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oringo

Oct 11, 2010, 4:48 PM

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More than meets the eyes

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Man, this forum is the best. I get more insghts by digging the posts than by being there. Laughing all the way through.
Salute to each and every posters.

I've been wandering around every webs and traveling S America and Mexico looking for a place to rest until I leave to another world but dismayed of all the superficial and dangling talks of webs and blogs which are mostly looking for supplemental incomes by linking to realtors or promoting their publications. It is not that I am a nit-picking perfectionist who wants to know every detail before taking off but I have a tremendous challenge to persuade my better half to make a move. On the contrary, I didn't calculate the probabilty of survival when I volunteered for Vietnam and beat the odds and am still alive now. Just GO is my blood type but I don't want to hear 'I told you so' again any more.

My father never had health insurance and seen a doctor but lived until 85 and I think I inherited same gene. But my wife is taking varitey of cocktail of prescription medication which is a major huddle to jusify the move. The depression developed after her menopause would make her life miserable without medication and regular visit to psychiatrist. But without speaking fluent Spanish it seems unfeasible to see a Spanish speaking psychiatrist. It is not a disease you can diagnos with MRI or cat scan.

I couldn't find any post related with any subjet of psychiatrist. Anyone has thought?

I rather die early than living in Sun City in the first world.

Rolly

Oct 11, 2010, 5:05 PM

Post #2 of 21 (4632 views)

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Re: [oringo] More than meets the eyes

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I couldn't find any post related with any subject of psychiatrist. Anyone has thought?

Maybe it is that living in México clears one's head enough that further intervention is not required.
Did that for me. Smile

Rolly

E-visit me http://Rollybrook.com
On Facebook as Rolly Brook

Peter

Oct 11, 2010, 7:33 PM

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Re: [Rolly] More than meets the eyes

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Maybe it is that living in México clears one's head enough that further intervention is not required.
Did that for me.

I agree, for many things here the way it is done makes more sense. Even if it is not better it still makes more sense. A couple examples include meal times and types, and general rules of the road.

Drivers here are more cooperative and pay more attention to the road, most of them, with most intersections uncontrolled - basically going one-and-one. US drivers will risk life and limb of themselves and their passengers to ensure they take their "right-of-way", and mostly driving while watching their rearview mirror watching for police following behind them looking for half-inch fouls and 3 mph over the limit.

You're right, it clears the head.

Maesonna

Oct 11, 2010, 7:48 PM

Post #4 of 21 (4594 views)

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Re: [oringo] More than meets the eyes

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You would probably have to settle in or near a major city, but with some searching, you can find English-speaking psychiatrists.

oringo

Oct 12, 2010, 1:17 AM

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Re: [Rolly] More than meets the eyes

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Ahhh, yes.
That is what I am hoping for. As a matter of fact she kicked me out of the master bedroom 8 years ago because I snore badly to exacerbate her insomnia and I have substituted her with a female poodle. But when we stayed in mexico I was the one couldn't sleep because she snored loud. I have never seen her snoring for 30 years except that. She doesn't believe that but honestly god it was true. Seriously I have that hope in my mind.

But even it will be the sure possibility, it might be better having a good English speaking psychiatrist near-by as a contingency. Just for the sake of placibo effect. So could I ask you be more specific about your experience without offending your privacy? Are you implying that chronic depression had been cured by living in less stressful environment (Mexico)?

If that is the case it will be my turn to kick her out of the mater bedroom and she has to accompany with our old male chihuahua. My poodle is very young and attractive.

Depression is as bad as terminal cancer. My grief.

(This post was edited by oringo on Oct 12, 2010, 1:55 AM)

Sunnyvmx

Oct 12, 2010, 3:51 AM

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Re: [oringo] More than meets the eyes

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I left my depression at the border, but he still comes to visit now and then and for a few weeks we have a great time. We both sleep with schnauzers and I know we both snore.

Seriously, when I left Miami at 30, I could actually feel the stress leave my body and I hadn't realized the weight of it until it was gone. Thirty years later, I realized it was back and I refused to live out the remainder of my days struggling with it. This time it would require leaving the country and I rejoice with the same uplifting feeling I get now when I leave the U.S. for my home here in MX.

