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elcomputo

Dec 26, 2003, 7:21 PM

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High blood pressure

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Hi,

I'm almost 65. I have been in San Miguel de Allende for about 7 months. And for those 7 months I have had difficulty negotiating the hills. I run short of breath within a few steps on the mildest of grades.

As I am diabetic, the doctors had suspected an occluded artery. But two angiograms showed my heart and circulatory system to be in good working order. There are a number of possible other causes for shortness of breath on exertion (dyspnia is the technical term for that). But one that seems to have special relevance is altitude, particularly when combined with hypertension (high blood pressure), which I also have.

I have heard that there have been retirees who have come to the central Mexican plateau and have had to leave because they could not handle the altitude. On the other hand, I have also been told that one's body quickly accommodates to the altitude in a matter of days.

Has anyone had any experience with the combination of high altitude and high blood pressure, either yourself or people you know? If so, what steps were taken?

Martin

Rolly

Dec 27, 2003, 7:53 AM

Post #2 of 18 (918 views)

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Re: [elcomputo] High blood pressure

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Hi Martin,I can't answer your specific questions, but I do know that not everyone can become accustomed to high altitude. For most people 3 to 10 days is enough to adjust. But as we age, it becomes harder, and some never make a satisfactory adjustment. When I moved from the low lands of Texas to Denver to go to college, I never noticed the change in altitude, even when I went up in the mountains skiing. Now when I go into my near-by mountains (near 5,000 feet), I have a hard time -- age matters.

Rolly Pirate

E-visit me http://Rollybrook.com
On Facebook as Rolly Brook

Carol Schmidt

Dec 27, 2003, 10:58 AM

Post #3 of 18 (896 views)

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Re: [elcomputo] High blood pressure

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Not everyone does adjust, even younger healthier people. My partner recalls an incident when she was taking some kids into the mountains along with her own kids, and one boy passed out as they climbed higher and higher. He was miserable the whole week and got better as soon as they descended. The only time he got it together and could move was when the bears came! But that's another story.

Don't feel like you're a failure or something because you don't adjust in a week like "everybody" is supposed to. Your body is your body and it may be telling you something. Maybe you'll find some nice Mexican oceanside jungle area with smooth sidewalks! I never did adjust to Phoenix summers, even though millions do.

And I do wish the cobblestone irregular streets and sidewalks in San Miguel were more like Oaxaca's, even though Oaxaca's roads are just as treacherous for another reason--Oaxacan drivers don't seem to stop for pedestrians as they make their turns no matter who is standing in the street, unlike the slower, more polite drivers of San Miguel. Would I rather fall on a cobblestone and hit my head, or be run over by a car speeding around a corner as I try to cross? Tradeoffs everywhere. Even Disneyworld isn't perfect. I wish you luck finding the best combination of tradeoffs for you.

Carol Schmidt

elcomputo

Dec 27, 2003, 11:34 AM

Post #4 of 18 (894 views)

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Re: [Carol Schmidt] High blood pressure

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Carol,

I have considered moving toward the coast and a lower elevation. But my need for friends, people to talk with occasionally, is too important to me. I know by now my Spanish is never going to be good enough to ever have close friends in the Mexican community. It's unlikely I'll find any community at a lower elevation where there is a sizable gringo community, as there is here in SMA. And, as important, I cannot tolerate the combination of high heat and humidity found at lower elevations. I'm probably better off living with snow drifts.

But, with my pittance of a pension, I don't know where else I could go but Mexico. It's something that will most likely work itself out in time, and I have plenty of time to work on the problem. I'm just going to have to use taxis and buses more than I had planned.

Martin

P.S. I, too, have wondered about the cobblestones. It would require little labor or materials to surface the streets with a layer of concrete thin enough to retain the quaint effect of the stone surface but make the durned streets easier to walk (and drive) on. I doubt this idea would go over well with the government, however, especially seeing as how the treasury was so effectively looted by the last administration. (A gringo told me he lives near the ex-mayor, who is now making a sizable expansion to his house.)

