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Carol Schmidt


Nov 14, 2004, 3:19 PM

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Nice LA Times article on Oaxaca

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Here's the first few grafs. You probably will have to register to get to the whole article but it's free, and there are several other Mexico articles in the same travel section.

Carol Schmidt
>SPECIAL MEXICO ISSUE To market, to market in Oaxaca A couple discovers beauty and bargains in the area's marketplaces. Rugs and intricately carved wooden animals are terrific finds.
>By Kevin Brass, Special to The Los Angeles Times http://www.latimes.com/...?coll=la-home-travel
>Every Sunday, the weavers of the Oaxaca Valley travel to the weekly market in Tlacolula to sell their handmade wool rugs.

>Working our way through crowded streets, past vendors selling freshly plucked chickens, exotic peppers and homemade mescal, my wife, Lietza, and I found the renowned artisans on a quiet side street. Booth after booth offered the distinctive rugs of red, blue and orange, colors achieved from dyes made from local roots and cactuses using formulas handed down through generations.

>A smiling teenager, Eric Chavez, proudly showed us one of his father's rugs, a bright mosaic of right angles, the patterns characteristic of the Zapotec, Meso-Americans who ruled the region centuries ago.

>"You can take a picture with my father," Chavez said, offering the local version of an authentication certificate.

>The Tlacolula market is one of several weekly tianguis, or small Indian markets, in Oaxaca state, each with its own style, crafts and charms — vibrant, flowing masses of culture and commerce. Some markets are known for weavings, others for black pottery, still others for carved wooden animals or spices.

>Oaxaca, an hour flight south of Mexico City, is distinct from other Mexican states, a product of the Sierra Madre and proud cultures that took root in the fertile valley long before the arrival of the conquistadors.....>



Gayla

Nov 15, 2004, 9:09 AM

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Re: [Carol Schmidt] Nice LA Times article on Oaxaca

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Carol, thanks for posting the link to this article. I recently returned from Oaxaca; within the last month. Not only was the guy who wrote this piece not into mini-van tours, he also, clearly IMNSHO, wasn't into to Oaxaca based on the amount of misinformation in the article.

I went to both the Friday market at Ocotlan and the Sunday market at Tlacolula. Both are very, very indigenous, more so than any of the other markets I've had the opportunity to visit in Mexico over the years. We were the only Anglo faces in Tlacolula. I probably wouldn't opt to eat at one of the fondas, nor would I chance the tejate, but there is so much more to this market than Zapotec rugs. This is where the entire local community comes to do their weekly shopping. The range and quality of the produce, breads and meats was fabulous. No matter what he or she was selling, each vendor took great pride in displaying their goods, be it a pile of criollo garlic or a hand hewn dining room table. We talked to a produce vendor whose daughters were doing their (English) school homework, we ate a wonderful sweetbread shaped like a volcano with crunchy red sugar on top, we tried chapulines. We contemplated buying cocao beans, some raw, some roasted, and we were a little upset to miss the chance to buy some of the locally grown and finely ground coffee.

I do have to say that I preferred the Friday market at Ocotlan for two reasons. First, it's less confining physcially and second, I didn't feel like such an outsider. Ocotlan is easily twice as big as Tlacolula. The produce was more diverse and better quality, even though what I saw at Tlacolula was very good quality. Families were beginning preparations for Dia de los Muertos, so there were masses of fresh flowers in every size, shape, color and variety. There was dishware galore that would hold all the offerings for the returnees. The fondas were not segregated in one area but scattered throughout the market. One fish vendor we talked to said she sells 25 kilos of fried fish every Friday, her fish being flow in from Xalapa. This market was vibrant and alive.

Both these markets are colorful, noisy, a pickpockets dream and are there to meet the needs of the local population (which they do very well), not the whims of tourists looking to score a cheap artifact.

