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sanjuan

Feb 26, 2012, 8:35 AM

Post #1 of 17 (3561 views)

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South Dakota plates

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It appears that it is fraud to have SD plates in Mexico if you don't have a real address in SD (ie if you have an residence outside of SD).
http://rapidcityjournal.com/...2e-001cc4c002e0.html

stevebrtx

Feb 26, 2012, 8:53 AM

Post #2 of 17 (3550 views)

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Re: [sanjuan] South Dakota plates

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And it's a fraud to have ShawDirect when you've only been to CA once in your life, but I don't see it stopping many.

The SD gov people are bone stupid for even saying that out loud in public. When everyone is scratching for revenue anywhere and anyhow they've got a good deal going, we don't pollute, we don't wear out their infrastructure and we don't congest their roads yet we pay - now, what kind of idiot would want to kill that golden goose? - ah yes, no doubt some dogooder with touchy feely sensibilities. I've contacted a friend in TX with some political pull and suggested TX is missing a deal, he's checking into it.
http://www.chapalaweather.net

whynotwrite

Feb 26, 2012, 9:05 AM

Post #3 of 17 (3542 views)

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Re: [sanjuan] South Dakota plates

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"...Applicants who use a South Dakota mail-forwarding address now are required to sign an affidavit swearing they have no other residence outside of South Dakota...."
"Hillmer said rule changes were needed because some people listed campgrounds as their residential addresses, even though they never had been there. Others used bogus Social Security numbers. By law, she added, anyone can register a vehicle here....."
ANYONE can register a vehicle, by law.
"People who claim to live in motor homes full time, "nomads" as they're called, are required to sign an affidavit saying they have no other address.
"I have no issues with people coming here that are nomads and registering here," she said. "That's not what we're trying to stop here.""
How about that, it is legal!!

YucaLandia

Feb 26, 2012, 9:06 AM

Post #4 of 17 (3543 views)

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Re: [sanjuan] South Dakota plates

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How do you interpret these excerpts from the article:

"Applicants who use a South Dakota mail-forwarding address now are required to sign an affidavit swearing they have no other residence outside of South Dakota."

It seems that most Mexican expats residents can easily meet this requirement - where they have no formal US address outside of their SD claim. Pair this requirement with the following:

"Hillmer said rule changes were needed because some people listed campgrounds as their residential addresses, even though they never had been there. Others used bogus Social Security numbers. "

"By law, she added, anyone can register a vehicle here."

"She just wants accurate information on their applications."

"I have no issues with people coming here that are nomads and registering here," she said. "That's not what we're trying to stop here."

So, I may misread the article, but if you do not lie on your SD application - then, I'm missing about how it is a fraud to have SD plates in Mexico.

If you don't lie about your Social Security number, and don't lie about your address, then ... ???
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Later edit: Too FUNNY ! whynotwrite types 1 minute faster than I do..... LOL
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Read-on MacDuff
E-visit at http://yucalandia.com

(This post was edited by YucaLandia on Feb 26, 2012, 9:09 AM)

chinagringo

Feb 26, 2012, 9:39 AM

Post #5 of 17 (3521 views)

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Re: [YucaLandia] South Dakota plates

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Steve:

Thanks for making my day! On another forum, I predicted that the residence thing would be rationalized by saying a Mexican residence wouldn't constitute such since it was outside of the Country. Did I misread the article and miss the part where it said they were only talking about US residences?

And then the part about RVers being full time nomads was also laughable! Given the mindset of many in that group (you know the ones driving a $500K motor home who think it is great to be able to park free in a Wally World parking lot). there is a whole bunch of lying going on about not having residences.
Regards,
Neil
Albuquerque, NM

robt65

Feb 26, 2012, 10:17 AM

Post #6 of 17 (3515 views)

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Re: [YucaLandia] South Dakota plates

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Good Day Steve,

I have to agree with Neil. As you very correctly pointed out . . . . . . ""Applicants who use a South Dakota mail-forwarding address now are required to sign an affidavit swearing they have "no other residence outside of South Dakota." . . . . . The last time I checked my geography . . . . Mexico is indeed outside of South Dakota. This person does not specify, No other USA residence outside of South Dakota . . . . . nor does this person add any qualifier such as for a period of time (example 90 days or 6 months). . . . . . . . . . . . It clearly states . . . . . . "no other residence outside of South Dakota." that's pretty clear to me. It means none, no other, nada.

