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cfscott

Oct 1, 2013, 12:50 PM

Post #1 of 18 (341 views)

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Where to buy voltage regulator in Chapala area

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Already have a surge protector, which just shuts off electricity. Need voltage regulator to level out power. Just moved here from US. Any help would be most appreciated.



sparks


Oct 1, 2013, 2:09 PM

Post #2 of 18 (330 views)

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Re: [cfscott] Where to buy voltage regulator in Chapala area

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Think I bought mine at Walmart. A metal box about 5x3x2 for around 300 pesos. people use them for fridges and small appliances. If for a computer, get a real UPS

Sparks Mexico - Sparks Costalegre


YucaLandia


Oct 1, 2013, 2:29 PM

Post #3 of 18 (324 views)

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Re: [sparks] Where to buy voltage regulator in Chapala area

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Modern UPSs** are not good for protecting computers or regulating voltage, because they have very low ratings for handling voltage swings, and most modern UPSs do nothing for reducing high voltage. UPSs are designed for battery backup when the power goes out. A voltage regulator or power conditioner really is the best choice to protect a computer from the common problems with CFE power. Do you have a Chederaui or Office Depot in the area? They each carry decent quality voltage regulators. Expect to spend at least $500 pesos for a decent regulator.

**10 year old (and older) UPSs that have a large constant voltage transformer coil do provide damping of voltage fluctuations, but the USPs that cost less than $200 USD, sold for the past 7 years offer very little protection from CFE's problems.
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Read-on MacDuff
E-visit at http://yucalandia.com

(This post was edited by YucaLandia on Oct 1, 2013, 2:34 PM)


cfscott

Oct 1, 2013, 2:58 PM

Post #4 of 18 (316 views)

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Re: [YucaLandia] Where to buy voltage regulator in Chapala area

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Thanks for responding! I need to clarify my question a bit. Actually, this is for our camper electricity needs of 30 amps. The electrical power hooked to our camper is classified as 30 amps, but fluctuates in the amount of power delivered so that the hard-wired surge protector shuts off the power several times during the night, therefore, we need some type of voltage regulator that will adjust the power automatically, higher or lower, coming into the camper to keep the surge protector from doing its thing.


DavidHF

Oct 1, 2013, 3:15 PM

Post #5 of 18 (308 views)

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Re: [cfscott] Where to buy voltage regulator in Chapala area

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That will require a bigger unit than we use for protecting small appliances. I't go to Tio Sam or an electrical supply store.


YucaLandia


Oct 1, 2013, 4:26 PM

Post #6 of 18 (300 views)

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Re: [cfscott] Where to buy voltage regulator in Chapala area

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Good idea to get the right sized regulator.

Ideal Conditions: 30 Amps x 110V = 3,300 watts of out of phase loads, like starting big motors etc. This is like running 2 large electric water heaters simultaneously or running 2 large airconditioners simultaneously, or operating a very large airconditioner and a big hair dryer at the same time, or running a big air conditioner and a big 1600W microwave oven simultaneously.

Typical Conditions: A US 30 amp circuit is typically over-designed by a factor of 2, which means your typical maximum amperage usage is 15A. This works out to needing a 1,500w - 2,000 watt regulator for typical household smaller loads.

These figures are confirmed by the wattages advised for big campers = 3000 W to be able to run multiple large loads simultaneously.

Do you expect to need to run 2 big loads simultaneously? e.g. Running a big 1600W microwave oven and a big air conditioner simultaneously. If so, then shoot for a 3000W regulator.

If not, typical household usages work fine with a 1500W - 2000W regulator. e.g. Computers use 25 -200 watts. Camper interior light usage typically does not exceed 300 watts. Even big electric refrigerators use only 75 - 150 watts. Even large 40+" TVs use about 200W.

If you add up all your wattage used simultaneously, you can determine just how big a regulator you need.
Happy Trails,
steve
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Read-on MacDuff
E-visit at http://yucalandia.com


joaquinx


Oct 1, 2013, 5:03 PM

Post #7 of 18 (294 views)

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Where to buy voltage regulator in Chapala area

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I have never used any of the devices mentioned and for 14 years I never had problems. I've had a few power failures and recovered with all devices working. Now, all my electronics, including my laptop, and appliances are Mexican bought. I use surge protectors, but no regulators or UPSs. Am I in risk of an upcoming problem or just not being over-cautious.
_______
My desire to be well-informed is currently at odds with my desire to remain sane.


johanson


Oct 1, 2013, 7:27 PM

Post #8 of 18 (282 views)

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Re: [joaquinx] Where to buy voltage regulator in Chapala area

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I too, have had very few problems with or without voltage regulators. Many of the voltage regulators are really step up, step down, or do nothing systems. And that is often OK. Sadly several years ago, the neighborhood transformer was set so high that one would see as high as 143 volts early in the morning when there was a minimum load and the voltage the highest (Fed. regulations state 127 +/- 10%) and anything higher than 139.7 is too high.