The manana attitude here seeps into your blood and it's a healthy remedy for the stress induced ailments many suffer. The "change of life" your wife has experienced may benefit from another change of life, but Mexico isn't for everyone. To be happy here may require a certain freedom of spirit and strong ties to family, friends and lifestyle sometimes prohibit one from enjoying the simple carefree life that Mexico has to offer. Sometimes it's just what the doctor should have prescribed.

http://dementias-daughter.com

bfwpdx

Oct 12, 2010, 6:00 AM

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Re: [oringo] More than meets the eyes

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I suffer from depression, not chronic but recurring. In my case, it is very strongly affected by seasonal affective disorder. The first winter we spent in Mexico I was depression-free for the entire time. Same the next winter. Then last winter, we had a bad month or so with lashing rain and about 12C temperatures. To add to that our vertical driveway became a quagmire and we were house bound for about a week. To my great interest (I am a social scientist and enjoy analyzing myself :-), I realized that I was intensely depressed. As soon as the skies cleared and I could live outside on the terrace again, the depression lifted.

I do agree with the others. Depending on the nature of your wife's depression, there is a good chance the climate and the lower level of stress/anxiety will handle the depression.

Best of luck,
Barbara

hunteradvisor

Oct 12, 2010, 6:19 AM

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Re: [oringo] More than meets the eyes

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I have been commuting to our home in a small village on the mainland of Mexico for 5 years. Shortly after arrival in Mexico I feel my stress, anxiety and tension begin to ease and then dissipate completely within a week. On the contrary, upon return to the US I barely make it out of customs before the contagious condition of my fellow Americans begins to impact my mental/emotional outlook. I fondy refer to life in Mexico as returning to my protective bubble. I hope for the same for your wife.
Isabel
www.RanchoSolyMar.com

Gringal

Oct 12, 2010, 8:30 AM

Post #9 of 21 (4479 views)

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Re: [oringo] More than meets the eyes

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You haven't said what your wife's reaction is to a change of scene, or what your family situation is re kids, grandkids and other close ties to your present location may be. These factors are very important and are often the reason why expats who otherwise like it here, move back to the states.

Seasonal Affective Disorder (SAD) is not uncommon, but is this a factor in your wife's depression? Her psychiatrist should know.

If you can persuade her to take a few weeks to travel around the various parts of Mexico ....just to check it out, with no commitment....who knows? It might lift her spirits and she may actively want to move here.

I've been living in the Lake Chapala area and have found that you can find just about anything you need within an hours' drive to Guadalajara. This would include psychiatrists, since a large and respected medical school is located there. Before that, I lived in San Miguel de Allende and most services could be found either there or in nearby Queretaro.

On the other hand, if being told "I told you so" is something you can't deal with.......maybe your dreams and hers will never tally. When my husband suggested the move to Mexico over six years ago, I balked. That's when we made a deal: if either of us didn't like it after a year........we'd go back with no arguments. Well, here I still am, and glad of it. lol.

oringo

Oct 12, 2010, 1:37 PM

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Re: [Gringal] More than meets the eyes

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Thank you very much, ladies.
When it comes to compassion for other fellow human being, women are remarkably superior to other species and this thread distinctively shows that. Having said that I admit that I, the knuckle head, am the main cause of her depression and malfunction of her neurotransmitter. Since no one in her family tree had committed suicide or suffered depression at all. Any women who put up with me for that long years may develop mental chaos at 99 % of probability with margin of error +- 2 %.
We are both from broken and torn apart family with poverty and have deep emotional scars carrying until now. I was rebellious and revengeful with full of angers. As we are product of environment my rebellious mind resulted in me pursuing purpose driven life to achieve whatever until drop dead attitude with series of wreckage and clashes and ended up nothing. During all that course of wreckage she has to clean up all the debris while sobbing inside. This will be the sufficient reason to trigger the malfunction in her chemistry.

Being rebellious and anti-social attitude, I am out spoken and will tell what my problem is to whomever I can borrow their ears loud and clear, but she is very out-going social character but she keeps anything and everything to herself. If she found out I am talking our problem on this forum I will be kicked out of house without recourse. Similar background but entirely two different personality.

