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cbviajero

Nov 25, 2012, 11:36 AM

Post #26 of 43 (2692 views)

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Re: [esperanza] Count your change at Walmart

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Bronco, there is no such thing as a 'groceria'. If you're talking about a mom-n-pop small store that carries food items and a world of other things, it would be an abarrotes.

Or more commonly known as la tienda.


(This post was edited by cbviajero on Nov 25, 2012, 11:39 AM)


bronco

Nov 25, 2012, 1:21 PM

Post #27 of 43 (2677 views)

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Re: [cbviajero] Count your change at Walmart

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thank you simpsca (as always) for your good reporting on crime& theft. sorry this turned into a "language lesson". (which was used for distraction). keep us posted.


eyePad

Nov 25, 2012, 1:43 PM

Post #28 of 43 (2674 views)

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Re: [robt65] Count your change at Walmart

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I'm with you Robert. I can see your intent, which was to say that larceny is rampant in Mexico. I agree!


robt65

Nov 25, 2012, 4:11 PM

Post #29 of 43 (2653 views)

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Re: [eyePad] Count your change at Walmart

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Hello eyepad,

My intent was not to accuse "most" persons of being simply dishonest, but in fact many are, and some not entirely by their own volition. It was mostly my intent to say, that due especially because of two reasons, making a simple change of monies is difficult (or for that matter impossible) for many persons who have had very poor education from the public school systems. Public schools are not "free" by any means and for the most part (yes “most”) produce a lack of even a mediocre education, in all subjects, let alone math and / or ethics.


Teaching for the “most” part (this “most” is intentional) and I do have extended family who are teachers. Two of these family members definitely do belong as teachers and are really excellent educators. The other four should be arrested for impersonating a teacher, (tongue in cheek, for those of you who are easily offended).

In my personal experience with two school age Mexican daughters in Pre and primary public schools) are simply in those jobs as a direct result of either buying their way in, or by being hired as a “warm body” for a teachers position, by what we call NOB, the “good ole boy” process. Either they were members of family who were teaching and were hired as a “favor”, or they paid a substantial amount of pesos to some “higher up” with pull, to become teachers.

In my estimation, the federal and state departments of education, and right on down to the city and pueblo, state and federal “directors of education” are nothing more than a “legal cartel”. Hence the children do not receive an adequate education.
I think many of you who do not have children in school, would be surprised at the actual costs of sending a child to a “public” primary school let alone a “public” secondary school. It actually ranges between 1200 pesos and about $2500 pesos per student per year.

These are nothing more than indirect payments (some larger payments are more direct) to the “Directors and or teachers”. I personally know about five or six parents who had to pay 1000 pesos more for each of their children to be able to attend the morning sessions. These children were already in the morning sessions and they were going to be moved to the afternoon sessions. Attending the morning sessions, the parents would then be able to continue their jobs. If the children were moved to the afternoon sessions (2:30PM until 6:30PM), there would be no one at home to watch the children, and they would have to quit their jobs to be at home to care for and be with their children.

There are fees for certain specific (color and size and different materials) supplies that must be bought (others simply won’t do, there is a wonderful kick back system (by guess who) to the schools by the various papeleria’s who want the schools paper business. The costs of school uniforms are mandatory but the number of different changes that must be available per student are “required” locally. There is another little gem called “ayuda al interentendente del aseo general de la escuela” (pardon my spelling on that) whereby two days of the year are dedicated to serious cleaning and painting as well as construction of various elements such as walkways, walls etc., that must be attended by the male parent. If not, no excuses, it will cost that parent $1000 pesos as a “fine”, again per child. Wonder where that money goes?!

This all adds up to extortion and or thievery. God help the few honest educators that try to buck the system or the parent who asks too many questions. No wonder there is a serious lack of a decent education in Mexico’s public school system. This is all the fault of everyone up the line from school directors, to municipal school districts and mayors and all the way up the “food chain” to the President of the country. Wonder why the kids can’t count change or spell? This is the one big reason. That my friends is called dishonesty, extortion, thievery, ransom and or any other tag or spin one might like to put on it.

