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tacito

Aug 12, 2014, 9:05 AM

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expired vehicle permit

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When a vehicle permit has expired, can it be renewed by paying a fine? It was due to be renewed in March 2014. Can it be renewed in Queretaro rather than returning with the vehicle to the border?
Thanks,
Tacito



Rolly


Aug 12, 2014, 9:16 AM

Post #2 of 16 (6638 views)

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Re: [tacito] expired vehicle permit

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It can only be done at the border. But first a question. What kind of INM paper do you have? Visitante? or Temporal? If you will answer the question, I may be able to give you more advice on solving your problem.

Rolly Pirate


tacito

Aug 13, 2014, 3:07 PM

Post #3 of 16 (6511 views)

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Re: [rvgringo] expired vehicle permit

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Rolly, To be specific the vehicle is a motorcycle and the person has a temporary residential visa. The fee was $400 for the permit originally. Will another fee be required?
Thanks!


rvgringo

Aug 13, 2014, 3:15 PM

Post #4 of 16 (6505 views)

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Re: [tacito] expired vehicle permit

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If the permit has expired, you should not ride the moto. It is now illegal. You will have to take it back to the border, turn in the expired paperwork and get a receipt. The deposit is toast and you will have to pay a new fee and a new deposit to re-enter Mexico with the moto; maybe even a fine.
If you cannot transport the bike to the border, you will need a Retorno Seguro to have a five business day window from issuance in which to ride it to the border and get it out of Mexico.
Note that your Mexican insurance is probably invalid while the bike is illegally in Mexico.
Those calendars sure got ahead of you.


Rolly


Aug 13, 2014, 6:35 PM

Post #5 of 16 (6491 views)

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Re: [tacito] expired vehicle permit

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If he has a Residente Temporal, the permit is good so long as his Residente Temporal is good. The expiration date on the permit is meaningless in this case. Am I missing something?

Rolly Pirate


YucaLandia


Aug 14, 2014, 5:52 AM

Post #6 of 16 (6458 views)

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Re: [Rolly] expired vehicle permit

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There may be an issue of legal theory vs. practice. Since June 2010, we're supposed to notify Aduana (in writing) of the new expiration dates every time we renew our INM permits - so Aduana can issue you a letter documenting the new/current expiration date - to carry with the vehicle.

We had heard no problems of people with TIP vehicles who did not follow this rule until last week. We got an email last week asking for help with what to do:

A police officer pulled over their vehicle and confiscated the vehicle because the TIP was beyond the original expiration date and they had no Aduana letter documenting a current expiration date. The official explanation: "The Permiso de Importación de vehiculo is expired, and you cannot drive it."

The owner has kept his INM visa current.

The owner is currently trying to recover the vehicle. (We're waiting for news/updates.)

We advised getting professional help from a good attorney.

There is an additional twist to his situation: He wrote out a "permission letter" giving permission to a MEXICAN friend to drive the TIP car - and the vehicle was confiscated while the Mexican was driving the vehicle alone (with no Residente Temporal in the car) ... gaaah.... According to the owner, the police did not say anything about the Mexican illegally driving the car.

So, I've been waiting to hear more, before making a post here on Mexconnect about police confiscating vehicles with TIPs that have not been formally renewed, as we hope that his attorney can un-knot this messy situation and recover the currently-confiscated vehicle. (one local confiscation does not make a trend nor signal a change in policy ??)
steve
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Read-on MacDuff
E-visit at http://yucalandia.com

(This post was edited by YucaLandia on Aug 14, 2014, 5:53 AM)


AlanMexicali


Aug 14, 2014, 6:38 AM

Post #7 of 16 (6448 views)

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Re: [YucaLandia] expired vehicle permit

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A police officer pulled over their vehicle and confiscated the vehicle because the TIP was beyond the original expiration date and they had no Aduana letter documenting a current expired



So, I've been waiting to hear more, before making a post here on Mexconnect about police confiscating vehicles with TIPs that have not been formally renewed, as we hope that his attorney can un-knot this messy situation and recover the currently-confiscated vehicle. (one local confiscation does not make a trend nor signal a change in policy ??)
steve



In the last 2 years I have noticed many Texas plated vehicles parked inside the Federal Pólice compounds on the Mx. 57 just leaving the city of San Luis Potosí and the compound at the entrance/exit to the new Mx. 80 cuota in Lagos de Moreno, 90 minutes away from SLP.