Her depression was preceded by back pain. Back pain brought up insomnia and then two combination caused depression. Now all these tie the knot together, depression cause back pain which triggers insomnia.
It goes circling around depends on what day she sees the psychiatrist. My diagnosis is my bone head attitude cause insomnia to trigger the depression. But who knows.

Being revengeful and optimist despite of numerous wreckages I get no discouragement or depression, and I realized I have lived someone’s life, not mine. Goal and achieve for what? Is that what I truly wanted? HELL NO! My dream for life since high school and on is ’Get Lost”. I wanted to wandering around in the forest and jungle with animals and streams and mountains, who cares who knows where I am. Oh man, I still have the dream but my joint, hip, leg, eye sights…..all start breaking down.
We are typical blue collar, middle class if you euphemize, having a house one grown up child living in NY, trying to catch up the bills, nothing fancy, working toward end. Paying mortgage 20 years, borrowing no penny from equity, making no investment except 401K, paying credit card all every month and never late for any bill payment, now we are under the serious debt. The algebra I learned is not right. If you keep adding honestly there has to be sum certain of result. I should have gone to Ivy League like those guys got millions dollars of bonus to learn the weird algebra to understand this strange logic. Who stole my money?

Hell with this. That’s it. I ain’t gonna spend my rest of life doing this for someone to steal again. Now it is time to live my life before my body’s total disintegration. Not only that it will get rid of her insomnia, anxiety, depression, hopefully back pain together. Hell with the first world stuff. Sick and tired of Made in China stuff anyway. I have no remorse, no resent, no anti-US, anger just I want to get my life back.
With fully recharged and refreshed endeavor I cordially and sincerely presented my philosophical view and new way of life like born again death row convicts to my honorable better half one night. BANG BANG GRRRRRRRRRR. Papers flew everywhere beating desk she declared “I AM NOT GOING TO LIVE IN THE THIRLD WORLD’.
Skip all the strife in between.
We’ve been together long enough. Now we are at last stage life. We both have only one life to live. If we can come up with new way of life satisfying both desire, it might as well better pursuit each individual path for our final chance. I spoke and she sobbed.

Her anxiety keeps bugging her how she can survive at old age if she outlives me. What about I die in Mexico where she should go? She wants to make more money until collapse in order to be ready for the final stage of life. That is the definition of the rest of her life.

Tentative compromise:
I am retiring within a year and be a bum with no job.
She will continue to work until collapse while taking Lortab, Ambien, Effexor, Cymbalta, Provogil, Omeprazol, Xanax and Electronic Implant for back-pain.
In the mean time we travel Mexico on and off.
We’ve been to S America and Mexico once.

Epilogue
Childhood memory stays entire life and steers our direction whether it is positive or negative. I realized that most expats who steady-fastly settle new life and adopt new culture with happiness have rich soul and openness may be coming from having higher education and less strained developmental stage of life. If she has some desire for purpose except safe living, like art, music, pottery, anthropology, or whatever she has.

I really envy most of you, especially couple.
I am not making a movie drama or paperback novel. This is serious concern for our marriage and homework to solve.
Thanks reading boring soap drama.
Jon

RickS

Oct 12, 2010, 1:44 PM

Post #11 of 21 (4410 views)

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Re: [oringo] More than meets the eyes

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Gringal responded that one could find about anything including psychiatrists in Guadalajara which is 'just up the road' from Lake Chapala. What she could have added is that there are both psychiatrists and psychotherapists right in Ajijic on the shores of Lake Chapala. And since they are 'English speaking transplants' to the area, there would be no language barrier to overcome (as would probably be the case with at least some of the Mexican professionals in Guadalajara itself!).

I agree with another poster's recommendation to visit Lakeside for a bit. That way one could check out the medical care available for themselves AND check out the potential that living in that paradise could eliminate all but the most occasional need to visit one of them.

P.S. Most of the U.S. population would agree with your wife's proclamation that 'I don't want to live in a Third World'. And 99.9% of them have that viewpoint based on absolutely NO DATA.... just uninformed opinions. 20 years ago I was the same. Then I checked it out. Wrong! Living around Lake Chapala (and some other spots in Mexico as well) and with easy access to Gualalajara one can have the best of both worlds.

