Forums > General > Living, Working, Retiring

reg767

Mar 7, 2003, 5:39 AM

Post #1 of 5 (3170 views)

Shortcut

"Let them Hate as long as they Fear" NY Times

Can't Post | Private Reply

An important Op/Ed piece in the NYTimes today (www.nytimes.com) by Paul Krugman, the Princeton professor, regarding recent developments in MEXICO/US relations. If not a member, the NYTimes online is free - just sign-up. There's no charge to read.

raferguson

Mar 7, 2003, 8:30 PM

Post #2 of 5 (2880 views)

Shortcut

Re: [reg767] "Let them Hate as long as they Fear" NY Times

Can't Post | Private Reply

It was an interesting article from the NY Times, not sure that I agree with it.

However, it brought to mind an interesting editorial that I read recently, perhaps in La Reforma. The editorial said that Mexico would not have normally been on the UN Security Council at this time, except that they had done some dealing to get on the council, traded with some other nation or somesuch. The writer said that it was extremely foolish for Mexico to want to be on the security council at this time. If Mexico adhered to their non-intervention principles, which date back at least to Benito Juarez (1860's), then the US would be mad at Mexico. If Mexico voted with the US, they would be repudiating long standing Mexican policy and philosophy, not to speak of going against Mexican public opinion. In other words, the Fox government (and Castenada, the foreign secretary who recently resigned) was foolish to voluntarily put itself in a no-win situation. The NY Times article supports the editorial that I read in the Mexican press, noting the extreme pressure being put on Mexico in this moment of international crisis.

The whole situation is not a pretty picture. I keep thinking of the situation in the late 1930's, when appeasement was supposed to prevent WWII. Of course, appeasement failed. The USA was so isolationist at that time that some claim that even after Pearl Harbor, the US would not have declared war on the Nazis, except that the Nazis declared war on the US first. Maybe we are careening towards another great war, and the only question is the exact date of the start of the war. Diplomatic manuvering did not help the French or British much in the late 1930s, it only postponed the start of the fighting. Historians love to do "what if" analysis, what if the French and British had been harder on Germany earlier, what if they had refused to accept the Nazi takeover of Czechoslovakia. Of course, we will never know.

http://www.fergusonsculpture.com

esperanza

Mar 7, 2003, 8:52 PM

Post #3 of 5 (2845 views)

Shortcut

Re: [reg767] "Let them Hate as long as they Fear" NY Times

Can't Post | Private Reply

Thanks for posting that link. It's a sad state of affairs in the States. I'm too tired to get on my soapbox tonight, but I might do it another time. I forwarded the article to any number of people both here, abroad, and in the States.

http://www.mexicocooks.typepad.com

jturpen

Mar 8, 2003, 8:46 AM

Post #4 of 5 (2787 views)

Shortcut

Re: [reg767] "Let them Hate as long as they Fear" NY Times

Can't Post |

Thanks for the article reference. Mr. Krugman has made very strong arguments. Believe me, where I live there are the beginnings of a firestorm of reaction to Bush's stupidity.

People who supported the idea of "seek and destroy terrorists" have recalculated their sense of patriotism. It will take time and a few more blunders by Bush ... but if he does not cool off and stop "Pounding the WAR drum" ... Americans will make sure that he will be in deep sh__ !

Krugman's, " But Mexico's seat on the U.N. Security Council gives it a vote on the question of Iraq — and the threats the Bush administration has made to get that vote are quickly destroying any semblance of good will. "

Remember two things about Bush, he is a Texan (need I go into the love-hate Tex-Mex tangle?) and he is a man who believes he must defend his father. Don't those two elements somehow render a "bully" mentality when it comes to interacting with others?

As far as the statement by Bush of , " if Mexico didn't vote for a U.S. resolution it could 'stir up feelings' against Mexicans in the United States. "

I would refer you to http://www.pbs.org/now and do a search on Rodriguez. The article from Richard Rodriguez best describes what is happening in the USA. He describes it as the 'Browning' of America ... and it is true. For this reason it is going to be impossible to pressure the people whose native tongue is spanish. The USA is becoming a nation of Korean-Africans and Norwedian-Mexicans and Bulgarian-Argentinians. Who is going to pressure Who ?

The only part of the article that I take exception with is the use by Krugman of the "Nixon created" term 'Hispanic' ... " I mean Hispanics, not Mexicans ". At this point in time Spain is being pushed by Bush and is being a good follower ... that country is certainly 'spanish speaking'.

Mexico seems to be a bit smarter than Spain ... let's hope and pray it remains that way.

What will the next two weeks bring?

Joe

reg767

Mar 8, 2003, 8:58 AM

Post #5 of 5 (2769 views)

Shortcut

Re: [jturpen] "Let them Hate as long as they Fear" NY Times

Can't Post | Private Reply

Ethnocentrism in America is reaching a zenith. I would have hoped by now that we would have learned that the sun does not revolve around the United States, and that sensitivity and respect for other countries would emerge. I am tired of the basic rudeness of phrases by our politicians such as, "we are the greatest country in the world". There are thousands of examples where people of responsibility in government demonstrate gross insensitivity to other nations. Perhaps this lack of empathy and respect is directed to and felt by Mexico more so than many others. When will the stupidity end?