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TedZar

Dec 13, 2010, 6:55 PM

Post #1 of 29 (4565 views)

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Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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I am an America currently living in a developing country (not Mexico) and I earn my living working online via the internet. I pay my taxes to Uncle Sam as my money shows up in my account(s) in the USA. Essentially, I am self-employed.

Unfortunately, what I am doing is considered illegal where I am currently living and I would prefer to live/work somewhere that would allow me to do so legally [ EDIT NOTE: what I am doing is not illegal - not having legal working papers is the illegal part]. The country where I am now would require a local partner that would own a minimum of 51% and all the associated hassles of basically giving your business away to someone else . . .

Is it possible for me to be legal in Mexico? And - or - is such work pretty much ignored if you keep a fairly low profile and don't take a work away from anyone?

Ideas - suggestions - references and links - welcome.

Thanks!

TZ

(This post was edited by TedZar on Dec 13, 2010, 10:06 PM)

chicois8

Dec 13, 2010, 8:21 PM

Post #2 of 29 (4532 views)

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Re: [TedZar] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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Just stop playing online poker...........

TedZar

Dec 13, 2010, 8:59 PM

Post #3 of 29 (4526 views)

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Re: [chicois8] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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Good guess! But not. I own and operate about 50 websites in several different niches.
They earn me a good income - which I need. Helps with food, rent, etc.

To clarify a bit, what I am doing for my self-employment is NOT illegal in any country. The fact that I am self-employed without a work permit and appropriate visa IS illegal.

More help, please!

TZ

(This post was edited by TedZar on Dec 13, 2010, 9:02 PM)

La Isla

Dec 13, 2010, 10:06 PM

Post #4 of 29 (4516 views)

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Re: [TedZar] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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Hi. I am a semi-retired self-employed English teacher living in Mexico City. I have an FM3, a residence visa, which in my case allows me to work independently. I have no idea if you would be able to get one that would allow you to legally pursue the running of your website empire. You would have to come to Mexico and have a chat with the lovely folks at the INM (Instituto Nacional de Migración) office in the city or town where you decide to move to. If your situation is especially complicated, it would be wise to obtain the services of a reputable immigration lawyer, which is what I did when I arrived here 3 years ago.

Good luck!

TedZar

Dec 13, 2010, 10:10 PM

Post #5 of 29 (4512 views)

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Re: [La Isla] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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You wrote:

Quote

which in my case allows me to work independently.

Is that an unusual feature of an FM3 - or does everyone who has an FM3 have the legal right to work independently?

Also, if I may ask, were the services of such an attorney expensive? Is it particularly easy or difficult to find a reputable attorney?

Thank you!

TZ

(This post was edited by TedZar on Dec 13, 2010, 10:12 PM)

Anonimo

Dec 14, 2010, 4:14 AM

Post #6 of 29 (4495 views)

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Re: [TedZar] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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Quote

Is that an unusual feature of an FM3 - or does everyone who has an FM3 have the legal right to work independently?

No, you must apply for permission to engage in lucrative activities. But whether Internet based work requires such permission in Mexico, I don't really know. But I doubt it. I'm sure someone more knowledgeable tham me can enlighten us.

Saludos,
Anonimo

gpkgto

Dec 14, 2010, 8:05 AM

Post #7 of 29 (4464 views)

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Re: [TedZar] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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Legal services vary in cost depending on where you want to live--DF, beach resorts and Americanadian enclaves have the highest costs.

You would not be the first person to work illegally in Mexico on a non-working FM3 (there is a new name for this visa now). A problem is more likely to arise if you earn money IN Mexico--which you do not.

La Isla

Dec 14, 2010, 8:31 AM

Post #8 of 29 (4451 views)

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Re: [TedZar] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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As Anonimo has written in his post, you have to apply for permission to work on an FM3. My experience is just with English teaching. Some work for schools, which makes it easier to be approved, since the school will support your application, even if it won't pay for it. Others (like me) choose to work independently, which can make the process slightly more difficult, which is why I chose to go through a lawyer. I know nothing about being approved to do your kind of work, which is why I suggested using a good lawyer who specializes in immigration. I found mine through the recommendations of a friend, which is always the best way to find one, especially in Mexico. As I recall, I paid around $4000 (pesos, not dollars!) for his services plus, of course, I had to cough up all the fees INM asks for.

Gringal

Dec 14, 2010, 9:17 AM

Post #9 of 29 (4437 views)

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Re: [TedZar] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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I don't mean to be unhelpful, but asking this kind of question and relying on the answers in an internet forum is an unreliable way to go and could get you headed in a very wrong direction.

I know only that there are special types of visas for those working or self-employed in Mexico.