There are actually 3 markets in the city of Oaxaca, not 2 as the article states, and I seriously disagree with the author's assessment of them. The Juarez market, also known as the 20 de Noviembre market, covers 2 city blocks. The first building houses produce and meat vendors along with vendors selling clothing, leather, liquor (mostly Mezcal), glassware, etc. This is a very clean market and I have always found the vendors here friendly and helpful, some even speak a little English. Also in the first building is a really good nieve shop. The ices are made with purified water and come in some of the most exotic flavors. The 2nd building of this market is where most of the fondas are located along with more of everything else and the bakeries. Exit the south entrances of this building and you'll find yourself on a street with several chocolate grinding factories, the aroma of chocolate wafts through the air making it hard to resist a purchase of two.

The biggest error in the article was in calling the Abastos market a Saturday market. It's there every single day of the week with Tuesday, Friday and Saturday's just being the busiest days. And it is HUGE, coving many, many acres. I totally, and completely disagree with his assessment that the market has nothing to offer. There are literally thousands of vendors in this market selling everything you can imagine (a lot like Alice's Restaurant). It is big, it is loud, some areas of it stink, it's wet in some places, alternatingly cool and hot, and a warren of rows, aisles and alleyways. You can not possible see this market in 1 or 2 hours, it can take days to discover everything it holds. But it is not a crafts market, it is the main market in the valley of Oaxaca. It's where locals come to buy what they need to run their households, it's where people from the surrounding towns and hamlets come to sell their products.

Disclaimer - I am a Mexican market/tianguis junky and can spend hours and hours in them. I also have a tendency to view them for their functionality for the local population and not for their tourist value. So maybe I'm biased ;-)

And finally (before this rant gets too long), I spent 6 days in Teotitlan de Valle. There is running water, there is electricity and the houses I saw and visited were certainly finished, in fact, beautifully so. The rug trade has been VERY, VERY good to this little town over the last 20 years. The main streets in T de V are paved. I know exactly where the author and his wife were taken and can certainly see why he may have come to that conclusion, but they never made it to the village, they never saw more than a half finished rug selling stand.

It's odd how we can visit the same places and see the same things and come to different conclusions. I saw what the author of this LA. Times article saw, but my impressions are totally different. Oaxaca is an interesting place. It's far more than colorful folkart and Zapotec rugs, although those items certainly do drive the local economy. Anyone wanting or needing a referral for an excellent guide in Oaxaca drop me a line. She's an American ex-pat whose been living in Oaxaca for nearly 35 years, married to a Mexican doctor, 4 kids. Does tours on the side, encyclopedic knowledge of Monte Alban, Mitla and Oaxaca.


Bubba

Nov 15, 2004, 4:10 PM

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Re: [Gayla] Nice LA Times article on Oaxaca

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Gayla:

Thank you for your comments. The guy who wrote the free lance article for the LA Times is clearly an idiot but I blame the Times for running this article written by an inexperienced buffoon. Not only was his analysis of Oaxaca inaccurate and without merit but his disparaging the village of Teotitlan del Valle was inexcusable. Clearly the Times should require a higher standard among its contributors.

Teotitlan is among the most prosperous and advanced indigenous communities in all of Mexico. It is reputed to be the single wealthiest in all of Oaxaca and, perhaps the entire country. The community has profited greatly from its beautiful carpets and is a large village with an advanced infrastructure including potable water from its mountain reservoir and full electrification. It is not only not a collection of huts and unfinished brick houses, it is a town blessed with an abundance of resources and with a utilitarian housing scheme and highly industrious population. It is true that is it not a particularly attractive community as its best housing is devoted to rug weaving with industrial activity integrated with living spaces and typical alters serving their diety. But there is no more practical community anywhere.

What happens here is that naive tourists, too cheap to rent a car or too stupid to know about the bus, taxi or collectivo systems, take tours sponsored by money grubbing tour bus operators who try to take them for a ride. When they are taken to what they think is Teotitlan, they are actually on the outskirts of a town which cannot even be seen over the intervening rise. They are then taken to two bit tourist rippoff joints located before the true entrance to the large village, meant to extract whatever funds they have left after a day of milking and they think they have been in Teotitlan. That's OK, screw them (a fool should be parted with his money) but why would the LA Times dignify cheap shot articles written by gullible imbeciles in its travel section on Mexico?