Now as I said above, because of how electricity is used and because of the capacity of the system the voltage can vary a great deal by the time of day. After I complained, the inspectors would come out during the afternoon when there was high usage, of course the voltage was lower, about 135. So they said to me that it was OK. It was within 10% of 127 volts therefore legal. I said come back in the early morning say 3 AM and check and you will see illegally high voltages regularly over 141 Volts. They simply shrugged their shoulders and said but it's OK now when they checked. It went on and on and after 3 complaints, I went to a friend at www.esunenergy.com and barrowed a software program and voltage meter that ran 24/7 and allowed me to printout the voltage by the minute in chart form.

It confirmed that what I had reported was correct and I went again to CFE, this time with by the minute documentation and my press card (I used to write an article called Tech Talk for the Guadalajara Reporter).

To make a long story short the neighborhood transformer was stepped down two steps bringing in an average voltage to a community that perhaps needed an additional transformer, and a year or two later a second transformer was added to our neighborhood, near my home and now my voltage is almost always 127 volts +/- about 2% not the allowed 10%.

My point? I have had a voltage regulator plugged in 24/7 for maybe 5 years. I would highly recommend that you too check your line voltage and see if it gets dangerously too high or too low, and so, do something about it.

Remember that many of the more economical voltage regulators are either step-up, step-down or do nothing transformers. It would appear that the amount of the step-up or step-down is about 8 or 9 %, So if your voltage is only 10% over 127 volts which is 139.7 volts and the maximum voltage allowed and your voltage regulator only drops the voltage by 8 or 9%, you are still getting between a little more than to close to 127-9 volts. Now that's a lot better, but not ideal for many electronic items.

Now that my line voltage almost never reaches 129.5 my cheap voltage regulators drop the voltage to slightly less than 120 volts.

What should you do? Well always check your line voltage, and then check with someone knowledgeable to learn what is a safe voltage for those items attached thereto and make corrections when possible and/or necessary.

Oh, one more point. Right now, my and many other neighborhoods close by have great electricity close to the standard here in Mexico of 127 volts. Yet just six miles away are several communities where there are many problems. So for your own good, regularly check out your line voltage. Also remember to check out the line voltage on each of your probably two or perhaps as many as 3 phases. What? Don't understand. Find someone who does.

Good luck.


playaboy

Oct 2, 2013, 6:03 AM

Post #9 of 18 (246 views)

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Re: [YucaLandia] Where to buy voltage regulator in Chapala area

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I just bought a UPS at the local walmart. It has a built in voltage regulator with a digital readout. It was the middle tiered unit and not expensive.

Most regulators will not work correctly unless you have a well grounded circuit


YucaLandia


Oct 2, 2013, 7:18 AM

Post #10 of 18 (232 views)

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Re: [playaboy] Where to buy voltage regulator in Chapala area

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What is the UPS's rating for surge suppression ? Typical modern UPSs offer surge suppression (e.g. 250 mJoules) that is too small to protect a computer from common CFE problems (like a tree branch grounding out a line during a storm). EE guys say that computers typically need a minimum of 400 mJoules of energy absorption protection, and conservative folks shoot for 600 - 1000 mJoules of protection.

This is why the surge suppression offered on a $10 power strip is not adequate to protect computers. Similarly, UPSs costing less than about $200 USD offer surge suppression that is like having a flimsy auto seat-belt made of thin cotton string: It offers a little protection, but when its really needed, it won't do the job.

When considering voltage regulators, the simple more "modern" step up and step down models that Johansen describes often do not do the job. Instead, for CFE's problems, look at models with fairly big constant voltage transformers. These models do generate a bit of heat and use more power than the cooler digital models, but the constant voltage transformers (coil based technology) are very effective at damping out surges and spikes, and they regulate voltages from 105V - 145V back to around 120V. This is one area where "old school" devices actually work better than the latest digital technology (for less than $200-$250 USD) on CFE problems for voltage regulation and protection.
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Read-on MacDuff
E-visit at http://yucalandia.com


playaboy

Oct 2, 2013, 8:38 AM

Post #11 of 18 (219 views)

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Re: [YucaLandia] Where to buy voltage regulator in Chapala area

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I am not sure but when I get home I will look at the box and let you know.


joaquinx


Oct 2, 2013, 8:40 AM

Post #12 of 18 (219 views)

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Where to buy voltage regulator in Chapala area

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The manual for my Daewoo refrigerator has two different models mentioned. One is the Mexican model rated at 127VAC and an export model rated at 120VAC. What makes this interesting to me is that a few people I know that moved here from NOB and brought electric appliances had problems with them. It seemed that the appliances broke down or refused to run after a few months. Could this be attributed to the voltage differences? Appliances rated for 120VAC simply can't be run on Mexican electric power. If so, then bringing NOB appliances would not be recommended unless connected to a voltage regulator.
_______
My desire to be well-informed is currently at odds with my desire to remain sane.


