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gpkgto

May 21, 2009, 9:08 AM

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Prices almost never listed

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Does anyone have an answer for this: Why are prices (almost) never listed when a Mexican wants to sell something, whether it is a house, a car or a used TV? Also, rents are never listed on rentals. What's with that?

bournemouth

May 21, 2009, 9:17 AM

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We asked a Mexican friend that question once and his answer was that the price depended on who was asking.

gpkgto

May 21, 2009, 12:55 PM

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I always thought that was the obvious answer--especially in gringo areas where the "gringo tax" plays a part. I don't think that is the real reason, though. My Mexican friends never have an answer for this--they just shrug.

Judy in Ags

May 21, 2009, 1:16 PM

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It's also true in many stores, such as hardware stores, etc. It's enough to drive an American crazy. We bought all our plumbing, etc. to build our house from Limsa (I don't know if this is a big chain, but they have several stores here). We established a good relationship with them, but John kept warning them that one day Home Depot would come to Aguascalientes and many people would prefer that type of set up. Now Home Depot is here and I don't know how much effect they have had on Limsa, but we are buying there for my brother-in-law's house. They give the contractor's discount, so that's a big help.

Marlene

May 21, 2009, 7:07 PM

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It depends on many factors, especially in a seasonal tourist area like I live in, especially when it comes to rentals. Summer and long term are cheaper than winter, short term so no point in publishing the price and putting people off when a deal can probably be negotiated.

Ustlach

Jun 3, 2009, 12:49 PM

Post #6 of 30 (4119 views)

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I bet it does have something to do with who is asking.

However, the longer I live here the more I realize that most of the problems, the things that irk us (the expats), the things that create all the chaos and confusion and danger are related to the fact that Mexicans are re-active and not pro-active about virtually everything.

What often seems like rudeness and inconsiderate behavior, a lack of respect for other people, even dangerous driving habits, or poor quality workmanship all stem from a lack of upbringing and education in manners, foresight, and anticipating and avoiding problems.

Mexicans never deal with a problem until it is really biting them on the butts. They disturb the peace because they do not think ahead, or think about the effect their ill behavior has on others. They endanger the lives of friends, family, neighbors, and virtually anyone who shares the road with them.

Putting prices on things would be tantamount to efficient behavior and thoughtful consideration of the client or customer, and that kind of forethought and pro-active behavior is simply not valued here, barely known or recognized.

It is like living with 100 million 13 year olds, all thinking only of themselves without a care or any consideration for others.

Rolly

Jun 3, 2009, 1:15 PM

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I think I must live in a different México than Ustlach.

Rolly Pirate

E-visit me http://Rollybrook.com
On Facebook as Rolly Brook

(This post was edited by Rolly on Jun 3, 2009, 1:16 PM)

La Isla

Jun 3, 2009, 4:01 PM

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I'm with you, Rolly. Methinks that Ustlach's general unhappiness with finding himself living in Mexico has soured his view of what Mexicans are like.

HhowieE

Jun 3, 2009, 6:31 PM

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I must chime in, even though rarely do I consider my opinion as valued as those with more experience.
My limited exposure, 3 years, belies most if not all of the comments.
I love my life here, the people our the reason I stay.
Ron

mevale

Jun 3, 2009, 10:11 PM

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They disturb the peace because they do not think ahead, or think about the effect their ill behavior has on others. They endanger the lives of friends, family, neighbors, and virtually anyone who shares the road with them.

Yeah, ask any Iraqi.

Marlene

Jun 4, 2009, 5:04 AM

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Quote

What often seems like rudeness and inconsiderate behavior, a lack of respect for other people, even dangerous driving habits, or poor quality workmanship all stem from a lack of upbringing and education in manners, foresight, and anticipating and avoiding problems.

There are BIG differences between your culture and the Mexican culture, but that doesn't make one inferior to the other. In my everyday life here in Mexico, I have ample opportunity to observe rudeness and inconsiderate behavior being displayed by those who are not Mexicans. Mexicans do notice (yes, even anticipate) what they consider to be odd or rude behavior displayed by some of those from a different culture, AND they do possess good manners; the good manners not to mention it.

The idea of pricing items or not pricing them is a cultural thing, not a conspiracy.