I intend to complain to the editors of the LA Times concerning their racist put down of these people who were here in North America and successful a thousand years before the United States ever came into being. The ancestors of these people built Monte Alban when Europeans were living in caves and their present day social order could teach the rest of us how to live together and prosper with or without electricity.

I hope you will join me in protest.

By the way, the stale and useless recommendations on where to eat and shop in Oaxaca City are also inexcusable.


Gayla

Nov 15, 2004, 6:19 PM

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Re: [Bubba] Nice LA Times article on Oaxaca

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Hey Bubba, I feel your pain. I'm right there with you in the complaint department.

Sounds as if you've spent some time in Teotitlan de Valle. I believe you are right when you say it is the most propserous village in the valley other than Oaxaca City. There are 3 separate and distinct arms to the Valley of Oaxaca and the various villages all have long standing traditional specialties. Weaving (and fiestas) just happens to be the specialty of T de V, and weaving has affords quite a bit of development. It's been very profitable for the village and there is a very good infastructure.

I also visited the market in Teotitlan, there is nothing terribly remarkable about it other than the fact it is remarkably clean - as was ALL of Teotitlan - and people went about their daily business without being bothered by a bunch of tourists.

The guy that wrote the LA Times article bitched about having to do a mandatory Mezcal stop outside of Tlacolula, yet he missed the best Mezcal in the valley, Del Maguey, which is located a few miles up the road that leads into T de V. This stuff is incredible. It's organic, single village mezcal made in the traditional method, by 5 different villages at different altitudes in the mountains. They still pit roast the pinas (heart of the maguey), crush it on grindstones powered by burros going round and round, and finally distill it in ways that would make most Revenuers proud. Once you start drinking the Del Maguey, you will never, ever go back to Tequila :-). www:http//mezcal.com is their web site, tons of information. Had he tasted the Del Maguey product, listened to Ron Cooper talk about the product and methods, he would not have been so dismissive.

Rugs for $130? A steal. I purchased an exquiste, finely woven, wall hanging from Abigail Mendoza of the well-known Mendoza weaving family and it was considerably more than $130, but it came with a handwritten letter of authenticity and it has her initials woven into it. One of the other sisters had done a weaving that was so extraordinary in detail and the fineness of the weave that was undoubtedly museum quality. The price? $70,000 pesos. I definitely don't have that kind of money to drop, but it was worth every peso and more.

His restaurant recs were pretty poor as well, and Oaxaca really is a tremendous city for food. Had I written the article I probably would have recommended:

Marco Polo - across from Llano Park, not the one on 5 de Mayo
El Che - on 5 de Mayo up by the Santo Domingo church
La Olla
Loz Danzantes
Restaurante Catedral
Restaurante Casa Oaxaca - one is in the hotel of the same name, the other is their new branch by the Santo Domingo church in the Galeria Qutezalli
El Jardin
El Asador Vasco
La Bisnaga
And the list can go on and on........................
There's also a pretty good and really fun restaurant in Zaachila called La Catedral, open air, huge, music on weekends, playground equipment for the kids, live monkeys........


Chumley

Nov 16, 2004, 8:44 AM

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Re: [Bubba] Nice LA Times article on Oaxaca

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To paraphrase a familiar saying, "Poor Mexico, so far from God, so close to the LA Times travel section." From personal experience I can state that the "professionals" at that paper are hardly that since it was purchased by the Chicago Tribune. In the rush to cut costs, there are no fact checkers, and worse, the articles now being printed on Mexico are submitted by what I would describe as "two weekers," people who travel to a place, sometimes on fam or press trips, spend a couple of weeks, and then write what they consider to be the definitive article on it. Those of us who know better would be better off ignoring that paper's travel section. While I applaud your decision to write a letter to the editor, I'm afraid that your complaint will fall on deaf ears.


RonMader


Nov 17, 2004, 1:56 AM

Post #6 of 15 (2311 views)

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Re: [Carol Schmidt] Nice LA Times article on Oaxaca

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This is what I love most about Mexico Connect -- the literate discussion and analysis.