The second reason is because the big companies, the likes (and yes, be clear, I do shop in some of them, as do many of us) of Costco, Sam’s, Wal Mart, Chedraui (sp), Commercial Mexicana, Liverpool, etc., right on down to the smaller (some successful) businesses, who do not pay their (usually, hard working staff) a decent enough wage to provide the essentials of living for their families. It puts them in a hard spot of “having to give themselves a raise” in order to just survive. Do I blame the thieving worker, not entirely, no, absolutely not? I blame mostly the “thieving owners”!!!!

I believe these are the two main reasons a great many persons working in all kinds of stores can’t or won’t make correct change.
Now some or many of you may not agree with me, and I can live with that. That is certainly your prerogative. But that is my perception of the problem. So yes eyepad, “larceny is rampant in Mexico” in many sectors, from simply getting correct change, to getting your mail delivered, to importing cars and other goods, to getting the police tickets paid, having a water meter installed before a year waiting time for a new home, to getting the CFE out to install a meter, and so on and so on. Do I believe that the Mexican population as a whole are dishonest or at least want to be dishonest . . . . . no absolutely not.

Since this appears to be a perpetual problem with no real end in sight, I would think we all would want to make sure we count our change, no matter the reason it was incorrect, because I really do not expect any changes in the near future.

Now I hope I have made myself quite clear on this subject.

Regards,
Robt65



(This post was edited by robt65 on Nov 25, 2012, 4:13 PM)


bronco

Nov 25, 2012, 7:01 PM

Post #30 of 43 (2631 views)

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Re: [robt65] Count your change at Walmart

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that was a good comment. the majority of expats do not understand the third world. i have been around this over 35yrs, i am from a city where 800 languages are spoken, lived in the middle east, did business w/the chinese, etc. its possible that the cashier cannot count correctly, or they really need the $$, as wages are low. (maybe if the corporations also gave commissions, employee discounts, there would be good service, employee incentive). my issue is not so much w/poverty (as thats understandable), but middle/upper middle 3rd world people. (both here & the US). it is shocking but not surprising, that people who own several buildings, good cars, vacations,........well its like the missing change. it is cultural, (not everyone is dishonest, there are exceptions). this trickery is not done only to white folks (though we are a focus), but they do this also w/each other. it is difficult for western people to grasp this mind set. most are in denial & somehow it has become socially unacceptable to address these issues. thankyou robert for @ least explaining some of this to the forum members.

(This post was edited by bronco on Nov 25, 2012, 7:10 PM)


DavidHF

Nov 26, 2012, 10:40 AM

Post #31 of 43 (2585 views)

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Re: [bronco] Count your change at Walmart

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Robt65, I believe you are wrong in your assertion that the big stores don't pay a living wage. Can you back up your assertion?


cbviajero

Nov 26, 2012, 11:56 AM

Post #32 of 43 (2580 views)

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Re: [bronco] Count your change at Walmart

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the majority of expats do not understand the third world. i have been around this over 35yrs, i am from a city where 800 languages are spoken, lived in the middle east, did business w/the chinese, etc. (not everyone is dishonest, there are exceptions). this trickery is not done only to white folks (though we are a focus), but they do this also w/each other. it is difficult for western people to grasp this mind set. most are in denial & somehow it has become socially unacceptable to address these issues. thankyou robert for @ least explaining some of this to the forum members.

Gracias bronco,your posts are always good for a chuckle.


(This post was edited by cbviajero on Nov 26, 2012, 12:12 PM)


esperanza

Nov 26, 2012, 12:55 PM

Post #33 of 43 (2563 views)

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Re: [DavidHF] Count your change at Walmart

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The minimum wage for store employees of this kind in Area B, encompassing Guadalajara and most of the rest of the central part of Mexico, ranges from just below to just above 80 pesos per day. That's about 20 pesos higher than the 2012 minimum wage in Area B. Most businesses pay more than the minimum wage for this kind of work.

http://m.misalario.org/...lario/salario-minimo

http://www.mexicocooks.typepad.com









bronco

Nov 26, 2012, 2:17 PM

Post #34 of 43 (2551 views)

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Re: [DavidHF] Count your change at Walmart

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i cant imagine walmart paying a living wage. they dont in the USA, why would they it here? thats why the mexicans would prefer to work on their own.


