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Kokopelli

Oct 10, 2002, 4:36 PM

Post #1 of 22 (2404 views)

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San Miguel attire

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My husband & I will be in SMA for a week the end of October & we have been wondering exactly what type of clothing will be appropriate. We understand the evenings will be cool. Are shorts OK during the day? Are new jeans appropriate during the evening? Is casual clothing appropriate for most of the restaurants near the jardin? What do most of the visitors wear during the evenings (jeans, shorts, slacks, anything, or...)? We won't be dining anywhere that is very fancy. Thanks so much for your input.

jack

Oct 10, 2002, 5:22 PM

Post #2 of 22 (2246 views)

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casual is good

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: we've been to SMA many times. the only time I wore a tie was to a funeral, and I was in the minority.

Lavanda

Oct 10, 2002, 5:47 PM

Post #3 of 22 (2239 views)

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Me, personally

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I wouldnt take shorts. EVEN if it IS SMA,
it will label you as a gringo turista.Most people do not wear shorts, and they
will not be necessary- it wont be hot at all.Jeans are fine.I aways take as much no-iron stuff as possible,
and soft, comfy, loose stuff. And some long
skirts, not necessarily evening wear, just skirts
which be good for many different situations.: : we've been to SMA many times. the only time I wore a tie was to a funeral, and I was in the minority.

jennifer rose

Oct 11, 2002, 7:49 AM

Post #4 of 22 (2243 views)

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San Miguel attire

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Leave the shorts at home, unless you're an REI kind of person with good legs. San Miguel de Allende is not the beach. What to wear depends upon whether you want to appear naco or fit in. My suggestion is business casual. Your basic Ralph Lauren should get you anywhere. New jeans are always acceptable if paired with a nice sweater or an attractive silk scarf.

Carol Schmidt

Oct 11, 2002, 8:34 AM

Post #5 of 22 (2250 views)

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Thousands of gringos in shorts

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It will be in the low 70s in the daytime so you probably won't need shorts anyway. But of the 3,000 or more gringos who live here permanently, and the many thousands more who come in and out of SMA during the year, lots of us wear shorts all summer long--unless going to something dressy or religious. It's not like we'll ever blend in--our height and complexions alone will make us stand out. In six months I had one very old Indian man begging on a step look at my shorts-clad legs in disgust, and he would not have approved of much of anything about the way I live my life. Everywhere else it has been fine. I've read on the local e-mail list that there is an old gringo man in SMA who has accosted at least two gringo women and told them not to wear shorts. But then in rural Michigan my fundamentalist grandfather once called me a whore when I was nine years old because I wore shorts in 90-degree weather.It is true that sexy attire is frowned upon, but my baggy shorts on my overweight, huffing, 60-year-old bod are not likely to draw any whistles. Several of us old gringas who wear shorts when it gets over 80 laugh when we see a strutting young Mexican woman in a tiny miniskirt, barely there halter top, etc.--we always say, "At least she's not wearing shorts!" We also groan at the loud, sneering, falshy tourist from whatever country who gives all gringos a bad name. Even the young people who flood here from Mexico City for events like the running of the bulls often stand out by their loud demeanors and attitude that they own the city.Your presentation of yourself is what is important, and I think a decent pair of shorts when it is very hot is very modest and acceptable, even in downtown SMA. Many Mexican young people wear shorts, and even older Mexican women and a few men wear shorts on hot days. Jeans and T-shirts are very common, including in Centro restaurants. Times are changing. I didn't come to Mexico to change it, not at all, but the country is changing, as is the world, and shorts are part of the present.Now come those who disagree and who think we must respect the culture. Well, I am violating the old-time culture by my very being, as an independent, free-thinking, free-moving woman, and I would look really stupid trying to blend in as an old-time Indian woman in clothes and lifestyle. Gringos are here, it's a fact of life, we stand out, we are appreciated and hated and loved and ignored and every other emotion a wide range of people can have about a wide range of people. I cannot be accepted by every single Mexican male or female. I am respectful of the culture even when I wear shorts, I do believe. There are those who are about to disagree, I am sure. So be it.

