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wendy devlin

Oct 24, 2006, 8:42 AM

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Foot on your neck...

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Was going to put these comments on the APPO thread.

However geri's idea of trying to keep topics from sliding completely into tangled webs, gave this idea, it's own legs.

There is an expression:
Keep your foot on their necks...or...
They'll be putting their feet on yours.

The context.
A few years ago, I found myself living among, let's call them, the rank and file of the APPO. (They weren't literally APPO, nor was this in Oaxaca but some people considered themselves 'ruled' over by other, corrupt, 'privileged' Mexicans)

How I came to be in this situation, not by 'choice' but by circumstance, is a soap opera in intself, not for the telling here.

However, in these particular circumstances, among the politically motivated 'oppressed', my 'liberal or moderate' sensibilities received a rude awakening.

Like what would likely happen if these particular people manage to 'oust' the ruthless politicos 'over-them', and take local power into their own hands.

Would they then become a kinder, gentler ruling class?
as middle-class sensibilities suggest.

No way, Jose!

These particular people expressed these sentiments directly to me, and indirectly by deed to people all around.

They would sock it to those they felt had oppressed them for decades, in 'exactly' the same way as they felt they had been treated.

And i, an extrajerno, only another 'oppressor', to be dealt with the same way.
My liberal sentiments perceived as 'weakness'.

Maybe the people on these forums, have other experiences.

I too, have had many other kinds of experiences in Mexico, among other groups and individuals but this is some of what happened in these particular circumstances.

Now it is easier to imagine work as a maid, hard labor in the fields/factory.
Or being tossed a few coins, at a stop-light.

sfmacaws

Oct 24, 2006, 12:14 PM

Post #2 of 9 (5726 views)

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Re: [wendy devlin] Foot on your neck...

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People are the same in all classes, much like the chickens in your yard. When a different one gets to the top of the pecking order, nothing changes except for the top bird. Remember the Red Guard and the Cultural Revolution? I find it illuminating to look at how men at the bottom of the pecking order treat what is below even them, like women and animals. Kind of a prediction of behavior if they get to the top, it's not a pleasant thought.

Jonna - Mérida, Yucatán

arbon

Oct 24, 2006, 2:06 PM

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Re: [sfmacaws] Foot on your neck...

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I remember the "Red States", but "Culture" would surely be revolutionary.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

wendy devlin

Oct 25, 2006, 1:22 PM

Post #4 of 9 (5659 views)

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Re: [sfmacaws] Foot on your neck...

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Where is Bubba, anyway?

Thought he'd be all over this topic, like a wet T-shirt:)

What Jonna suggests, is close to what I observed first-hand. My OP was meant to encourage people to investigate more fully what might actually be going on, somewhere.
Not how they would 'like' it to be.

Like, chickens in our yard.

Now there's a constant reality check:)

Currently raising 30(down from 40) including five different pure-bred heritage roosters. Informal 'palenque'.

Once got a tour of a cock-rearing ranchito in Jalisco.

T'was on the evening, my vet amiga took me there to help artificially inseminate the ranchero's prize sow. Got to hold the gate shut after she went into the pen. No mean feat:)

Small coincidence that the rooster is a popular bird(symbol) in Mexico.

Keeping on topic. Bet they keep cocks for fighting in Oaxaca too.

And not to down-play the significance of struggling for a greater share of the pie.

(This post was edited by wendy devlin on Oct 25, 2006, 1:30 PM)

nfabq

Oct 26, 2006, 11:24 PM

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Re: [wendy devlin] Foot on your neck...

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Wendy, you may feel better about turning the pecking order over if you recall Nelson Mandela and the turn-around he brought to South Africa.It is my understanding he was very careful to insist that whites were treated like the blacks had wanted to be treated under apartheid, and that they function as meaningful equal participants in all aspects of the country's society. Hope this helps restore your idealism.

Norm

wendy devlin

Oct 27, 2006, 11:52 AM

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Re: [nfabq] Foot on your neck...

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Norm
>Hope this helps restore your idealism.

A full answer to your comment might require a book or TV mini-series:)

Now I understand that you are retired from a career in the social sector, given your comments on gangs and the homeless. As I am.

And that you and your wife have had a long-term relationship with Mexicans and their families. And hope to spend more time among them. As I have.

(I'm trying really hard to keep this post short and to the point)

Given (perhaps)a similiar background to yours of a professional life with people and their families, I was very cautious to intrude into any social situation in another country with a language/culture different from my own. Spent previous years researching and talking with people from all walks of life to prepare for the day, I might get to spend extended time in Mexico.

However imagine, that you found in the early days of your longed-for retirement in Mexico, young girls nearby being sold by their fathers into prostitution or teen-age boys sniffing 'gomme' and frying their brain cells, family violence, rampant coercism and corruption etc. ... all around you.

In a sleepy little resort town that you had visited many times and grown to love. A hidden under-belly to the culture there that most tourists and ex-pats either oblivious to or chosing to ignore.

And you found out that there was little if any support services or agencies addressing any of these day-to-day realities.

Some idealistic notions might collide quite quickly with, certain social realities.
for which you may or may not be equipped to handle.

I think too that I was naive about how much one person can influence, others, engrained in a culture of poverty.

Perhaps there could have been support working through an established Mexican agency within a team. However at that time, there was few if anyone to work with.

(This post was edited by wendy devlin on Oct 27, 2006, 11:59 AM)

geri

Oct 27, 2006, 12:37 PM

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Re: [wendy devlin] Foot on your neck...

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Wendy, this is one of the most honest/forthright statements I've heard from "wannabees" moving to Mexico. In my experience (albeit limited) once you peel off a layer or two, the honeymoon is over. Still, it's a great country full of strong survivors with big hearts. I find that if people are going to "make it" as retirees (outside of gated, made-for-expats communities), they usually know within 2 or 3 years. Many move back to their comfortable customs and homeland after that. This isn't a criticism of either Mexicans or expats. Just my observations. Customs here are VERY different and many people come to Mexico thinking it's U.S. south. Nope. Almost everything is different here (Of course I'm talking about Oaxaca where's no WalMart or Costco, and only recently a Sam's Club). Other parts of Mexico are very different, I realize, and even Oaxaca is changing rapidly.

nfabq

Oct 29, 2006, 1:15 AM

Post #8 of 9 (5494 views)

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Re: [wendy devlin] Foot on your neck...

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I hope, Wendy, you are not ready to give up.A few OPs back you wrote," My OP was meant to encourage people to investigate more fully what might actually be going on somewhere. Not how they would like it to be." South Africa,as a result of Mandela,one man,a man who spent many years in solitary confinement in an island prison,not even allowed visitors,has a chance now to live its dream.Without a dream,where would the black people of that country be today? Still with the heavy foot of racism on their necks?

You are right to feel discouraged under the circumstances you describe,but if discouragement leads to our not dreaming anymore,what does the future hold?

Norm

viajita

Oct 29, 2006, 4:32 AM

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Re: [wendy devlin] Foot on your neck...

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I thought Bubba would be all over this too. Should we send a search team or offer a reward?