(This post was edited by Rolly on Dec 27, 2003, 5:25 PM)

PeggyS

Dec 28, 2003, 1:16 AM

Post #5 of 18 (848 views)

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Re: [elcomputo] High blood pressure

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I happened to see my doctor today and asked the questions you mentioned. Do you take your blood pressure medication regularly, as prescribed? This is a Must, as you know. It has been found that taking calcium carbonate is a big help, as is having a bit of oxygen handy when needed, availablle at most pharmacies.
As far as the taxis etc are concerned, do you have a place to get together with other local gringos, as we in the Chapala-Ajijic area have with our lovely Lake Chapala Society? There must be some lovely ladies there with cars, who would be more than happy to have an educated, knowledgeable gentleman to go shopping with, or even ask for dinner. There are more than plenty of them around here!

Carron

Dec 28, 2003, 9:57 AM

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Re: [elcomputo] High blood pressure

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My darling, darling man--One of the best things about living in Mexico is that you really don't have to do anything. It's not like in the US where you must be up and doing 24/7. Stay at home, prop your feet up, and relax. You don't have to scale the highest peaks or even set foot on a cobblestone. Remember that to relax is to reduce your blood pressure. Stress is a killer. If you can afford to live here at all you can afford to relax. Try the Atkins diet; it is affordable in Mexico. The less you expect of yourself the more you will be comfortable in the Mexican lifestyle. ¡Buena suerte!

elcomputo

Dec 28, 2003, 2:03 PM

Post #7 of 18 (792 views)

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Re: [Carron] High blood pressure

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The thing is, one of the things I used to do for relaxation was go for a walk. My doctors also advised that I get this bit of exercise for the benefit of my diabetes AND high blood pressure. But it has gotten to the point where I am having difficulty even walking DOWNhill. I found that out last night walking home from a concert.

elcomputo

Dec 28, 2003, 2:10 PM

Post #8 of 18 (793 views)

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Re: [PeggyS] High blood pressure

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Yup. I take my medications like clockwork. And more and more of them by the year. I suspect my system may simply be wired to have a certain level of stress operating at the subconscious level at all times.

Isn't calcium carbonate baking powder? Do you just mix that stuff with some water?

I have no problems with transportation here. It's just that walking is about the only form of exercise I can get, and I definitely need exercise. I have been thinking that thing about the oxygen may be a good idea. I didn't realize you can buy it over-the-counter here. (I get the mental picture of that time Homer Simpson decided to climb the only mountain in Springfield and had consumed all of his oxygen bottles before going more than 50 feet.)

I've decided to talk to a Mexican doctor here about the problem next week, so maybe he can resolve it without my having to move elsewhere.

Thanks.

Carol Schmidt

Dec 28, 2003, 6:06 PM

Post #9 of 18 (772 views)

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Re: [elcomputo] High blood pressure

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Before finding SMA, Norma and I wondered a lot where we could live well and healthfully on SS. There are many other places in Mexico which are far cheaper than San Miguel, and at lower altitudes too, and not in high humidity like the jungle areas. Norma's son lives in Baja somewhere near Cabo half the year in an RV, and if he's there, it must be cheap.

We lived in a small rural area of Michigan for eight years, and that was cheap--except for the cost of propane heating in the winters! Michigan is one state which has good senior housing programs--my Dad lived in a senior complex with his wife when she was alive and it was really cheap, with shuttle service to town every day and plenty of activities, though I would have been bored silly there. Small poor towns abound all over the US, but there's not much to do in them unless you're active in a church. Still, life is what you make it, and you can build a pretty good life just about anyplace.

Don't feel trapped, there are plenty of alternatives, don't give up! You'll find your niche. And the advice to get out and meet women is probably a good idea--SMA is full of single older gringas. No "Yeah but" allowed!

Carol Schmidt, aka Dear Abby

mexigrl

Dec 28, 2003, 7:05 PM

Post #10 of 18 (761 views)

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Re: [elcomputo] High blood pressure

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Well, Dear Abby said what I was going to! I have found SMA to be one of the more expensive spots (away from the coast) in Mexico as far as living expenses (i.e. housing) go. There are other places that are at lower altitudes that might work for you if you decide to go that route. I am having bouts of dizziness and I will assume it is somewhat related to the altitude. It can really be a problem for some people.

Discuss with your doctor, try some of the options, and in the end if it really is the the altitude then look for another community that you would be happier in. Or, sit at home with the feet up - that is always a good option too :) Take taxis when you need to, perhaps go to the park or an area that is fairly flat and walk there.