Kate

Oct 11, 2002, 8:49 AM

Post #6 of 22 (2239 views)

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I agree

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You have expressed my thoughts exactly, Carol,tourists or expats are not ever going to be taken for anything other than what they are. Especially if you are on vacation, you want to be comfortable,if shorts are what is comfortable then wear them..

texmexman

Oct 11, 2002, 10:22 AM

Post #7 of 22 (2247 views)

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Thousands of gringos in shorts WELL PUT - NFM

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: It will be in the low 70s in the daytime so you probably won't need shorts anyway. But of the 3,000 or more gringos who live here permanently, and the many thousands more who come in and out of SMA during the year, lots of us wear shorts all summer long--unless going to something dressy or religious. : It's not like we'll ever blend in--our height and complexions alone will make us stand out. In six months I had one very old Indian man begging on a step look at my shorts-clad legs in disgust, and he would not have approved of much of anything about the way I live my life. Everywhere else it has been fine. : I've read on the local e-mail list that there is an old gringo man in SMA who has accosted at least two gringo women and told them not to wear shorts. But then in rural Michigan my fundamentalist grandfather once called me a whore when I was nine years old because I wore shorts in 90-degree weather.: It is true that sexy attire is frowned upon, but my baggy shorts on my overweight, huffing, 60-year-old bod are not likely to draw any whistles. Several of us old gringas who wear shorts when it gets over 80 laugh when we see a strutting young Mexican woman in a tiny miniskirt, barely there halter top, etc.--we always say, "At least she's not wearing shorts!" : We also groan at the loud, sneering, falshy tourist from whatever country who gives all gringos a bad name. Even the young people who flood here from Mexico City for events like the running of the bulls often stand out by their loud demeanors and attitude that they own the city.: Your presentation of yourself is what is important, and I think a decent pair of shorts when it is very hot is very modest and acceptable, even in downtown SMA. Many Mexican young people wear shorts, and even older Mexican women and a few men wear shorts on hot days. Jeans and T-shirts are very common, including in Centro restaurants. Times are changing. I didn't come to Mexico to change it, not at all, but the country is changing, as is the world, and shorts are part of the present.: Now come those who disagree and who think we must respect the culture. Well, I am violating the old-time culture by my very being, as an independent, free-thinking, free-moving woman, and I would look really stupid trying to blend in as an old-time Indian woman in clothes and lifestyle. : Gringos are here, it's a fact of life, we stand out, we are appreciated and hated and loved and ignored and every other emotion a wide range of people can have about a wide range of people. I cannot be accepted by every single Mexican male or female. I am respectful of the culture even when I wear shorts, I do believe. There are those who are about to disagree, I am sure. So be it.

Deanna

Oct 11, 2002, 10:26 AM

Post #8 of 22 (2245 views)

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San Miguel attire

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A show of respect for the more conservative Mexican culture is worth the effort. Jeans MIGHT be too heavy, although I've seen people wear them all over Mexico...depends on your physical constitution...I reccomend a nice dress or loose pants- comfortable, respectable, and good-looking.
I think half the reason that Mexicans and Gringos alike have disdain for shorts is that most people look really friggin UGLY in them! : My husband & I will be in SMA for a week the end of October & we have been wondering exactly what type of clothing will be appropriate. We understand the evenings will be cool. Are shorts OK during the day? Are new jeans appropriate during the evening? Is casual clothing appropriate for most of the restaurants near the jardin? What do most of the visitors wear during the evenings (jeans, shorts, slacks, anything, or...)? We won't be dining anywhere that is very fancy. Thanks so much for your input.

Carol Schmidt

Oct 11, 2002, 2:56 PM

Post #9 of 22 (2239 views)

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Most of us look ugly in everything! Might as well be comfy. Nfmsg.

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: I think half the reason that Mexicans and Gringos alike have disdain for shorts is that most people look really friggin UGLY in them!

gpk

Oct 11, 2002, 3:43 PM

Post #10 of 22 (2239 views)

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Comfortable and casual, but NOT sloppy...

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There is no longer a dress code in Mexico--especially not in the Gringolandia of San Miguel. I see plenty of Gringos (and Mexicans) who dress like pigs, but I try not to be one of them. You will have NO use for a suit/tie/formal dress, but it could be VERY cool in the mornings and evenings, so bring layers. Have fun!

arbon

Oct 11, 2002, 5:50 PM

Post #11 of 22 (2237 views)

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Comfortable and casual, but NOT sloppy...