My advice: Bite the money bullet and go to an immigration lawyer.

Reefhound

Dec 14, 2010, 9:26 AM

Post #10 of 29 (4434 views)

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Re: [TedZar] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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I can't speak to the legality of doing work solely by internet or what would happen if you were caught but it would seem like the chances of you being caught are slim to none as long as you keep quiet about it and don't tell anyone what you are doing.

Let me ask you this - if you apply for permission and get denied, are you going to do it anyway? Seems your odds of getting caught and getting the book thrown at you might be higher then.

mazbook1

Dec 14, 2010, 12:42 PM

Post #11 of 29 (4395 views)

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Re: [Reefhound] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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I must (reluctantly) more-or-less agree with Reefhound. The reality is that as long as ALL your income comes from NON-MEXICAN sources and is deposited in U.S. banks, before YOU transfer living funds to yourself in México, you are completely legal in México residing here with an FM3 visa with the category "rentista". Also, you are legal to do the same here with the six-month FMM (used to be called the FMT) tourist visa.

Over the years I have known many folks who did this sort of work while residing in México and could name ones today doing it full-time. Data-entry, programming, website design and on and on. All legal activities AS LONG AS you receive absolutely no payments originating in México, as you would not be able to furnish them a LEGAL receipt (factura). Payments made by residents in México to your U.S. accounts by way of a foreign credit card, don't count as payments from México, and don't require that you furnish the payee with a factura.

Some might say that this is breaking the intent of the Mexican Law, but I feel it is a perfectly legal way of doing business. I DO NOT do any business here in México in this manner, and I do give LEGAL facturas when necessary, and I do think that everyone else should pay ALL the Mexican taxes they legitimately owe, but working outside México via the Internet just isn't something that enters into my business (even though I take orders via the Internet), as I am shipping actual goods purchased to buyers in México and from México to other countries.

There are many VERY dubious methods available to foreigners for avoiding Mexican taxes, but they ARE illegal (even though common). Your situation is a perfectly legal work-around.

(This post was edited by mazbook1 on Dec 14, 2010, 12:45 PM)

La Isla

Dec 14, 2010, 1:19 PM

Post #12 of 29 (4385 views)

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Re: [mazbook1] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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I agree with mazbook and Reefhound that most likely you could do your internet-based work here and not get into trouble. However, you would have to show proof of income (not sure what it is at this time, maybe $1200 US a month) to get an FM3 rentista.

TedZar

Dec 14, 2010, 1:40 PM

Post #13 of 29 (4378 views)

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Re: [La Isla] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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Thanks to all for your help. This is just exploratory and I am several thousand miles away from Mexico - so I appreciate the opinions and assistance.

TZ

Pelu

Dec 17, 2010, 1:02 PM

Post #14 of 29 (4236 views)

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Re: [TedZar] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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The sites I've read say that technically you should have a work permit but this rule seems to be unevenly enforced.

I also own an online business that deposits money into US accounts and for which I pay US tax. I'm hoping to get an appointment with a Mexican financial advisor in the next week or two to ask about the potential impact of establishing residency in MX. If I get good answers I'll post them here.

TedZar

Dec 17, 2010, 3:10 PM

Post #15 of 29 (4212 views)

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Re: [Pelu] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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Thank you! That would be super helpful.

It seems like there is a whole new category of worker like us who don't fit into the standard boxes of definitions.

TedZar

Jun 7, 2011, 5:29 PM

Post #16 of 29 (1889 views)

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Re: [Pelu] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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Quote

I also own an online business that deposits money into US accounts and for which I pay US tax. I'm hoping to get an appointment with a Mexican financial advisor in the next week or two to ask about the potential impact of establishing residency in MX. If I get good answers I'll post them here.

Pelu, I am curious if you would mind letting us know how that appointment went?

Mexico is becoming a much more likely as the immigration requirements where we are now are becoming increasingly burdensome and family in the States seems to be getting older and older . . .

TedZar

Jun 7, 2011, 5:39 PM

Post #17 of 29 (1889 views)

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Re: [La Isla] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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La Isla wrote:

Quote

However, you would have to show proof of income (not sure what it is at this time, maybe $1200 US a month) to get an FM3 rentista.

I know that the visa categories have recently changed, but I am curious how one "shows proof of income"? Would one just need to document regular incoming deposits to your Mexican bank?

(This post was edited by TedZar on Jun 7, 2011, 5:40 PM)

La Isla

Jun 7, 2011, 6:11 PM

Post #18 of 29 (1861 views)

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Re: [TedZar] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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In Reply To

La Isla wrote:

Quote

However, you would have to show proof of income (not sure what it is at this time, maybe $1200 US a month) to get an FM3 rentista.