DavidHF

Nov 26, 2012, 3:21 PM

Post #35 of 43 (2544 views)

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Re: [bronco] Count your change at Walmart

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Is that why THOUSANDS line up when the employment office opens at each new Walmart in Mexico? FWIW, Costco is one of the "100 Best Companies to Work For," because they pay well.


cbviajero

Nov 26, 2012, 3:46 PM

Post #36 of 43 (2538 views)

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Re: [bronco] Count your change at Walmart

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Walmart is Mexico's largest private sector employer..


bronco

Nov 26, 2012, 4:05 PM

Post #37 of 43 (2533 views)

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Re: [DavidHF] Count your change at Walmart

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david, one thing we all know, is that walmart in the U.S. is corrupt. they pay low, they make workers do overtime w/no pay, they locked them in over night. (NYT's artical). there are many lawsuits. perhaps mexico is different. my maid has been getting 40pesos an hr from me for 4 years. she may get 50 pesos w/her newer clients. she works less hours than walmart people but earns more $, plus lunch. i dont know the going wage for walmex.


DavidHF

Nov 26, 2012, 4:09 PM

Post #38 of 43 (2531 views)

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Re: [bronco] Count your change at Walmart

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I agree that Walmart USA is a scumbag employer. I think Walmex is not. I know Costco is not. I askedRobt65 for sources for the claims that Costco and Liverpool, among others, do not pay a living wage in Mexico. An earlier post said that all the big stores pay a living wage.


(This post was edited by DavidHF on Nov 26, 2012, 4:13 PM)


bronco

Nov 26, 2012, 4:44 PM

Post #39 of 43 (2527 views)

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Re: [DavidHF] Count your change at Walmart

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we will see when the votes come in. sorry to repeat, but if commissions were given it would also change the outcome. employees like to feel they have some control. they can develope their own clients, call them when a product comes in. they can even put the items in a cart so they will be ready when the customer arrives. a 2% commission can be an incentive, added to the wage. they also should get @least 15 to 20% discount. why should it be different than "saks" fifth ave? or "jcrew" ? its just a much lower end enivirement & price point. this is good training in general. walmex will do better, so will the employees. personally i dont think places like walmart/mex should even exist, but thats me. now, there will always be those who steal, but most may not have too.

(This post was edited by bronco on Nov 26, 2012, 4:51 PM)


robt65

Mar 6, 2013, 8:01 AM

Post #40 of 43 (2133 views)

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Re: [DavidHF] Count your change at Walmart

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Please if you are going to try and quote, do not misquote! I said a "decent enough wage" . hard to read correctly Mr HF?
By the way HF, care to provide your sources?
Robt65


esperanza

Mar 6, 2013, 12:19 PM

Post #41 of 43 (2098 views)

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Re: [robt65] Count your change at Walmart

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This is a really old thread, Robt65. The last post prior to yours was in November 2012. Maybe we could all move on.

http://www.mexicocooks.typepad.com









robt65

Mar 7, 2013, 8:24 AM

Post #42 of 43 (2048 views)

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Re: [esperanza] Count your change at Walmart

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I fully realize this posting was a year ago. A thread was addressed to something I supposedly said, which I did not. If someone is going to respond to something I said, I believe I have the right to correct any misquotes. Many folks read older posts, myself included. I have said my peace and now that I have corrected a misquote, I will move on. It's a shame folks don't know how read correctly or misinterpret for their benefit.

Regards,
Robt65


DavidHF

Mar 10, 2013, 8:18 PM

Post #43 of 43 (1951 views)

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Re: [robt65] Count your change at Walmart

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Piece bro.
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