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Brian In The Army

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #1 of 29 (5237 views)

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Puerto Escondido on $500 a month

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I vacationed at Puerto Escondido and found it very cheap and very fun. My goal is to retire off of my investments in Puerto Escondido or a similar town.<p>My questions:<p>How much does it cost for a Mexican to live in a place such as Puerto Escondido?<p>This would be a rough budget. What do you think?<p>Rent: $100 per month for primitive cabana that has an asking price of $5 per day.<p>Food: $7 per day or $200 monthly<p>Pocket Money: $5 per day or $150 per month.<p>Misc: (clothes, toothpaste, laundry soap, shampoo, regular bar soap, etc) $50 per month.<p>Rent: $100
Food: $200
Pocket Money: $150
Misc: $50 month<p>This adds up to $500 per month.<p>Comments Please?<p>Brian<p>



carolina

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #2 of 29 (5224 views)

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Puerto Escondido on $500 a month

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This sounds about right...I assume you are talking US dollars not Canadian? You would have to add on some extras depending on your lifestyle (telephone? cable TV? transportation expense? gas for stove? post office box?) I pay rent of 1000 pesos or 100US for a rustic house but electricity, water, garbage is extra.


Richard Ferguson

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #3 of 29 (5223 views)

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Yes, but do you want to?

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As referenced in my statistics, most Mexicans are living on rather less than $500/month, so it can be done. The real issue is whether you would be comfortable living on such a limited income, no car, probably no phone, no travel, a very small budget for dining out or entertainment, living in a house or apartment that most Americans would think would be very primitive.<p>The whole question is like asking "How much does it cost to live in Florida?" A lot depends on whether you are living in Key Biscane or a small town, the kind of housing you are in, what you do for entertainment, etc. My grandmother retired in Arizona on what seemed like an astonishingly small amount of money, but lived happily for many years.<p>The best source for cost of living information that I know is the AIM newsletter. They interview American residents of Mexico to find out what they actually spend. Some people keep good records. I think that most of them spend more than $500/month, but most of them have cars, maids, etc. For example, the Oct/Nov 2000 issue references an older lady in Guadalajara who lives on $250 to $300 per month, including a half day maid. (She owns her condo). She mostly partakes of free entertainment, free lectures, etc. The newsletter says, "That doesn't seem possible, but we saw the same kind of determined money management in our own mother, so we believe her."<p>Ultimately you have to look into your own soul to see if you really want to live that economically, if you can give up so much of what you are accustomed to. The higher your current income and expenses, the more difficult it would be to cut back that far. If you are currently subsisting on the minimum wage in the states, it may not be that hard to live in Mexico on $500/month. If you are spending $3000 a month in the US, it would be very hard to cut back to $500/month, in Mexico or in the US. Personally, I think that $1000/month would be a more realistic budget, but so much depends on the individual lifestyle.<p>Richard<p>
: I vacationed at Puerto Escondido and found it very cheap and very fun. My goal is to retire off of my investments in Puerto Escondido or a similar town.<p>: My questions:<p>: How much does it cost for a Mexican to live in a place such as Puerto Escondido?<p>: This would be a rough budget. What do you think?<p>: Rent: $100 per month for primitive cabana that has an asking price of $5 per day.<p>: Food: $7 per day or $200 monthly<p>: Pocket Money: $5 per day or $150 per month.<p>: Misc: (clothes, toothpaste, laundry soap, shampoo, regular bar soap, etc) $50 per month.<p>: Rent: $100
: Food: $200
: Pocket Money: $150
: Misc: $50 month<p>: This adds up to $500 per month.<p>: Comments Please?<p>: Brian<p>


Lucy

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #4 of 29 (5229 views)

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Puerto Escondido on $500 a month

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If you were a Mexican family of 4, you would be considered well off. Guess it just depends on what you need and want from life. I would assume this will work for a while and then you will want more. It would be a wonderful escape for 1-2 years.<p> Keep a journal on how you feel about this type of life. Perhaps you could write a book and than you could afford a better life style. There are a few young guys that have a great website on Puerto Vallarta for $20 per day. It is well done and usually up to date. Perhaps you could create something like that to support yourself later.. Good luck and enjoy...
-----------------------------------------------<p>: This sounds about right...I assume you are talking US dollars not Canadian? You would have to add on some extras depending on your lifestyle (telephone? cable TV? transportation expense? gas for stove? post office box?) I pay rent of 1000 pesos or 100US for a rustic house but electricity, water, garbage is extra. <p>


Uncle Jack

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #5 of 29 (5221 views)

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Is this what you are looking for?