(This post was edited by RickS on Oct 12, 2010, 2:05 PM)

chinagringo

Oct 12, 2010, 3:15 PM

Post #12 of 21 (4370 views)

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While I will probably be accused of "raining on the positive parade"; there is a reality check that might be necessary. Through the years of following this and other forums, myself and I would guess others have observed people thinking about a move SOB that profess "excess baggage" that makes one question if their move will end in success. Some of these people have something as simple as a carry on bag that needs emptying, while others may be toting a steamer trunk of issues. This can be one half of a couple or it may be both. We have all seen examples where the issues combined with a somewhat unfamiliar lifestyle change have evolved in dramatic results ranging from a rapid run back NOB or an atomic blast to a marriage. The problem is that there is no "one size fits all" result since each of us is different and has different reactions.

Just expressing an alternate reality check!
Regards,
Neil
Albuquerque, NM

Gringal

Oct 12, 2010, 3:27 PM

Post #13 of 21 (4365 views)

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Re: [RickS] More than meets the eyes

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Rick is right that a variety of medical practitioners are right here.

People who move out of the U.S. have an enormous variety of choices in life styles. There is "Mexican village life" where no English is spoken in town. This appeals to some. There are also places like the Lake Chapala area which have all the comforts of "home" and more. Oringo needs to do some in-depth looking. I'd suggest he look at the Lake Chapala Society website for some information re activities, as a start.

In my opinion, the man's wife has some very serious problems if she's taking all the drugs he listed. From the sound of his posts, I think that Job One is getting some marriage counseling. Until he and his wife are headed in the same general direction in their retirement goals, it doesn't matter where they choose to live. Assuming that they have a sufficient income to live without working in their retirement, they can live a very comfortable life in any number of places.

So, oringo........first things first, si? The members of this board can give all sorts of practical information re life in Mexico, but that won't solve your basic relationship problem.

Good luck and here's wishing you both well.

richmx2

Oct 12, 2010, 6:22 PM

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Clinical depression is not unknown in Mexico, nor is the treatment all that different than anywhere else in North America. If it is talk therapy that your wife requires, of course she would want her doctor to understand her. Calling around to psychiatrists (look in the yellow pages) should find you the nearest English-speaking doc... and won't be found only in one community.

I just had to assist a newcomer here (here being Mazatlán) who does have clinical depression, and was also not dealing with the stress of the change from the U.S. to Mexico, but... as Rolly said... the change is good overall, and seems to be working its own kind of therapy. The person I have been helping move said the only thing that bothers him is the particular psychiatrist he consulted is more drug-therapy oriented, and that's not what he wants. One recommendation he passes on is to speak up about one's expectations. Medical treatment is more proactive in general, and the patient -- no matter what the complaint -- is expected to take an active part in their own therapy, and provide the doctor with feedback.

http://mexfiles.net
http://voiceofmexico.com
http://editorialmazatlan.com

cristalhombre

Oct 14, 2010, 8:50 PM

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Have you considered Iran as an alternate location.

Lots of sand and sunshine, a bit warm at times, unique cultural experience, wonderful Middle Eastern food options, beautiful woman, you'll never have to shave again (I like that idea!)......

According to President Ahmadinejad.......... Iran has NO mental health issues! NO psychosis, NO depression, ZIP schizophrenia ............ even homosexuality is non-existent!

BAD NEWS Oringo.......... You could easily be imprisoned for LIFE due to snoring.

Second thought.......keep searching! Buena suerte amigo!

"NOT ALL WHO WANDER ARE LOST...."

Hound Dog

Oct 15, 2010, 7:43 AM

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Re: [cristalhombre] More than meets the eyes

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"wonderful Middle Eastern food options"

Are you serious or trying to amuse us cristalhombre? You truly equate Persian food with "middle east food options"? While Dawg is quite fond of "middle eastern food", Iranian cuisine is among the finest on the planet and transcends anything you dismiss farcically as "middle eastern". Iranian cuisine is perhaps the finest and most sophisticated on the planet. The fundamentals of great cooking were born there a thousand years before Euriope crawled out of barbarity. If Mexico, with its raw, unrefined and unsophisticated grub, had any cuisine even remotely as fine and sophisticated as Persian cuisine then Dawg, who has lived in Mexico for ten years now, would be living in a true paradise without fault. Iran is a country of unique historical interest, incredible natural beauty and can truly lay claim to being a cradle of humanity. Iran is a birthplace of humanity advanced culturally beyond anything Europe could have even imagined as far back as memory takes us and then some.