Brainstorming ... if I had written the article for the LA Times, I would have played up the connection between the Grand Central Market in downtown LA and its south-of-the-border cousins.

To understand Mexico it's important to understand the markets. Why not play up the angle of the role of the role of the markets in the communities and how travelers can better understand what is taking place?

LA Times: "The city of Oaxaca has two markets — the daily Mercado Juárez (the Wal-Mart for downtown residents, located just south of the zócalo, Oaxaca's main square) and the Mercado Asbastos on Saturdays. Friends warned us that the Oaxaca markets are relatively uninteresting, and they were right ... After a long walk through the narrow, congested streets, we found the Mercado Asbastos near the bus station. It lacked the rural charm of Ocotlán's market and was more like a swap meet in a sports arena parking lot, with stalls of T-shirts, CDs of questionable origin, auto parts and cheap radios."

Just two markets in Oaxaca City? There are easily a dozen. As mentioned in this thread, the Abastos is held every day. But calling the Mercado Juárez a 'Wal-Mart' provides an erroneous impression ... and one that does not even bring up the discussion about the Aurrerea/Wal-Mart near Teotihuacan. What is it about the traditional markets -- even if they resemble a swap meet -- that connect Mexico's present to its past?
Ron Mader
Planeta.com
http://www.planeta.com


Bubba

Nov 17, 2004, 8:36 AM

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Re: [Gayla] Nice LA Times article on Oaxaca

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Gayla:

Casa Oaxaca (the original - we haven't had a chance to try their new place) is one of our favorite restaurants in all of Mexico. We have lived here for over three years and have traveled about quite a bit. We recommend this superb restaurant to anyone living in or planning to visit Oaxaca city. It ain't cheap. The clown who wrote the LA Times article obviously pulled his restaurant recommendations from some dog-eared tourist guidebook and either (1) never ate in those places or (2) has no idea what he is talking about.

Yes we do know Teotitlan del Valle well, having attended some of its festivals at the invitation of our friends there. We have also been invited into their homes and shared their home cooked meals and mescal - having, on occasion, perhaps overindulged in the latter substance.

I must tell you, however, that as a devotee of my adopted Jalisco, I consider premium tequlia to be the highest form of the distiller's art. Especially pure unadulterated tequila blanco and, more specifically, Herradura Blanco. Bubba takes wood in his scotch but not in his agave concoctions. I think we should settle this with an extensive tequila/mescal blind tasting reaching a meaningful agreement on the attributes of each product only after indulging in an appropriate amount of each substance. It may take me some time to decide who is right and we may not remember our conclusions later but it is worth the sacrifice.


RonMader


Nov 17, 2004, 8:47 AM

Post #8 of 15 (2287 views)

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Re: [Carol Schmidt] Nice LA Times article on Oaxaca

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Question ... can anyone share the email of the LA Times travel editor?
Ron Mader
Planeta.com
http://www.planeta.com


Gayla

Nov 17, 2004, 10:18 AM

Post #9 of 15 (2279 views)

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Re: [Bubba] Nice LA Times article on Oaxaca

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Ah, Bubba............a man after my own heart :-). You're on for the Mezcal/Tequila tasting. My preferred beverage of choice is actually bourbon, but tequila has always been a close 2nd. I make an absolutely KILLER margarita, but like good tequila straight up, to sip, not shoot. A little reposada, Don Julio perhaps?

I'm planning a short trip to GDL in Feb. Til then, tip one for me :-)


Uncle Jack


Nov 17, 2004, 10:57 AM

Post #10 of 15 (2271 views)

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Re: [RonMader] Nice LA Times article on Oaxaca

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http://www.latimes.com/...,0,2911400.htmlstory

uj


Gayla

Nov 17, 2004, 11:42 AM

Post #11 of 15 (2268 views)

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Re: [RonMader] Nice LA Times article on Oaxaca

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Ron, here's the info you want - catharine.hamm@latimes.com


(This post was edited by Gayla on Nov 17, 2004, 4:24 PM)