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http://www.nwrain.com/~jwalk/


Richard Ferguson

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #6 of 29 (5223 views)

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$500/mo above average income in Mexico

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42% of Mexicans live on less than 2 dollars per day. I interpret that to mean a family of 4 would live on less than 8 dollars per day. 8 dollars per day times 30 days per month is $240 per month. At $500 per month, the family would easily be in the upper half of the income distribution.<p>I am not sure of the exact minimum wage in 2002, which varies by zone, but let's use 50 pesos per day, round that to $5 per day, figure one person working 6 days a week, so maybe 25 days a month, so $5/day times 25 days/month is $125/month. If you were making $500, you would be making 4 times the minimum wage. Teachers in Mexico make between 2 and 5 times the minimum wage, so $500/month would correspond to a teachers pay. Profesionals earn between 3 and 10 times the minimum wage, so 4 times the minimum wage would be in the lower range of a professional income. (I have the citations for the above statistics, if anyone is interested).<p>So $500/month may not make you "well off" by our standards, but a family with that monthly income would be substantially better off than most Mexican families.<p>Richard<p>
: If you were a Mexican family of 4, you would be considered well off.


Lucy

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #7 of 29 (5217 views)

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Is this what you are looking for? Yes, many thanks..

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:
: http://www.nwrain.com/~jwalk/<p>


Richard Ferguson

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #8 of 29 (5216 views)

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Sources of information for Brad

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Brad:<p>The 42% of Mexicans living on less than $2 per day is a world bank statistic quoted in La Jornada newspaper, 14 april 2000.<p>The information about teachers and professional salaries comes from an article in La Reforma, 11 july 2000.<p>I don't have the current minimum wage, but in 2000 the minimum wage in the highest paid areas was 37.9 pesos per day, so I assumed some increases. (La Jornada 1 January 2000). I am fairly sure that the current minimum wage is actually less than 50 pesos per day, but 50 pesos per day is a nice round number. If you find the current minimum wage, let us know.<p>An article from La Reforma, 28 July 1999, said that only 11% of Mexicans make more than 5 times the minimum wage. They computed 5 times the minimum wage as 5165 pesos a month. At 9 pesos per dollar, the approximate exchange rate at that time, that would be about $600 US per month. Again, $500 per month clearly puts someone in the upper income brackets in Mexico, most likely in the top 15 or 20 percent of income.<p>Richard<p><p>: I'd like to see the cites for the stats you are using.<p>:
: : 42% of Mexicans live on less than 2 dollars per day. I interpret that to mean a family of 4 would live on less than 8 dollars per day. 8 dollars per day times 30 days per month is $240 per month. At $500 per month, the family would easily be in the upper half of the income distribution.<p>: : I am not sure of the exact minimum wage in 2002, which varies by zone, but let's use 50 pesos per day, round that to $5 per day, figure one person working 6 days a week, so maybe 25 days a month, so $5/day times 25 days/month is $125/month. If you were making $500, you would be making 4 times the minimum wage. Teachers in Mexico make between 2 and 5 times the minimum wage, so $500/month would correspond to a teachers pay. Profesionals earn between 3 and 10 times the minimum wage, so 4 times the minimum wage would be in the lower range of a professional income. (I have the citations for the above statistics, if anyone is interested).<p>: : So $500/month may not make you "well off" by our standards, but a family with that monthly income would be substantially better off than most Mexican families.<p>: : Richard<p>: :
: : : If you were a Mexican family of 4, you would be considered well off. <p>


Scott in Morelia

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #9 of 29 (5216 views)

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The Article: http://www.thenewsmexico.com/noticia.asp?id=34293

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http://www.thenewsmexico.com/noticia.asp?id=34293


brad

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #10 of 29 (5220 views)

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$500/mo above average income in Mexico

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I'd like to see the cites for the stats you are using.<p>
: 42% of Mexicans live on less than 2 dollars per day. I interpret that to mean a family of 4 would live on less than 8 dollars per day. 8 dollars per day times 30 days per month is $240 per month. At $500 per month, the family would easily be in the upper half of the income distribution.<p>: I am not sure of the exact minimum wage in 2002, which varies by zone, but let's use 50 pesos per day, round that to $5 per day, figure one person working 6 days a week, so maybe 25 days a month, so $5/day times 25 days/month is $125/month. If you were making $500, you would be making 4 times the minimum wage. Teachers in Mexico make between 2 and 5 times the minimum wage, so $500/month would correspond to a teachers pay. Profesionals earn between 3 and 10 times the minimum wage, so 4 times the minimum wage would be in the lower range of a professional income. (I have the citations for the above statistics, if anyone is interested).<p>: So $500/month may not make you "well off" by our standards, but a family with that monthly income would be substantially better off than most Mexican families.<p>: Richard<p>:
: : If you were a Mexican family of 4, you would be considered well off. <p>


xochitl

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #11 of 29 (5213 views)