Cuidate

Mexigrl

elcomputo

Dec 28, 2003, 9:56 PM

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Re: [Carol Schmidt] High blood pressure

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Re small towns in the USA. There was recently a series in the NY Times Online about the plight of the 11 Plains states in the USA. They have been losing population in their small, rural towns for the past 30 years, and there are a number of ghost towns and near-ghost towns there now where once there were thriving market centers. Many of those which still have some people living in them are populated by virtually no one other than residents of retirement homes and the people who work in those homes. Houses are going pretty cheap there, I understand, as no one is moving into those communities to purchase the houses people are leaving behind. But, as you say, towns like that would probably be the death of a city boy like me -- if one of those winters on the Plains didn't get to me first.

elcomputo

Dec 28, 2003, 10:07 PM

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Re: [Carol Schmidt] High blood pressure

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Oh, and the part about meeting women. (This is almost a topic in itself.) I really HAVE been getting out, and I bump into single women all the time. Some I even find quite attractive, and I would like to ask them out. Now, here comes the "Yeah, but..." part:

At the age of 65, I am no better at picking up on signals that someone may be flirting with me than I was at 18. I am a real dud when it comes to putting myself forward and asking a woman for a date. I do great at working up interest among women on the Net (though it's hard to arrange a date with a woman from Niagara Falls). I think this is because I am fluent with the computer keyboard (I'm a former newspaper guy and technical writer) but a real flub as a conversationalist.

But tell me this -- where do single women in SMA go to meet single men? Tell me, and I'll go there. Even if it's at the top of a hill.

elcomputo

Dec 28, 2003, 10:19 PM

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Re: [mexigrl] High blood pressure

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Well, as I say, I've built up something of a circle of friends in SMA (and I have to say I have never in my life had an easier time of doing this than I've had here!), and I would hate to leave it for the unknowns of a seemingly nice town at a lower elevation. Especially one with not much of a gringo community.

And although I know this is an expensive town, I recently had the good fortune of finding a lovely one-bedroom casita with a huge back patio for my dog. The rent is only 2300 pesos, and that includes all utilities except telephone! It is in one of the wealthiest and peaceful neighborhoods in this town, with no noise from radios or thousands of kids and no graffiti or other signs of gang activity. Believe it or not, I actually found this place advertised in Attencion.

The down side? It's in Los Arcos, which is up a steep hill from el Centro.

Your dizziness could be a product of the altitude. Every time I walk down the street, I look like either a drunk or a sailor who has just touched dry land. I have no idea whether this is due to hypertension, altitude, or maybe just old age creeping up on me.

Yes, I am going to talk to a local doctor about this. Maybe oxygen or something else will be an option. I don't expect to leave here very soon, even if I have to.

mjr234

Dec 29, 2003, 7:29 AM

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Re: [elcomputo] High blood pressure

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Dear Elcumputo: Your elevation problem may be why the Mexican National Soccer Team has not lost a game at Azteca Stadium, Mexico City in a long, long time. They are used to it, the other team - unless from Peru - is never going to be as used to it. Six of the seven Mexican cities I have visited for any length of time have an expat community that speaks English. I have regularly encountered Mexicans whose English is a hundred times better then my Spanish. Some of these are still e-mail penpals years later. Could it be that the working Mexican has enough in common with a working gringo, that there is something in common in to talk about? Could it be that this - rather than lack of a common language - is missing in the current retiree community? In Canada we have areas that are touted as retiree magnets. However, it is Canadian retirees who settle there - normally the West Coast or interior of BC. Is the SMA/Lake C situation in some way unique? Are there Mexican retirees there too? I'm more intrigued by the lack of inter-action between the local community and the "immigrant" community then altitude - as I believe you have lots of answers to altitude outside of SMA - and it is very expensive IMO. I trust all goes well for you. You may as well ask your medico for dating advice while you are there; it looks as though it could come in very useful. Have fun. Michael in Ottawa.

elcomputo

Dec 29, 2003, 2:29 PM

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Re: [mjr234] High blood pressure

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Michael,

Thanks for your response.

I suppose the altitude could explain the Mexico City team's winning streak. When the national soccer team lost to the USA in the last summer Olympics, I believe that game was played somewhere in Korea, right? I do recall that when Mexico City was the host city for the Olympics in 1968, foreign athletes showed up two weeks in advance to accustom themselves to the altitude. Visiting professional soccer teams don't have that luxury.