Gayla

Nov 18, 2004, 8:45 AM

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Re: [Chumley] Nice LA Times article on Oaxaca

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You're right, of course, that they probably don't care. But as a consumer of their end product, they have a responsibility to make an honest effort at providing reasonably accurate information. By the same token I also have a responsibility to hold their feet to the fire when they print something that clearly contains significant error. We can shrug our shoulders, let it pass and chalk it up to no fact checkers (which I agree with you is a sorry state of affairs) and let the LA Times publish poorly researched and misleading articles. Yes, I know they're going to do that anyway. Or we can choose to speak up and register our concerns with the LA Times and let them know that there are people out there that realize and understand they are desseminating misinformation. I can't change editorial policy at the LA Times, nor can I force them to print a retraction or correct the errors in the article. All I can do is take responsibility for my thoughts and the fact that I found the errors and inaccuracies in the article misleading and offensive and state my case.

Catharine Hamm (Catherine with an "a", not an "e") is the Travel section editor. I did send her a nice, polite letter pointing out 5 errors in the article. I got back a personal acknowledgement from her. I had expected a form letter response, if I got any response at all. She said she'd forward my letter to the author and "get back in touch" with me. Do I expect to hear from her again? Not really. Do I expect to hear from the author of the article? Not really? If I do, then I've made my point and that's, well, that's the point.

All the media force feed us their version of what the world is like and what's happening in it. We don't have to accept what their forced feed is, especially when it isn't entirely correct. So I can either be a sheep, follow the herd and not say a word. Or I can be the black sheep in the herd and do my own thing ;-)

The errors in the Oaxaca article were fairly glaring, I suspect I probably wasn't the only black sheep complaining and not following herd orders.


Bubba

Nov 18, 2004, 12:04 PM

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Re: [Gayla] Nice LA Times article on Oaxaca

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Right on, Gayla:

I am way too lazy to carry through with my threats. Thank you for being there when necessary.

Bob


Anonimo

Nov 19, 2004, 5:06 AM

Post #14 of 15 (2134 views)

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Re: [Gayla] Nice LA Times article on Oaxaca

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Try this URL for Del Maguey http://www.mezcal.com/; it will work.

Saludos,
Anonimo


RonMader


Dec 6, 2004, 8:26 AM

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Re: [Carol Schmidt] Nice LA Times article on Oaxaca

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LA Times published a fairly critical 'letter to the editor'
http://www.latimes.com/travel/la-tr-letters28.1nov28,1,7611343.story?coll=la-travel-headlines

LETTERS
Mexico tips that missed the mark

I was disturbed by "To Market, to Market in Oaxaca" [Nov. 14]. It was a primer in bad planning and having a poor disposition for traveling.

Oaxaca, Mexico, is one of the most magical places I have visited, a beautiful colonial city with great historical and archeological sites. The Juárez Market, which writer Kevin Brass refers to as "Wal-Mart," is a treasure chest of food, crafts and everyday necessities. Each time I go there I am lost in the sights, sounds and aromas. He seemed to miss all this.

The Saturday Mercado Asbastos is one of the most amazing in Mexico. Its aisles of crafts, flowers, produce and food are filled with sights and sounds that I can spend hours exploring. I cannot believe that the author found it so uninteresting.
Market days in the villages around Oaxaca are a great insight into the vibrancy and culture of Oaxaca and Mexico. I am sorry that Brass got involved with tours. It is easy to obtain transportation to the towns around Oaxaca. He would have had a better time if he had taken a bus or taxi or hired a driver, all very easy to do in Oaxaca.

In Teotitlán, he missed one of the best restaurants in Mexico — Tlamanalli, at 39 Avenida Juárez in the center of town, which serves lunch only from 1 to 5 p.m. The town also has a very beautiful church.

Brass' article may deter others from traveling to Oaxaca, but it only made me never to want to travel with the Brasses. I hope you will continue to offer articles that are interesting and informative. This was neither.

Robin Mitchell
Santa Monica
Ron Mader
Planeta.com
http://www.planeta.com
 
 
 
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