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DST

Oct 11, 2002, 8:27 PM

Post #12 of 22 (2238 views)

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dress code

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hmmmmm...I'm guessing the person who wrote this is either male, or has never suffered the consequences of wearing a short dress in a conservative city like Oaxaca, Oaxaca.......: There is no longer a dress code in Mexico--especially not in the Gringolandia of San Miguel. I see plenty of Gringos (and Mexicans) who dress like pigs, but I try not to be one of them. You will have NO use for a suit/tie/formal dress, but it could be VERY cool in the mornings and evenings, so bring layers. Have fun!

Abq

Oct 12, 2002, 6:42 PM

Post #13 of 22 (2244 views)

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Skip the Shorts

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I'm 40 something and never get so much as a glance in the US when I wear shorts. In Mexico---propositions,whistles, glares, ect. are the norm when I wore shorts. It was too much for a pre-meanopausal woman to take. Bring some "capri" length pants instead.----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------will be in SMA for a week the end of October & we have been wondering exactly what type of clothing will be appropriate. We understand the evenings will be cool. Are shorts OK during the day? Are new jeans appropriate during the evening? Is casual clothing appropriate for most of the restaurants near the jardin? What do most of the visitors wear during the evenings (jeans, shorts, slacks, anything, or...)? We won't be dining anywhere that is very fancy. Thanks so much for your input.

jennifer rose

Oct 12, 2002, 8:20 PM

Post #14 of 22 (2244 views)

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Thousands of gringos in shorts

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As pluralistic as our culture it, wearing everything from rebozos to Armani, there still is somewhat of an ethos when it comes to acceptable street clothing in Mexico. Except at the beach, rarely do Mexican men and women over the age of thirty wear shorts as regular street wear. IMHO, shorts should be worn in public only for the purpose of sport and exercise.Foreigners often seem to complain that Mexicans treat them differently and that they’re not accepted. Well, frankly a lot of them do dress funny.Appearances here, even among the poor, count for a lot. Cleanliness and modesty doesn’t have to mean loss of comfort. Freshly pressed clothes, shined shoes, and a decent hair go a long way toward acceptance. I’ve heard would-be expatriates boast that an iron hasn’t touched their clothing in three decades, and they’re hoping to go braless once they land here. Good luck to them, that’s all I’m gonna say. No one’s expecting you to don a chador, and no one’s going to stone you for dressing funny, but your are going to the “the look.”I may be coming from a different planet, but I can remember when people dressed their best on vacation. And even then I kind of wondered about those whose attire looked as if it had been grabbed from the laundry room just minutes before their plane left. Frankly, more than once I’ve been embarrassed by the appearance of friends (who are well and respectfully dressed back on their home territory) showing up here in Morelia with a sleeveless t-shirt, shorts, and some kind of leather-free Israeli sandals. Especially in the dead of winter. Now, there was someone who remarked that she would look stupid if she were to dress like an indigenous person. Yes, of course. But a tremendous range of options still remain. Why not take your cues from Mexican men and women of similar stature and station?

Carol Schmidt

Oct 13, 2002, 1:31 PM

Post #15 of 22 (2242 views)

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San Miguel is not typical Mexican city, shorts are very common, including on Mexicans. nfmsg

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: As pluralistic as our culture it, wearing everything from rebozos to Armani, there still is somewhat of an ethos when it comes to acceptable street clothing in Mexico. Except at the beach, rarely do Mexican men and women over the age of thirty wear shorts as regular street wear. IMHO, shorts should be worn in public only for the purpose of sport and exercise.: Foreigners often seem to complain that Mexicans treat them differently and that they’re not accepted. Well, frankly a lot of them do dress funny.: Appearances here, even among the poor, count for a lot. Cleanliness and modesty doesn’t have to mean loss of comfort. Freshly pressed clothes, shined shoes, and a decent hair go a long way toward acceptance. I’ve heard would-be expatriates boast that an iron hasn’t touched their clothing in three decades, and they’re hoping to go braless once they land here. Good luck to them, that’s all I’m gonna say. No one’s expecting you to don a chador, and no one’s going to stone you for dressing funny, but your are going to the “the look.”: I may be coming from a different planet, but I can remember when people dressed their best on vacation. And even then I kind of wondered about those whose attire looked as if it had been grabbed from the laundry room just minutes before their plane left. Frankly, more than once I’ve been embarrassed by the appearance of friends (who are well and respectfully dressed back on their home territory) showing up here in Morelia with a sleeveless t-shirt, shorts, and some kind of leather-free Israeli sandals. Especially in the dead of winter. : Now, there was someone who remarked that she would look stupid if she were to dress like an indigenous person. Yes, of course. But a tremendous range of options still remain. Why not take your cues from Mexican men and women of similar stature and station?

brad

Oct 13, 2002, 3:07 PM

Post #16 of 22 (2241 views)

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and then again....