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Sources of information for Brad

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: Richard thank you for posting your sources. Below is a link that will give the up to date minimum wage. It gives a very detailed listing. Inegi says the national average is 39.74. It is used more as an economic indicator than anything else. Outside of certain areas of extreme poverty does anyone really work for that wage? The market sets the minimum wage and the national average is close to 3. <p>: Locally a skilled construction worker (maestro albaņil) earns 1500-1800 pesos/week and his helper 60% of the maestro's wage.<p>: Since you mentioned teachers here is an example. My wife's cousin teaches grade school and works 2 shifts. Her monthly income amounts to 12,000 pesos a month, her husband works for the government which adds another 8000. They own 2 homes (1 INFONAVIT) one of which they rent, which makes the payment on the other, and 2 late model economy cars bought used. I think they can be considered well off.<p>: I have a hard time with people using the expression "well off" when it comes to families earning 500 dollars a month. Just exactly who considers them well off? I'll bet if you asked them they (the families) wouldn't consider themselves to be on easy street nor well off by Mexican standards. At that income level they make ends meet. Below that they survive on miracles.<p>: <p>


brad

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #12 of 29 (5213 views)

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Sources of information for Brad

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Richard thank you for posting your sources. Below is a link that will give the up to date minimum wage. It gives a very detailed listing. Inegi says the national average is 39.74. It is used more as an economic indicator than anything else. Outside of certain areas of extreme poverty does anyone really work for that wage? The market sets the minimum wage and the national average is close to 3. <p>Locally a skilled construction worker (maestro albaņil) earns 1500-1800 pesos/week and his helper 60% of the maestro's wage.<p>Since you mentioned teachers here is an example. My wife's cousin teaches grade school and works 2 shifts. Her monthly income amounts to 12,000 pesos a month, her husband works for the government which adds another 8000. They own 2 homes (1 INFONAVIT) one of which they rent, which makes the payment on the other, and 2 late model economy cars bought used. I think they can be considered well off.<p>I have a hard time with people using the expression "well off" when it comes to families earning 500 dollars a month. Just exactly who considers them well off? I'll bet if you asked them they (the families) wouldn't consider themselves to be on easy street nor well off by Mexican standards. At that income level they make ends meet. Below that they survive on miracles.<p> <p>


Rolly

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #13 of 29 (5213 views)

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What is the URL?

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:There are a few young guys that have a great website on Puerto Vallarta for $20 per day. It is well done and usually up to date. <p>Hola Lucy,<p>What is their URL? I'd like to take a look.


jennifer rose

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #14 of 29 (5219 views)

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Sweeping generalizations -- all

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Your information is dated, Richard. Take a look at the link below, where in pie-chart form is shown a breakdown of class level by income. $500/month is lower middle class.<p>Some of these posts really do embarass me. $500/month for a family of four clearly isn't "well off" in Mexico. I often wonder what kind of blinders some folks must be wearing. Do they not see the vast stocks of upper middle class housing, do they not wonder who must be shopping at the shopping centers, and do they not have a clue who must be driving the new cars? Do they only see Mexicans as campesinos and a servant class? <p>


Don B.

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #15 of 29 (5217 views)

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Sweeping generalizations -- all

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   The chart shows that $5oo per month for a household is quite clearly above the median. (I kind of wonder where are the folks, missing from the chart, between 3 and 4 hundred and those between 600 and 750.) So, perhaps Mr. Ferguson has mis-spoken and said 'average' when he meant to say 'median.' Would 'better off than most' (undoubtedly true) be a more satisfactory statement than 'substantially better off than most' (depends on what one means by substantial)?<p>


Mereja

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #16 of 29 (5214 views)

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Sweeping generalizations -- all