Obviously the Federal Pólice had these vehicles impounded. I also would see the Federal Pólice pulling over many, many more vehicles before when travelling this route. Now not so much anymore. More like normal travelling anywhere in Mexico now.

This summer I have noticed just a few Texas plated vehicles in these 2 compounds.

I concluded there has to be some "memo" that the Federal Pólice got to pursue with vigor some aspects of enforcing the illegal vehicle laws at one time and then another "memo" telling them to forget it, for whatever reason in our state of SLP and the state of Querétaro.

There seems to be an "ebb and flow" enforcement of certain laws and rules at times here for reasons unknow to us.


Also from talking to many people about enforcement by gov´t. officails of certain rules and laws they all say your attitude will usually make a great difference on the outcome of any encounter. A bad attitude is usually the worse thing you can do to yourself, even with petty officials.

I sometimes have to wonder why some Expats get the shaft by pólice and others get off with a friendly warning most times?


(This post was edited by AlanMexicali on Aug 14, 2014, 7:40 AM)


cbviajero

Aug 14, 2014, 6:59 AM

Post #8 of 16 (6438 views)

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Re: [Rolly] expired vehicle permit

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My TIP expired in 2007,since then I've been pulled over by transitos and federales on several occasions,when I hand over my documents I also include a copy of Articulo 106 which I got from your website and I've never had a problem.Like Alan said having the right attitude helps too.


playaboy

Aug 14, 2014, 7:09 AM

Post #9 of 16 (6433 views)

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Re: [tacito] expired vehicle permit

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Tacito, I agree with Rolly. He can drive it as long as his visa is current, his TIP is current. I don't believe that has changed yet. Kiss the $400 goodbye.

Steve, was this in Yucatan? Federales, State, or local police? I had a neighbor that had his van confiscated at Cancun airport many years ago. He had a friend driving it, expat. Long story short, Aduana took the van and he never saw it again.


YucaLandia


Aug 14, 2014, 7:31 AM

Post #10 of 16 (6421 views)

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Re: [playaboy] expired vehicle permit

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I had exactly the same questions - and no answers yet.

In Merida, the likelihood of recovering a confiscated vehicle also depends on where the police store it. If the State police simply put it in their back lot (behind the State police office), you have a good chance of using a lawyer to get it released. If they take the vehicle to the big formal impound yard on Av. Jacinto Canek - they generally never come out.

Sidelight: A confiscation happened with a good gringo friend - riding in a local Yucatecan's old 2 ton truck while moving the gringo's furniture to a different town - The State police officer who works the section of highway to Motul pulled the Yucatecan over - and immediately asked to see under the hood... ??? ... It turns out the motor's VIN ID number did not match the chassis VIN - license/registration listed VIN. (Chassis VIN and registration VINs matched.) They accused him of having a stolen vehicle and confiscated the truck - full of my friend's furniture. The State police in the main office were very friendly - laughing and joking with the Yucatecan truck owner. The next day, we went to the State Police's little impound yard (really just a parking lot), and retrieved his furniture with my truck. 3 days later, with a lawyer's assistance, and "paying a fine", the State police released the confiscated vehicle.

He now carries a Notario's letter documenting that the motor was replaced. Enforcement of Mexican law seems to involve a lot of discretion (or indiscretion?) by local and state LEOs.
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Read-on MacDuff
E-visit at http://yucalandia.com

(This post was edited by YucaLandia on Aug 14, 2014, 7:34 AM)


mcm

Aug 14, 2014, 12:05 PM

Post #11 of 16 (6369 views)

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Re: [YucaLandia] expired vehicle permit

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In Reply To


There is an additional twist to his situation: He wrote out a "permission letter" giving permission to a MEXICAN friend to drive the TIP car - and the vehicle was confiscated while the Mexican was driving the vehicle alone (with no Residente Temporal in the car) ... gaaah.... According to the owner, the police did not say anything about the Mexican illegally driving the car.