Having said that . . . . . . I also think that SD is shooting themselves in the foot as there are many retirees that have (for example) time shares or condos in Florida, Texas and other warm places in the wintertime. It sounds to me as though they do stand to lose a lot of revenue. Just my opinion.

robt65

stevebrtx

Feb 26, 2012, 10:51 AM

Post #7 of 17 (3500 views)

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Re: [robt65] South Dakota plates

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Ha, interesting, a guy on the other forum noted this article was written in June of 2010? - so, what can we assume from that and the current situation?
http://www.chapalaweather.net

maylane

Feb 26, 2012, 11:02 AM

Post #8 of 17 (3493 views)

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Re: [sanjuan] South Dakota plates

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Hello. just curious, if you register your auto and using your SS#, do you have to file
your income taxes in SD too?

chinagringo

Feb 26, 2012, 11:10 AM

Post #9 of 17 (3486 views)

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Re: [maylane] South Dakota plates

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By reading the article, you would have found out that SD has no State Income Tax.
Regards,
Neil
Albuquerque, NM

RickS

Feb 26, 2012, 11:25 AM

Post #10 of 17 (3478 views)

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Re: [stevebrtx] South Dakota plates

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Yes, this is a rehash of the situation as it existed in mid-June, 2010. I saw it then and followed it for a while as I have SD plates. I later (September 2010) talked with the officials in Clay County and they said, basically, "this has come up before and it will come up again". I have since renewed licenses there, acquired new (to me) vehicle title/licenses there as well as an RV.

Basically there is no SD fraud. Certainly (back in 2010 and probably even since) Nebraska and other surrounding states were 'politically' motivated to complain and I guess I don't blame them. Sounds like that they did take action against some of their residents with respect to having SD plates. But none of this has changed the SD law nor actions of SD officials towards issuing title/registrations to out-of-state vehicles. This is not a case, as some unknowledgeable folks have suggested in the past, of one rogue county in SD doing things under the table.

Around that time (2010) SD did start requiring me (and all others) to give them a photo copy of a drivers license and social security card of anyone who is on the title. There is a check-box on the State Application for Title that says "Out of State". My title clearly shows that my address is in Colorado (which it is). I have not been asked to sign any form that says I don't own a home outside of SD. That does not mean that Colorado may not come knocking on my door asking why, but that's another story.

So, no, nothing has changed. Expats can settle down as I suspect that this process will continue for the foreseeable future.

(This post was edited by RickS on Feb 26, 2012, 11:31 AM)

YucaLandia

Feb 26, 2012, 2:34 PM

Post #11 of 17 (3423 views)

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Re: [robt65] South Dakota plates

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In Reply To

Hi Robert,
Your point is logically correct, but State laws in the US regarding car registrations, assumes that it is dealing with US residences. South Dakota does not give a rats patootie about an expat's home in France or Mexico. The SD State Atty General clearly stated that they are looking for people who are dodging State taxes in other US states by trying to falsely register in SD - to dodge their home US state taxes and fees - which is why they checked Nebraska records vs. SD records. The SD Atty General does not care if we are paying our taxes in Mexico.

Clearly, expats in Mexico, with no official US residency outside of SD, fit her specifically identified category of vagabonds and nomads...
All good clean fun!
steve
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Read-on MacDuff
E-visit at http://yucalandia.com

sanjuan

Feb 27, 2012, 12:43 PM

Post #12 of 17 (3270 views)

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Re: [YucaLandia] South Dakota plates

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You have to wonder if most of those SD plates driving around Mexico were obtained fraudulently (as that article and the lawyer posting the article indicate) if an insurance company would use that to deny a claim in case of an accident.

RickS

Feb 27, 2012, 1:57 PM

Post #13 of 17 (3249 views)

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Re: [sanjuan] South Dakota plates

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sanjuan, you are still riding that losing horse "Fraud", aren't you!?! What is you angle?

You stated, "It appears that it is fraud (sic) to have SD plates in Mexico if you don't have a real address in SD." This is patently false. I quote (from the article) Debra Hillmer, then Director of the South Dakota Division of Motor Vehicles, "......the law allowing out-of-state people to register their vehicles does not require them to set foot in the state to get South Dakota plates." Further, "By law, she added, anyone can register a vehicle here." And "I have no issues with people coming here that are nomads and registering here," she said. "That's not what we're trying to stop here."
I could go on.

You are, for some reason, taking an article, written by a reporter from a SD newspaper almost 2 years ago, and misinterpreting its information. And your comment " ...and the lawyer posting the article..." has me baffled as I can find NO reference to a lawyer posting the article.... it was an article by a newspaper reporter! The article doesn't even use the word fraud except in the case where some folks may be getting SD plates "to avoid child support or giving bogus SSNs or because they are sex offenders or to avoid insurance requirements elsewhere". Surely you are not suggesting that the holders of SD plates in Mexico, as a group, fit into these categories, no?

Again I ask, 'what's your angle'?