suds

Oct 2, 2013, 9:12 AM

Post #13 of 18 (209 views)

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Re: [cfscott] Where to buy voltage regulator in Chapala area

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 Got a heavy duty voltage regulator at the electronics repair and sales store on Maderos just south of the bus station in Chapala for around $700p. It really does what it's supposed to do.


mazbeach

Oct 2, 2013, 12:36 PM

Post #14 of 18 (183 views)

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Re: [playaboy] Where to buy voltage regulator in Chapala area

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You will also need a ground for any surge suppression. You can plug it in without having an established ground, but it won't do anything just when you need it.


YucaLandia


Oct 2, 2013, 12:54 PM

Post #15 of 18 (181 views)

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Re: [mazbeach] Where to buy voltage regulator in Chapala area

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The large coil constant voltage transformer style voltage regulators do not need a separate safety ground to provide surge suppression. The inductance of the coil and surrounding EMF fields resist rapid changes - because the fields collapse to backfill voltage drops and the fields resist rapid expansion by voltage spikes. The normal ground provided by CFE's neutral wire is sufficient.

Safety grounds are useful, but not necessary for many things. If you disagree, think of how many things that have only 2 pronged plugs - shavers, cell phone chargers, lamps, TVs, fans, stereos, older fridges, etc. Adding your own earth ground can actually cause unexpected problems. Our goofy CFE power's neutral wire ran 3V - 8V above earth ground for 7 year's. I installed an earth ground without tying it to the CFE neutral, and proceeded to burn-up 3 different electrical devices - since these devices were designed for the safety/earth ground to be in common (tied) with the neutral. Too funny... I try to improve things to "Canadian standards" and "US standards", and wound up unintentionally burning out 3 things. All three of the things had internal filtering RC circuits bridging the safety and earth grounds - and were not designed for constant voltage differences. Moral of the story: If you add an earth ground to your home, and the neighborhood's CFE neutral is not completely grounded, it can cause some things to burn up. Alternately, to avoid burning things up, you can tie your home-made earth ground to the CFE neutral, but then your earth ground becomes the ultimate ground for all your neighbors on that transformer's legs. After 7 years of a slightly floating neutral, CFE finally installed a new heavy copper ground cable and copper ground at the base of our transformer's power pole, and we've gotten both a good ground and more steady voltage since then.
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Read-on MacDuff
E-visit at http://yucalandia.com

(This post was edited by YucaLandia on Oct 2, 2013, 1:10 PM)


mazbeach

Oct 2, 2013, 1:08 PM

Post #16 of 18 (178 views)

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Re: [YucaLandia] Where to buy voltage regulator in Chapala area

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However, surge suppression does need a ground for the shunt. As far as a grounded neutral goes, too many neutrals around here are in fact back fed and can't be counted on, especially in older houses.


YucaLandia


Oct 2, 2013, 1:36 PM

Post #17 of 18 (170 views)

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Re: [mazbeach] Where to buy voltage regulator in Chapala area

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very very true.
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Read-on MacDuff
E-visit at http://yucalandia.com


playaboy

Oct 4, 2013, 10:05 AM

Post #18 of 18 (71 views)

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Re: [YucaLandia] Where to buy voltage regulator in Chapala area

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In Reply To
What is the UPS's rating for surge suppression ? Typical modern UPSs offer surge suppression (e.g. 250 mJoules) that is too small to protect a computer from common CFE problems (like a tree branch grounding out a line during a storm). EE guys say that computers typically need a minimum of 400 mJoules of energy absorption protection, and conservative folks shoot for 600 - 1000 mJoules of protection.

This is why the surge suppression offered on a $10 power strip is not adequate to protect computers. Similarly, UPSs costing less than about $200 USD offer surge suppression that is like having a flimsy auto seat-belt made of thin cotton string: It offers a little protection, but when its really needed, it won't do the job.

When considering voltage regulators, the simple more "modern" step up and step down models that Johansen describes often do not do the job. Instead, for CFE's problems, look at models with fairly big constant voltage transformers. These models do generate a bit of heat and use more power than the cooler digital models, but the constant voltage transformers (coil based technology) are very effective at damping out surges and spikes, and they regulate voltages from 105V - 145V back to around 120V. This is one area where "old school" devices actually work better than the latest digital technology (for less than $200-$250 USD) on CFE problems for voltage regulation and protection.


My UPS is a ti-power tec750. Here is there link. http://www.ti-power.com/ This is the mid-grade model. It steps down 20V. They sell them at Wal-Mart lakeside. So far so good.

I have very high voltage where I live. The wiring in my place is typical 1950's Mexican, lamp wire and terrible. My voltage fluctuates tremendously depending what get's turned on.
 
 
 
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