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on the last of my frequent visits to the ZMG, while shopping at Plaza Pabellon and Plaza del Sol, I noticed a number of what appeared to be well-heeled locals in shorts. No one seemed to look askance. Weather permitting, one of my brothers in law wears shorts when out running errands. He is a former PR director for one of the bigger banks and knows very well the grooming customs of his environment.Sleeveless T shirts are another matter, especially in nice eating establishments.: As pluralistic as our culture it, wearing everything from rebozos to Armani, there still is somewhat of an ethos when it comes to acceptable street clothing in Mexico. Except at the beach, rarely do Mexican men and women over the age of thirty wear shorts as regular street wear. IMHO, shorts should be worn in public only for the purpose of sport and exercise.: Foreigners often seem to complain that Mexicans treat them differently and that they’re not accepted. Well, frankly a lot of them do dress funny.: Appearances here, even among the poor, count for a lot. Cleanliness and modesty doesn’t have to mean loss of comfort. Freshly pressed clothes, shined shoes, and a decent hair go a long way toward acceptance. I’ve heard would-be expatriates boast that an iron hasn’t touched their clothing in three decades, and they’re hoping to go braless once they land here. Good luck to them, that’s all I’m gonna say. No one’s expecting you to don a chador, and no one’s going to stone you for dressing funny, but your are going to the “the look.”: I may be coming from a different planet, but I can remember when people dressed their best on vacation. And even then I kind of wondered about those whose attire looked as if it had been grabbed from the laundry room just minutes before their plane left. Frankly, more than once I’ve been embarrassed by the appearance of friends (who are well and respectfully dressed back on their home territory) showing up here in Morelia with a sleeveless t-shirt, shorts, and some kind of leather-free Israeli sandals. Especially in the dead of winter. : Now, there was someone who remarked that she would look stupid if she were to dress like an indigenous person. Yes, of course. But a tremendous range of options still remain. Why not take your cues from Mexican men and women of similar stature and station?

Esteban

Oct 14, 2002, 9:04 AM

Post #17 of 22 (2240 views)

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Thousands of gringos in shorts

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Even in Mazatlan, if you go to a Mexican function, restaurant or business place, you'll not find men dressing in shorts. I've always felt like I'm respected more if I'm in long pants while doing banking or any other business that may require some negotiation. We were at the Angela Peralta opera house two nights ago, listening to a great performance of Beethoven by the Sinaloan State Orchestra and out of all the people there, including foreigners, I only saw one guy (gringo) in a Hawaiian shirt and shorts. Even the ex-pats here know the difference. If you begin to make Mexican friends and find yourself invited to the various wonderful fiestas, posadas and religious ceremonies, you'll find that none of the Mexicans, except for the "radical" youngsters, will be wearing shorts and beachwear unless you are AT THE BEACH.

DST

Oct 14, 2002, 10:32 AM

Post #18 of 22 (2239 views)

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San Miguel is not typical Mexican city, shorts are very common, including on Mexicans. nfmsg