Moisheh

Jun 4, 2009, 5:26 AM

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Ustlach's comments may be extreme but underneath his dislike for the people there is some truth. Mexicans rarley consider that everything you do has consequences, 6 young children riding in the back of an old pickup will lead to an accident. Passing on the sidewalk will likely kill a pedestrian. Playing loud music all night will piss people off. I often wonder if it has to do with the unpbringing of the kids. Do parents explain any of these things to their kids?? Fortunately these "raised in the wilderness by wolves" people are in the minority.

Moisheh

jerezano

Jun 4, 2009, 8:21 AM

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Hello all,

Getting back to the question first asked: >>Why are prices (almost) never listed when a Mexican wants to sell something, whether it is a house, a car or a used TV? Also, rents are never listed on rentals. What's with that?

My observation after 20 years here in México is that Mexicans are used to negotiating. Bargaining on the smaller things (even food items), negotiating on the larger things like a house. So they always prefer to have the interested party offer a price first so they can negotiate from there. The seller then proposes what he/she would like to accept based on that offered price, and yes, that price is dependent upon who is asking. Whether Mexican or foreign doesn't even enter into the negotiation. What does enter is how affluent the buyer appears to be. A rich Mexican will be asked a much higher price than a poor Mexican or a poor indian or a poor negro or a poor mestizo or a hippie gringo. And since gringos (sometimes even hippies) are alway perceived to be rich, the seller always asks a higher price from a gringo. Race doesn't enter into the negotiation, but money or perceived money does.

So when bargaining I usually offer about half of what I am willing to pay. The return price then determines whether we continue or simply that I walk off. If the seller wants to continue he/she will then stop me.

As for rental or sales prices never being listed that is incorrect. Twenty years ago that was true, but nowadays about 1/3 to maybe 1/2 of the sales and rentals advertised are now listed with prices. Non advertised offerings are not usually priced.

Does all this seem to be a reasonable answer to the question?

jerezano

tashby

Jun 4, 2009, 8:24 AM

Post #14 of 30 (3969 views)

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Quote

The idea of pricing items or not pricing them is a cultural thing, not a conspiracy.

That's how I've always viewed it. I mean, what isn't negotiable in this country? From the cost of a house to a bundle of firewood to hiring a panga to go out fishing for the day?

As to the rest of this thread....no thanks.

EDIT: I was writing this while Jerezano posted...

(This post was edited by tashby on Jun 4, 2009, 8:26 AM)

joaquinx

Jun 4, 2009, 1:15 PM

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In Reply To

Getting back to the question first asked: >>Why are prices (almost) never listed when a Mexican wants to sell something, whether it is a house, a car or a used TV? Also, rents are never listed on rentals. What's with that?

That is odd. Perhaps it depends on which part of Mexico you live. Here in Veracruz, the newspaper, at least, posts prices of rentals, property, used cars, and appliances. Certainly, if it is a sign on the side of the house, it won't have a price nor on a car. On a car, I usually see a "$" sign and a telephone number.

I did ask a person who had a house for sale and his prices was at least twice or more than the real value. I can't bargain with these people as I feel that they won't settle for a fair price. After three years, that very house is still for sale.

gpkgto

Jun 4, 2009, 2:58 PM

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At least in some cases you must be right--there is some negotiation espected. But I think that the lack of a price discourages people from even calling or asking the price--especially when the listing is in a newspaper. This is "illogical" if that makes any sense here. I have found that Mexican people do not think the same way gringos do (this is true of almost every culture/country, of course). This is not an issue of "right" and "wrong"--just "different".

The info re: Vercruz is interesting--maybe this custom varies around Mexico. That is true of lots of things, of course--it is a very diverse country.

La Isla

Jun 4, 2009, 4:37 PM

Post #17 of 30 (3893 views)

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In Reply To

At least in some cases you must be right--there is some negotiation espected. But I think that the lack of a price discourages people from even calling or asking the price--especially when the listing is in a newspaper. ...