It happens that religious fundamentalists and jingos have gained a foothold in Iran of short and passing duration. If any of you think that the squirrely Islamist fundamentalists who now superficially control or seem to control Iran represent that cradle of humanity then you are hopelessly naive. Let me ask you if you think that should the right wing imbeciles, now on a roll, temporarily gain power in the United States, that would signal the U.S. permanent descent into hell? These things come and go as do we all.

All that having been said, I respect you enough to presume you were trying to be funny.

(This post was edited by Hound Dog on Oct 15, 2010, 7:49 AM)

Gringal

Oct 15, 2010, 8:24 AM

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Re: [Hound Dog] More than meets the eyes

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Now Dawg.........you know he wasn't serious, and anyone with a little knowledge of world culture knows that Iran had a high level of civilization when Europeans were in the Dark Ages. Hopefully, their own dark age will end soon. I hate to even consider that our own mother country could have such an episode.

The sad thing is, our OP clearly has a very serious personal problem, with nothing funny about it. I've encountered more than one couple who might as well call it quits, but who hang in there anyway for the sake of whatever they believe in, or for whatever reasons they feel justify going on with it.

Those of us who have the pleasure of spending our declining years with someone with whom we can enjoy the adventure of living.....should just thank our lucky stars. Daily. Bring him or her flowers, smiles and delicious dishes.

Hound Dog

Oct 15, 2010, 8:58 AM

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Re: [Gringal] More than meets the eyes

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Hopefully, their own dark age will end soon. I hate to even consider that our own mother country could have such an episode

But Gringal; we did have such an episode and only a few moments ago. That is why Dawg has no problem envisioning a recurrence of that descent into hell based upon current events and political trends. The fine and civilized South Alabama of Dawg´s youth became the tortured, uncivil Kluxer Kingdom of the 1950s and 60s with the best of the community´s leaders, both black and white, hiding in their antebellum mansions, comfortable middle-class homes, rural haciendas and urban estates while the low-class Kluxer riff-raff burned crosses and churches and bombed homes and conducted unreported intimidation and slaughters of innocents along roadsides and tyrannized an entire lawfully designated underclass of folks simply because their ancestors hailed from Africa. Don´t wait for that episode to occur in the U.S. - it already has and it could occur again.

Look at that Arizona law that precludes racial profiling in determining who among us will be required to show papers establishing legitimacy as we conduct ourselves upon public thoroughfares taking care of ordinary everyday business Well, think of this. Dawg was at INM in Guadalajara yesterday applying for his inmigrado status and the Mexican clerk automatically assumed I was a foreigner inept at communicating in Spanish simply because of the way I appeared physically to her. When I arrived at the front of the line, she snapped at me, "Go to (English speaking) information" without so much as an inquiry as to whether or not I spoke Spanish. Imagine racial profiling - allowed or not - in Arizona. Been there, done that.

It´s not so hard to establish ghettos once you have identified their likely inhabitants.

(This post was edited by Hound Dog on Oct 15, 2010, 9:00 AM)

Gringal

Oct 15, 2010, 9:35 AM

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Re: [Hound Dog] More than meets the eyes

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No question that there have been dark times and places in U.S. history, and we could have a lively and, unfortunately, waaaay off topic discussion on the subject. The dreaded lock may yet descend.

It is my hope that level headedness prevails in the mother country and over the rest of the globe. It seems that hard times brings out the madness in mankind. The era of "love" and increased tolerance coincided with the good times rolling. And other rollings.

Hound Dog

Oct 15, 2010, 2:43 PM

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Re: [Gringal] More than meets the eyes

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The dreaded lock may yet descend.

If the "lock" descends, it is wielded by a jackanape of low aspiration.

DavidMcL

Oct 15, 2010, 4:56 PM

Post #21 of 21 (3885 views)

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Re: [Hound Dog] More than meets the eyes

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The jackanape is looming - back to Mexican subject matter folks.
David McL
WebJefe