and Montessori. I cannot really speak for the public schools, but I hear there are good ones. As I said before it depends on your priorities. I do not know of anyone who can afford private schools and does not use them. This does not mean they don't exist.

donna/puebla

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

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Our experience so far

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John....let me clear up the colegio, escuela comment I made earlier. As explained to me; colegios are any schools that charge tuition (whether there be an emphasis in religion, bi-lingual studies, science and math, arts, etc). Escuelas are the public, non-fee, schools (offering similar programs).I can't emphasize enough that sweeping generalizations will boil down to misinformation. My son is receiving a superior education here to his public education; however, we didn't have the privilege of sending our son to private school in the states, which would be a more fair comparison(?). Just as you're experiencing many levels of quality in the LA school system - know that in any given city in Mexico, you'll must likely have similar experiences.I believe you are right in that, anyone that can possibly afford to send their children to colegios, do so, especially in the higher grades. Some of my son's amigos have shared that extended family (aunts, uncles, older sibblings, etc) help to fund their tuition costs. Education for many families is a priority and a privilege (an attitude, admittedly, we'd taken for granted until moving here).We found no escuela here in Puebla with a bilingual curriculum, so I've absolutely no experience to compare escuelas to colegios. And, let me just say, that even though our son is attending a bilingual school, very few of the staff speak english; once a month, when paying tuition, I get a small taste of how daunting my children's daily experiences must be (we moved to Mexico with no spanish skills): I'm so impressed with my kids! Sounds like you're doing your 'homework'...no doubt you'll make an informed decision regarding your son's best interests. Despite some emotional and social learning curves, my children are very contented and are loving their new hometown and culture - no doubt, your son will, too.donnaPS - we have an older daughter attending college in the states. Our oldest is at a NC state college, whereby our HS senior will follow next fall. I don't know if this would apply or matter to you...but in order for our children to qualify for in-state tuition, we had to retain a residency in-state; food for thought.

Liz

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #18 of 22 (1675 views)

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I couldn't say

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Our town does not have bilingual schools. They do take English classes every week.

donna/puebla

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

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Private Schools Cost?

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Hi John...moved not too long ago with "children" ages 17 and 14. First...it's impossible to speak generally of the education system in Mexico for colegios (private schools) as well as escuelas (public schools) vary widely in costs and standards from city to city and state to state.I'll be glad to share our first hand experiences so far, but know that our example is neither typical nor unusual - it's our story, and will most likely differ greatly from anyone else’s. After visiting many schools, we chose a bilingual english/spanish colegio for our children. Our son entered secondaria (grades 7-9) mid-march, and being only an average student, he struggled with the pace and the curriculum offered. The curriculum at this particular colegio is much farther along than our son's NC public education (no surpise there!). Long story short...due to struggles with the advanced studies and difficulties with spanish language skills we're opting to retain our son in 8th grade again this year. ~ I share this story for there are MANY more considerations besides cost of the school that should be considered.What sort of student is your son? Colegios attract students (and parents) serious about acquiring a good education (and they're paying dearly for their priorities). Most often the students are self-motivated, focused, and high achievers bound for the best universities.Is your son social? How well do you think he'll acclimate to his new culture and experiences? Is he willing to learn a new language and social skills?What sort of extra curricular activities does your son enjoy? Are school team sports a priority?How long will you be living in Mexico? Will there be a possibility of returning to your home country before his high school education completion? (Complications!)....As in the case of our daughter, completing her senior year of HS here; she'll not be receiving a diploma upon graduation (a real pain in the fanny for college admissions but workable).Does it matter that your son will not be receiving any sort of history or education concerning his home country? That he'll not be taught or have any frame of reference for how his government operates, but will instead be well versed (and will most likely identify more closely with) his host country's government and politics? Are you prepared and open-minded enough to have on your hands a TCK (a third culture kid) - a child that will most likely NOT have your same morals, priorities, sense of reference?As for costs....again....varies greatly - but, actuals in our case:
One time New Student Fee (American Dollars) - $300.00
Inscription Fee (re-inscription fee)pd yrly - $1000.00
Monthly tuition fee (secondaria) - $363.00
There are also trip fees and incidentals not included These issues have cropped up since our son's transfer. Maybe they'll be helpful in determining what's best for your son. But the very best thing you could do is arrange a trip to your city of choice and arrange interviews with particular schools. There are also a few books I could recommend concerning the emotional and sociological issues of expatriating with children.Best! donna