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It may not be well-off but it is more than what the other 50% of the people make. Did you notice that 20% make $2 per day and 8% make less that $150 per month and 22% earn $150 to $300 per month. That is 50 % of the people in Mexico earn less than $400 - $600 per month. So, I think that it can be done, if you don't mind doing without a lot of the extras. Some people are looking for that kind of lifestyle. It just may be that the upper 32% of the people are the ones who are driving the new cars and buying the new houses, or they have a husband or sons in the US who are working and sending them money to build houses etc. So maybe it is 50% of Mexicans are campesinos or work in some kind of service capacity. But there is a big difference in income for the top 32% and the other 50%.<p>Mereja<p>: Your information is dated, Richard. Take a look at the link below, where in pie-chart form is shown a breakdown of class level by income. $500/month is lower middle class.<p>: Some of these posts really do embarass me. $500/month for a family of four clearly isn't "well off" in Mexico. I often wonder what kind of blinders some folks must be wearing. Do they not see the vast stocks of upper middle class housing, do they not wonder who must be shopping at the shopping centers, and do they not have a clue who must be driving the new cars? Do they only see Mexicans as campesinos and a servant class? <p>


xochitl

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #17 of 29 (5213 views)

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Sweeping generalizations -- all

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: well said , Jennifer


xochitl

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #18 of 29 (5213 views)

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Sweeping generalizations -- all

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:Thank you ,Jennifer Rose ,for so beautifully expressing exactly what I wanted to say.


Sigmund Freud M.D.

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #19 of 29 (5218 views)

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Typical from misinformed people

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: Your information is dated, Richard. Take a look at the link below, where in pie-chart form is shown a breakdown of class level by income. $500/month is lower middle class.<p>: Some of these posts really do embarass me. $500/month for a family of four clearly isn't "well off" in Mexico. I often wonder what kind of blinders some folks must be wearing. Do they not see the vast stocks of upper middle class housing, do they not wonder who must be shopping at the shopping centers, and do they not have a clue who must be driving the new cars? Do they only see Mexicans as campesinos and a servant class? <p><p>In Mexico they say: "Me dan pena ajena": They make me feel embarassed because of their ignorance. It's a shame that in the U.S. History is still learned through the movies. Middle Class Mexicans have a very high cultural level, most of them speak at least two languages and can discuss international affairs with knowledge.


observer

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #20 of 29 (5215 views)

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94% of the peoplle thereforein mexico live under the USA poverty level

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No wonder they come here by the 100's of thousands


Wade K.

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #21 of 29 (5215 views)

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Typical from misinformed people

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: : Your information is dated, Richard. Take a look at the link below, where in pie-chart form is shown a breakdown of class level by income. $500/month is lower middle class.<p>: : Some of these posts really do embarass me. $500/month for a family of four clearly isn't "well off" in Mexico. I often wonder what kind of blinders some folks must be wearing. Do they not see the vast stocks of upper middle class housing, do they not wonder who must be shopping at the shopping centers, and do they not have a clue who must be driving the new cars? Do they only see Mexicans as campesinos and a servant class? <p>
: In Mexico they say: "Me dan pena ajena": They make me feel embarassed because of their ignorance. It's a shame that in the U.S. History is still learned through the movies. Middle Class Mexicans have a very high cultural level, most of them speak at least two languages and can discuss international affairs with knowledge.<p>Wasn't John Wayne great in "The Alamo?" ;^)


Georgia

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #22 of 29 (5213 views)

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US poverty level

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The US poverty level is based on what it costs to live in the US, not in Mexico. Look again at the chart in the article J. Rose provided. Middle class is not the poverty level. <p>: No wonder they come here by the 100's of thousands <p>


Wade K.

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #23 of 29 (5214 views)

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94% of the peoplle thereforein mexico live under the USA poverty level

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: No wonder they come here by the 100's of thousands <p>I read awhile back that 40% of the population is impoverished. With about 100 million people that's roughly 40 million who don't have a future of good housing and mall shopping. Consider if the U.S. had similar #'s. About 120 million! Plus the large # of working poor just getting by. I for one don't have the answers to fixing their economy. But thousands of retirees spending their income in Mexico can't hurt! Maybe Mexico should emulate Florida and do everything possible to attract retirees. Instead of building new Cancuns they should be building Sun Cities! ;^)


Don

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #24 of 29 (5213 views)

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Do you believe your statements?

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 Do you honestly believe the following statement you made.<p> "If you were a Mexican family of 4, you would be considered well off." <p>You sure have a high opinion of the Mexican people. Believe me, there are many, many, Mexicans that could buy and sell you a dozen times.<p>Sure there are some families that consider themselves well off with little money, but those familiies live in all countries, including the U.S.


billaqui

Nov 30, 1919, 12:00 AM

Post #25 of 29 (5212 views)

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http://www.nwrain.net/~jwalk/home.html

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try pasting suspected url's into google. it seems to find the better than any other method i know. buena suerte.<p>
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