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Well if you follow that logic, where I live in northern CA there are hundreds of people (of different ages) wearing filthy clothes and dreadlocked or simply matted hair- this doesn't mean that visitors should imitate the way they dress- unless they WANT to be perceived as part of that group. This is not meant as a personal attack on CS- she is obviously an articulate and tough cookie and since beauty comes from within, I DOUBT she is as ugly as she says she is- but to me, dressing according to the cultural norms is simply a way of showing repect for my hosts. In the USA, I don't care who I offend. I allow my house to be messy but I won't go to a stranger's house and throw my dirty laundry and trash around...and perhaps i should confess that the last time I was in Oaxaca City I wore huge swim trunks the entire time because they were indeed SO DANG COMFORTABLE... : : As pluralistic as our culture it, wearing everything from rebozos to Armani, there still is somewhat of an ethos when it comes to acceptable street clothing in Mexico. Except at the beach, rarely do Mexican men and women over the age of thirty wear shorts as regular street wear. IMHO, shorts should be worn in public only for the purpose of sport and exercise.: : Foreigners often seem to complain that Mexicans treat them differently and that they’re not accepted. Well, frankly a lot of them do dress funny.: : Appearances here, even among the poor, count for a lot. Cleanliness and modesty doesn’t have to mean loss of comfort. Freshly pressed clothes, shined shoes, and a decent hair go a long way toward acceptance. I’ve heard would-be expatriates boast that an iron hasn’t touched their clothing in three decades, and they’re hoping to go braless once they land here. Good luck to them, that’s all I’m gonna say. No one’s expecting you to don a chador, and no one’s going to stone you for dressing funny, but your are going to the “the look.”: : I may be coming from a different planet, but I can remember when people dressed their best on vacation. And even then I kind of wondered about those whose attire looked as if it had been grabbed from the laundry room just minutes before their plane left. Frankly, more than once I’ve been embarrassed by the appearance of friends (who are well and respectfully dressed back on their home territory) showing up here in Morelia with a sleeveless t-shirt, shorts, and some kind of leather-free Israeli sandals. Especially in the dead of winter. : : Now, there was someone who remarked that she would look stupid if she were to dress like an indigenous person. Yes, of course. But a tremendous range of options still remain. Why not take your cues from Mexican men and women of similar stature and station?

Marlene in Mazatlan

Oct 14, 2002, 3:30 PM

Post #19 of 22 (2240 views)

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Thousands of gringos in shorts

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How tacky! In such a beautiful theatre. Some "imports" just haven't a clue. (Did it happen to be the yellow one?)
: Even in Mazatlan, if you go to a Mexican function, restaurant or business place, you'll not find men dressing in shorts. I've always felt like I'm respected more if I'm in long pants while doing banking or any other business that may require some negotiation. We were at the Angela Peralta opera house two nights ago, listening to a great performance of Beethoven by the Sinaloan State Orchestra and out of all the people there, including foreigners, I only saw one guy (gringo) in a Hawaiian shirt and shorts. Even the ex-pats here know the difference. If you begin to make Mexican friends and find yourself invited to the various wonderful fiestas, posadas and religious ceremonies, you'll find that none of the Mexicans, except for the "radical" youngsters, will be wearing shorts and beachwear unless you are AT THE BEACH.

Christine

Oct 15, 2002, 3:16 PM

Post #20 of 22 (2247 views)

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dress code-Oaxaca

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When I was in Oaxaca (city) I was very comfortable in slightly above the knee length skirts. I wore my shorts around the house (of my host family) when it was hot, as did the rest of the family. When I went to the coast of Pto. Escondido I wore the shorts exclusively. One evening I went to the Zocalo in Oaxaca with friends and I did wear a rather short dress...and got the unwanted attention of many men. Live and learn! Comfort and modest attractiveness are good guide lines. : hmmmmm...I'm guessing the person who wrote this is either male, or has never suffered the consequences of wearing a short dress in a conservative city like Oaxaca, Oaxaca.......

Liz

Oct 15, 2002, 4:41 PM

Post #21 of 22 (2239 views)

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I agree completely

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I am from the Pacific Northwest and often go braless there, but never here. It definitely is out of place. I did notice that here pants seem to be just as dressy as skirts and dresses. I even see them on women in church. I almost never so this in the US at our church.There also seems to be a different standard for young women. Although some wear very revealing clothing, I don't see shorts or short skirts here. I have not seen anything remotely revealing in the professional classes. Although I will never be able to look Mexican, I prefer not to inadvertently offend people.

jesus

Feb 28, 2003, 1:15 PM

Post #22 of 22 (2162 views)

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Re: [Kokopelli] San Miguel attire

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If you care, after 51 years in this country and after travelled all mexican states, I will suggest you to dress right the way you want. I don't think you should be more respectfull to conservatives mexicans than liberal mexicans. A long long long tradition in this country is to dress the way you want. Be in SMA or anywhere else. That is not true that shorts are not accepted, specially on the street. Feel at home. Some may not like it, some may like it. Don't missunderstand this country.