John T

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #20 of 22 (1676 views)

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Thanks for the thoughtful reply Donna.I guess I should mention that we are Mexican-Americans, currently living in the LA area. Our neighborhood (practically a Mexican village) is at least 90% Latino and I'd guess 80%+ speak Spanish only or are bilingual, so the adjustment (outside school at least) won't be all that dramatic, even though as I mentioned before my son is not fluent in Spanish. My son is a gifted student enrolled in a very demanding "high ability" middle school, but as we're pretty set on moving out of the area (crime, pollution, overcrowding, etc.) it's almost a given that he's going to take a step down academically. If, for instance, I were to place him in a typical public school here in the US he would most likely have to skip a grade, which would create its own set of social problems. So I'm thinking that the demands of learning a new language might even the playing field so to speak. Unless of course Mexican schools are in fact superior to our schools, in which case it may be too much for him. I am not too concerned with his learning about history from a different perspective. I find that much of what he learns in this area usually needs to be unlearned so that he can learn what "really happened". Of course I would supplement his English language skills with some type of home-schooling as needed. Team sports haven't been an issue yet but he does enjoy track and basketball.As for how long we'd be there... probably at least until high school, and perhaps beyond, depending primarily (again) on the educational opportunities that exist and how much we enjoy living there.John

Rose-Line Brasset

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #21 of 22 (1682 views)

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Our experience so far

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Hi Liz,I just read your message in the forum. I'm french canadian (living in Quebec city), so i don't really speak and write well english (sorry!) but i would like to have some more informations, please. I would like to move in Guanajuato with my 2 children (4 and 9 years
old). You spoke in the forum about waldorf shool. My children speak french. Is this school bilingual? My son speak english a litle and i would like he can remember his
english howeaver we live in a spanish country. I would like to know how much we have to pay to go to the Waldorf school and if its a bilingual school. What kind of shool is it. Is it a
elementary school for young children? They have a Internet "site"?Please give me an answer if you could at roselinebrasset@hotmail.com
Amistad y muchas graciasRose-Line BrassetRose-Line Brasset
: One of our primary reasons for choosing Guanajuato was the existence of a Waldorf school here. My kids were homeschooled in the US but I cannot provide them wiht Spanish immersion or cultural immersion at home. For us public schools in the US or MX were not an option. People who like public schools in the US ar emore likely to like them here as they have a socialist/colectivist political bent. If it doesn't bother you at home it won't here either. I did not go the collegio route as a prefer a more relaxed approach. Waldorf schools emphasize art, music and physical education (but not sports much) as highly as the academic subjects. It has a very different emphasis from teh colegios which ar emore like college prep schools. I figured my husband and I are intense enough that the kids don't need to get it at shcool too. All my kids are also late bloomers.: Some people really like the public education here. As at home neighborhood is everything. Schools in this city cost $2,000 American per year when you add up fees and everything. This is for grade school.: Anything you could want is available somewhere in Mexico. If you are not wedded to one location you should be able to find something you like.

gentlesurvivalist

May 26, 2003, 10:02 PM

Post #22 of 22 (1642 views)

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Re: [John T] Private Schools Cost?

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Dear John, I have two links to bilingual schools on my web page on the fer right side. One is called P.V. school and the other Mex Amer ED. The address is:
http://www.infowest.com/business/g/gentle/mexiconaturally.html
Laura Martin Buhler AKA
The Gentle Survivalist

Visit our Mexico links at:

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En paz y La Luz, Laura