_____-_________
This sounds odd -- My understanding is that it is NEVER legal for someone other than the permit-holder, their family member, or a person with the SAME immigration status to drive a car with a temporary import permit,unless the permit-holder is in the vehicle. I've certainly never heard of someone writing a ''letter of permission'' for a Mexican resident to drive the car.
I wonder if there is some confusion in the story, which seems to be third-hand (the Mexican friend telling the car owner who told Yucalandia) about the circumstances of the confiscation. It certainly seems more likely that the car was confiscated because the permit-holder (or other legally entitled person) was not driving the car, rather than the more unusual situation of confiscation for an an expired TIP. Also, iif the permit-holder was NOT in the car, the officer would not be able to verify that the permit-holder had a valid immigration document, and that the car was legal.


YucaLandia


Aug 14, 2014, 6:27 PM

Post #12 of 16 (6330 views)

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Re: [mcm] expired vehicle permit

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Your suppositions are possible, but I tend to go with William of Ockham. (Keep it simple)
The owner told a very simple narrative: The Mexican driver says that the police looked at the TIP, and said it had expired.
The police gave the Mexican a notice/receipt documenting confiscation of the car - due to the temporary import permit being expired.

The police said nothing about a Mexican national driving a TIP car, and the owner was very specific about that issue, because he is afraid to raise an additional fresh issue that the police did not detect.

AlanMexicali confirms that he too has seen evidence of the police confiscating US plated cars that do not have valid permits.

The issue of the OP not following the June 2010 Aduana rules to report every INM permit renewal still exists - as a potential risk for the OP's motorcycle to be confiscated - since many police know about the annual Aduana letters, recertifying a new current expiration date.

Sticking with the original point: Our insurance agent also cautioned that insurance policies often have clauses buried in the fine print requiring that the vehicle be fully legal for the coverage to remain in force. By not having the annual letter from Aduana listing the current expiration date, in the event of an accident, a sharp policeman or sharp insurance adjustor (for either party) can realize the owner of the motorcycle may have invalid insurance due to the TIP being older than the latest official expiration date.

Since states have accidental death liability limits of $3 million to $5 million pesos a person killed in auto accidents, most people would not like to find out that their insurance company has denied a claim due to not keeping the vehicle legal - and leaving the car driver sit in jail until someone can prove they have the $$ millions of pesos to cover any liabilities, whether a death occurs or not....

Bottom Line: The OP should send a letter in to Aduana, documenting all the standard stuff listed on Yucalandia.com or Rollybrook.com, for reporting their current INM permit's expiration date: ~ Example Letter Notifying Aduana of changes-in or renewals-to your INM Visa

Happy Trails,
steve

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Read-on MacDuff
E-visit at http://yucalandia.com


sioux4noff

Aug 14, 2014, 8:02 PM

Post #13 of 16 (6310 views)

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Re: [YucaLandia] expired vehicle permit

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I have no real reason to think one way or another. But, possibly the Mexican friend told the story he did because it absolves him of any wrongdoing with the TIP-holder.
If the issue was the Mexican driver, which is the reason I would favor, he would be accepting some responsibility for the vehicle being impounded.

Just my 2 centavos.


tacito

Aug 15, 2014, 10:56 AM

Post #14 of 16 (6260 views)

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Re: [Rolly] expired vehicle permit

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Rolly, My friend renewed his RT visa in March 2014 but did not renew the permit on the motorcycle. Is that permit still good? Should he just go to the Aduana in Queretaro and ask what to do? He is not driving it.
Tacito


Rolly


Aug 15, 2014, 12:09 PM

Post #15 of 16 (6246 views)

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Re: [tacito] expired vehicle permit

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"Should he just go to the Aduana in Queretaro and ask what to do?"
Yes

Rolly Pirate


Sonia Diaz


Aug 19, 2014, 6:39 AM

Post #16 of 16 (6119 views)

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Re: [tacito] expired vehicle permit

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Aduana location in Queretaro:

Address: Prolongation Universidad/Campo de Militar y Kellog.

You take the usual 57 in to Queretaro from SMA but do not turn off on B. Quintana where the big box stores are.

Exit at Av. Universidad and go right. Follow that road past a Special K plant on your right. You will also pass a military base on your left. Keep going until the road makes a 90-degree right turn and then at the end of the road is the Aduana office. The office closes 3-6 pm.
At the Aduana entrance you will park and go into a little office at the caseta and give them your drivers license so you get a card to enter. You have to sign in and they will look at you car permit. Then you drive in and go to the Aduana building.


Sonia
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Sonia/252211011634302
 
 
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