I know that the visa categories have recently changed, but I am curious how one "shows proof of income"? Would one just need to document regular incoming deposits to your Mexican bank?

I've never done this because I'm still working, but I've been told that you have to show proof of receiving a regular income using bank statements when you got to Migración to apply for your visa.

TedZar

Jun 7, 2011, 6:20 PM

Post #19 of 29 (1856 views)

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Re: [La Isla] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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Thanks! That sounds easy enough.

La Isla

Jun 7, 2011, 6:38 PM

Post #20 of 29 (1845 views)

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Re: [TedZar] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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Keep in mind that each Migración office has slightly different requirements, so once you're here, you should check for details with the one you'll be dealing with.

Pelu

Jun 7, 2011, 6:51 PM

Post #21 of 29 (1840 views)

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Re: [TedZar] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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In Reply To

Unfortunately, the advisor never replied to my request for an appointment. I need to find someone else. I spent some months away from Mexico and just returned, and now this issue is near the top of my list.

At a presentation I attended aimed at expats, Mexican lawyers stressed that Mexico taxes residents on their worldwide income, just like the US does. So if you stay here long enough to be considered a tax resident (I believe it's 183 days) it seems like you would be (technically, at least) expected to pay MX tax. To pay MX tax, you need the Mexican equivalent of a Social Security number, which I believe requires a work-permitting visa.

There's a nice summary of the new visa regulations here: http://yucalandia.wordpress.com/living-in-yucatan-mexico/new-immigration-law-published-for-mexico-the-article/

There are also threads on this forum.

YucaLandia

Jun 9, 2011, 6:51 AM

Post #22 of 29 (1685 views)

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Re: [TedZar] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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In Reply To

La Isla wrote:

Quote

However, you would have to show proof of income (not sure what it is at this time, maybe $1200 US a month) to get an FM3 rentista.

I know that the visa categories have recently changed, but I am curious how one "shows proof of income"? Would one just need to document regular incoming deposits to your Mexican bank?

TedZar,
INM expects to see 3 months of the most recent bank statements showing monthly deposits of more than their monthly income requirements. From http://yucalandia.wordpress.com/...xico-fmm-fm2-or-fm3/:
"This could be 3 months of bank or investment account statements, with your name on them, showing balances equivalent to 250 times (FM3) or 400 times (FM2) the official minimum wage in Yucatan ( $56.7 pesos/day for Zone C). SALARIOS MINIMOS This translates to 2011 minimum monthly income requirements (deposits or returns) for a single person: FM3 = $14,175 pesos & FM2 = $22,680 pesos. At current $11.80 MXN/USD exchange rates, it converts to $1,200 USD per month for an FM3, and $1,920 USD per month for an FM2."
steve
-

-
Read-on MacDuff
E-visit at http://yucalandia.wordpress.com/

surebought

Jun 9, 2011, 1:57 PM

Post #23 of 29 (1628 views)

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Re: [YucaLandia] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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I work online too. I live in Mexico and mail everything off once a week in the states by remote control. I finished with immigration in Mexico from my previous job and the only thing they require me to do is if I change residents I have to give them the new address. They don't care what I do for a living. Since the server is in Mexico. Since my return address is in the US. Nobody really knows where I am. They can't find out either unless you tell them. We have very lackadaisical Immigration enforcement where I am. I'll tell you where I am with a private reply if you're interested. They are almost pro business here. They want people with brains and ambition to counter the heavy drinker gringo community. Encouraging that crowd was a mistake. They want internet people. You could even stay off the grid here and nobody would care. And even if they catch you, all you have to do is get the FM3 or its new equivalent. They won't throw you out. The weather is almost perfect. No hot as hell summers and no snow in the winter. They told me they want a better class of people from up north and they are coming. My answer was younger high tech types and the message got through.

TedZar

Jun 9, 2011, 5:36 PM

Post #24 of 29 (1589 views)

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Re: [YucaLandia] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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YucaLandia wrote:

Quote

INM expects to see 3 months of the most recent bank statements showing monthly deposits of more than their monthly income requirements.

Thanks for the help. I think no problem just demonstrating incoming bank deposits at the required level.

Is that demonstration at that income level sufficient only for me - or will it cover me - and my spouse? Or do I need to double it to cover both of us?

Rolly

Jun 9, 2011, 5:40 PM

Post #25 of 29 (1587 views)

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Re: [TedZar] Can I Legally be Self-employed in Mexico? Or - how to do this . . . ?

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Not double for your spouse, just 50% more for each dependent.

Rolly Pirate

E-visit me http://Rollybrook.com
On Facebook as Rolly Brook

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