(This post was edited by RickS on Feb 27, 2012, 2:00 PM)

sanjuan

Feb 27, 2012, 2:57 PM

Post #14 of 17 (3225 views)

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Re: [RickS] South Dakota plates

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RickS I'm just trying to get to the most likely facts so people can be better informed. The original article was posted on another board by a lawyer who works for BellaFloresExports (which imports and exports vehicles between Mexico and the US) who has been watching the SD situation for quite some time. He goes on to say "The practice isn't illegal, however, the way they are obtained are. Signing an affidavit stating (or having one signed on your behalf) is. It's perjury or fraud depending what state you are from". "If you really read the law, it's fraud". It should be obvious that claiming to have a connection to SD to get plates when that isn't true is a problem. Maybe when some one buys insurance for their SD plated car they should ask the agent if it matters whether or not the owner has complied with the SD law in obtaining the plates. If the agent says it doesn't matter they could get that in writing to protect themselves from claim denial.

(This post was edited by sanjuan on Feb 27, 2012, 3:07 PM)

Yacatecuhtli

Feb 27, 2012, 3:12 PM

Post #15 of 17 (3220 views)

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Re: [sanjuan] South Dakota plates

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The form I was asked to sign says the following below. Now I do not understand how I have committed fraud or perjury when all of points are true. I live in Mexico (which is not a jurisdiction of the United States) and I do not have a South Dakota Driver’s License.

*************************************
AFFIDAVIT CLAIMING LACK OF RESIDENCE POST OFFICE ADDRESS
(AN APPLICANT HOLDING A SOUTH DAKOTA DRIVER’S LICENSE NEED NOT COMPLETE THIS AFFIDAVIT)
I, ___________________________________________, in conjunction with my South Dakota Application for Title and Registration, do hereby declare and affirm that the following facts are true:

1.I do not have a South Dakota Driver’s License; and
2.I do not maintain a “residence post office address”* in South Dakota or any other United States jurisdiction; and
3.Because I do not maintain a “residence post office address”* in South Dakota or any other United States jurisdiction, the address I have provided with my South Dakota Application for Title and Registration is strictly for mail-forwarding purposes.

*For purposes of this affidavit, the term “residence post office address” is defined as the place at which a person actually lives.
______________________________________________________ ______________
Signature of Affiant Date
______________________________________________________
Printed Name of Affiant
________________________________________________________________________
Notary Public or County Treasurer
STATE OF SOUTH DAKOTA; COUNTY OF ______________________________
Subscribed and Sworn to before me this _________ day
of ________________________________________, 20___
_________________________________
Date Commission Expires
MV-3020

! Al pan, pan y al vino, vino !

RickS

Feb 27, 2012, 3:41 PM

Post #16 of 17 (3210 views)

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Re: [sanjuan] South Dakota plates

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Yes, and I've been following it for many years myself. I have 3 vehicles and 2 RVs legally registered in SD and I have a valid non-SD address (home). So I pay attention. And no one is ' claiming to have a connection to SD to get plates', they/we are availing ourselves of a SD LAW which says one does not have to live in SD to obtain a SD title/license.. That's their LAW. No fraud involved... No hanky panky going on with respect to SD law. Period. End of Case. And my vehicle insurance company could give a big rats ass where my vehicle is registered/plated. They care where I list as my domicile but they don't care how I have it registered. And I have had claims and they could have cared less. So don't make up stuff.

One problem with BellaFlores analysis is that not eveyone is required to sign any affidavit. Maybe they are acquiring their plates through one of those mail-forwarding sites in South Dakota who cater to full-time RV'ers wanting plates. I have NEVER had to sign such a form. Given them a copy of my SSN, yes. Given them a copy of my Colorado Driver's License, yes, checked the "Out-of-State" block on the SD Registration form, yes. Given them my real Colorado address, yes. Sign some sort of affidavit, NO. I talk to the SD folks every year (at least). They know where I live; I send them a check every year from my Colorado bank with my Colorado address; they send my renewal stickers or my new plates to my Colorado address. And also BellaFlores is in the business of 'nationalizing your car in Mexico' so one doesn't have to deal with stuff like SD plates so they may be interested in a non-promotion of folks using the SD as an alternative. Just saying.

Those mail-order folks forever have counseled RVers to put the address of a local RV campground as their address (because many of them did not/do not have a real home anywhere!). They (the mail-forwarding folks) will also assist one in getting a SD Driver's License (again usually RVers who have no home state and their existing DL is expiring), but because SD requires one to have a SD address for a driver's license (NOT Vehicle License, now!), the mail-order folks tell you that you have to come to SD, register in an RV park for just one night and use that address for their DL. This is the kind of thing that the SD are trying to address...... but not folks who legally obtain SD license plates as are many folks in Mexico.

Anyway.....

(This post was edited by RickS on Feb 27, 2012, 3:44 PM)

texmexgal

Apr 6, 2012, 6:20 PM

Post #17 of 17 (2493 views)

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Re: [sanjuan] South Dakota plates

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Hi, If you go to the South Dakota Motor Vehicle Division website and click on the Non-Resident link on the left http://www.state.sd.us/drr2/motorvehicle/nonresident.htm there are some legal memos that specifically deal with this issue. Nothing fishy going on...