Back home in the States, if a newspaper ad for an apartment has no rent listed, I assume that this means that if you have to ask, you can't afford it! But this may be a culturally-determined reaction on my part.

joaquinx

Jun 4, 2009, 7:20 PM

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If there is a price listed, perhaps the reader might feel that the item is out of their price range and not call. If the price is not listed and the reader likes the description and/or location, they might call and enter into a negotiation for the apartment, car, or whatever. I, myself, prefer prices, but that is because my Spanish isn't quite good enough to negotiate over the telephone.

richmx2

Jun 5, 2009, 1:55 PM

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How is this a Mexican thing? Just for grins, I looked at apartment listings in Paris (France, not Texas) and didn't see any prices listed either. In the Geneva, New York, "Finger Lakes Times" only one of the houses listed for sale included price (and it was a trailer). I could go on, but, having matured beyond the anal-retentive stage of babyhood, I learned a long time ago that having my purely self-referential needs met is not going to get me very far in this world.

http://mexfiles.net
http://voiceofmexico.com
http://editorialmazatlan.com

(This post was edited by richmx2 on Jun 5, 2009, 1:57 PM)

gpkgto

Jun 6, 2009, 6:48 AM

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I am beginning to remember why I left Mexico Connect a few years ago.

geri

Jun 6, 2009, 7:10 AM

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It's a Mexican thing because this is a forum about Mexico.

When talking with Mexicans who have rentals, I suggest to them that they would get more response if they included the price and they thank me for that suggestion and immediately add a price. Doesn't seem to be a problem to them, more of a puzzlement. Why does discussion of cultural differences stir up defensiveness? Most househunters have monetary considerations and having an idea of the price saves maybe a dozen or so dead-end phone calls or inquiries. You can help your Mexican friends increase the effectiveness of their ad if they understand this, especially if they are targeting expatriates. You are being helpful, not criticizing their moral/cultural standards.

Merry Born

Jun 6, 2009, 9:07 AM

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We Mexicans often do not list prices because we want to see who is asking first. You look rich, you get a higher price. We think we make more money that way, and sometimes we do. And it applies to Mexicans too, not just you Gringos. Rich or rich-looking Mexicans hear a higher price too.

Alas, what most of us do not know is that many marketing studies have shown quite clearly that things with a visible price sell quicker and more often. It is a fact unknown to most of my paisanos.

By the way, Ustlach is quite correct in everything he says. Sad but true.

(This post was edited by Merry Born on Jun 6, 2009, 9:33 AM)

Merry Born

Jun 6, 2009, 9:26 AM

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Whoops, let me back up a centimeter. Ustlach referred to our poor workmanship. I take issue with that one. I rate our workmanship quite highly. But the rest, still sad, still true.

(This post was edited by Merry Born on Jun 6, 2009, 9:34 AM)

richmx2

Jun 6, 2009, 4:16 PM

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I see this a lot, where something NOT done in Mexico is assumed to be a) inferior and b) uniquely Mexican. Neither is necessarily true. Assumption "a" is arrogant and "b" is ignorant. There may be very good reasons to list a house price (though it's not standard in many parts of the world), but I suppose there are specific reasons one might do so, assuming marketing to those foreigners who insist on seeing a price is one's goal. But to do as the poster who set off my remarks did -- going off on a tirade about cultural "immaturity" etc. simply because Mexican sellers operate pretty much the same way other people do, and not the way HE wants them to, is... well... babyish.

http://mexfiles.net
http://voiceofmexico.com
http://editorialmazatlan.com

colibri1

Jun 8, 2009, 2:10 AM

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As an artesanias shop owner in Mexico, I'm often greeted with a surprised response at having price tags on my merchandise. Conversely, there is the standard response (by Gringos) upon finding an un-tagged item, that it must be free!!! BOY, do I get sick of that one!!!

Many tags get sun-faded, worn, removed, switched, and one of our favorite theories for their disappearance is that roaches like to eat them. Now, price tags & stickers are not cheap...having to replace them may not be cost-efficient for many store owners. In my business, I may have an item for a few years and not think about the replacement value, or even IF it can be found again. This can lead to selling that item too cheaply..(of course, these are always the items that retain their tags) ¡ Puros problemas!

So, you see, there CAN be many practical reasons for NOT tagging your inventory.

Dos centavos with hugs to all (Ustlach seems to need one),
Colibri1

P.S. If you're ever in Puerto Penasco, Sonora....come to Old Port and visit Colecciones Colibri, where we're having a 30-50% off sale...I'm not replacing the tags, so we have to use the calcualtor, ja, ja!

In the case of a hardware store, where they have to look up the price, I think it's to avoid these problems and to avoid confusion with many very similar looking items.

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