You are quite right about there being little common ground for conversation between the expats from the US and Canada and the Mexicans most often encountered here, mostly farmers, laborers, and skilled workers, not university graduates. And even few university graduates speak much English here, at least not in my experience. I think perhaps, when you were here, you must have placed yourself in situations where you could meet Mexicans who were fluent in English.

Most of the English spoken here is the equivalent of my survival Spanish -- just the bare minimum needed to get by. And, to tell the truth, that is probably more spoken English per capita than the amount of spoken Spanish north of the border.

As for the retiree magnets in Canada, could you direct me to some information on them? I have lived in the Pacific Northwest, along the coast, and I found the weather to be rather dreary and depressing. But the interior of BC probably has sunnier weather. And winter doesn't scare me. I've got a parka. (It's in storage.)

No, Mexican retirees don't come to SMA. As you point out, it's too expensive, and most retirees stay with their offspring at home until they die.

What has attracted gringos to SMA and Chapala? I don't know about Chapala, but SMA began attracting art students when the two big art schools here got cranked up -- I think that was in the 1930's. There was an even bigger spurt of interest after WWII, when returning vets found they could live down here AND go to art school on their GI Bill money. Many of them stayed, and the artsy community started attracting writers and other arty types. Word got out about how nice the town was, and people started retiring here, thrilled that there were other English-speaking people here already. Demand for housing drove prices up, and the place became valhalla for real estate brokers. But the place has long been a tourist attraction for gringos AND Mexicans.

Now, just out of curiosity, who crossed out the last part of your message?

mjr234

Dec 29, 2003, 3:17 PM

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Re: [elcomputo] High blood pressure

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I do not know who put the over-strokes on my e-mail. I must admit, it did not seem like the friendliest e-mail I have ever written, so perhaps they thought I had gotten heavy-handed or too personal? No insult was intended, but even my writing gets ahead of my intentions at times. I do believe, from personal experiece, that you hit the nail on the head, when you spoke of the extended Mexican family and the grandparents in the home. I do not know a lot of Mexican families, but where the children have left home for the USA or employment elsewhere, the extended family of sisters and brothers appears to restructure itself in one place, one large hacienda. So, it becomes a rare exception, perhaps very rare, that a retirement community for Mexicans has formed. [I did see army/navy veterans housing once.]

The Canadian retirement community of communities is Eliott Lake, Ontario. I say this without personal experience of the place. It was a mining community that ran out of stuff to mine [or it was too expensive or no longer needed or some such]. It was a one industry town and everyone was leaving. So at one point the houses in the town were offered for sale to outside retired people, or about to retire, as there was no local employment at very, very, very affordable prices. People sold in the high priced areas and moved to Elliott Lake - that already had, schools, roads, hospital, etc and were saving 100s of thousands in the process. Kelowna, of many forest fires this past summer, is the other likely spot.

Must run, good luck in your hunt for a solution to the altitude problem. Try something short term. I found Troncones [outside Zhiahau sp?] quite nice last February.

Michael in Ottawa

Rolly

Dec 29, 2003, 3:28 PM

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Re: [mjr234] High blood pressure

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Interesting puzzlement about the over-strokes since there is no facility for doing that with this editor. Must be the computer gods playing around again.

Rolly Pirate

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On Facebook as Rolly Brook

TomG

Jan 18, 2004, 9:14 PM

Post #18 of 18 (553 views)

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Re: [elcomputo] High blood pressure

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Dear Geezer;

I'm late to the thread.

At very little expense to your wallet and with probable benefit to your diabetes I would recommend nopales in your diet regularily. As an side benefit, I find it hard to believe that nopales would even be pumped up with any contaminating sprays. On top of all that they can be darn good. You are in good nopales country and you have to eat something anyway. They are said to have many benefits, but the diabetes one is the most pronounced, as I have read.

If you think you are having altitude problems go to a doctor's office and have your blood oxygen level checked on a meter. Maybe you can check one out for a day and walk around, put it through its paces. My wife has a little battery operated meter that is 1 1/2" x 2" and cost $400 on a Texas medical supply internet site. You shouldn't really need to own one. My wife does because of the intermitant nature of her breathing due to a neuro-muscular disease, she checks every 10-30 minutes and has ways to deal with the results. Some aviators carry them, I hear. If you are 89 (90 and up is really better) or over you are OK - 88 is the cutoff line for supplemental oxygen. There is no mention if you are ,or were, a smoker. If you are quit. Don't fool with below 88%, as actual lasting damage can occur.

Feel free to write.