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justystewart

Feb 4, 2011, 10:23 AM

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Safety of west coast route through MX?

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Hi All - I'm new to this forum and impressed by the quality of info here. I've been reading a lot about the relative safety/lack thereof of the routes south from Eagle Pass and Laredo. Does anyone have info on the safety of the west coast route - south through Nogales along the 15, heading inland towards Guadalajara and Mexico City? I know it is significantly longer and slower that driving in from south TX, but if violence continues along the 57 maybe worth it.
My husband and I are planning to drive through MX this March, just passing through as quickly and safely as we can and headed first for Belize. We are coming from California. Realize that things are constantly changing and looking for the safest known route at this time.
Thank you in advance for any advice or links you may have!!

Happy trails ...

Reefhound

Feb 4, 2011, 12:57 PM

Post #2 of 27 (11210 views)

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Re: [justystewart] Safety of west coast route through MX?

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You're kidding! Apart from a big shootout between federales and cartel members last month, what problems have you seen along 57? If I'm understanding you right, you're talking about Mx15 through Culiacan, Mazatlan, and Tepic which have seen lots of incidents.

RickS

Feb 4, 2011, 3:05 PM

Post #3 of 27 (11187 views)

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Re: [justystewart] Safety of west coast route through MX?

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Well, justy, depending on how many 'back posts' you were able to read in your 1-day life on Mexconnect, you will see that there are two factions here when it comes to travel SOB. One is 'they've got their heads in the sand with respect to danger', and the other is 'what trouble.... where?'.

Personally..... so that means that this is an opinion.... reality lies, as usual in matters of these kinds of discussions, somewhere in the middle. Yes, there are some serious problems these days in Mexico. The real question is 'how/how much does it statistically affect anyone traveling on the highways, in general as well as in specific areas of the country'. Of course no one can answer this question with authority, but statistically the number has to be exceedingly low. Exceedingly.

Statistics aside, 'tho, one should always pay attention to what's happening on the ground. For example, although I find myself in the camp of 'travel is still generally safe here', I did cancel a planned trip from the Guadalajara area into the state of Veracruz. Not because getting to Veracruz or Veracruz State and City themselves are such hot spots, but because I had planned on then leaving Mexico up through the state of Tamaulipus... and there has just been too many recurring problems in that State for me to knowingly exit Mexico that way. And to 'double back' once my visit was over was just too many miles. So I don't get to see Veracruz this trip. So?!

But I will exit Mexico next week from Guadalajara. How? Right up through the area that you have suggested is where 'violence may continue'..... Highway 57 exiting at Piedras Negras/Eagle Pass Texas! But unless you know something that I don't, violence is not 'continuing' along that corridor. Yes there was a narco incident (boy, is that too nice a word!) around Matehuala/Potosi a couple of weeks ago. But prior to and since, hundreds of thousands of vehicles have passed through there without incident except maybe a flat tire. That is the kind of statistic I can live with in my life.

I will also impart some 'traditional' wisdom that applies, I think, to your upcoming trip from Ca. to Belize. 1) stay in the US and on US roads as long as you can as they are always better, cost nothing and overnight accommodations are easier to find for the occasional traveler; 2) once in Mx, never drive at night; 3) drive the toll roads (cuota) whenever possible if you want to make any kind of progress at all... costly, but IMO, the only way to 'fly'.

My recommended route for you (remember that this is just one person's opinion) is to enter Mexico either at Eagle Pass or Laredo; proceed south on the cuotas (or free 4-lanes) bypassing Monterrey, Saltillo, San Luis Potosi and Queretaro. South of Queretaro take the new toll road (Arco Norte) that skirts Mexico City (as it is next to impossible to navigate through that city!) and connects to the toll road between Mexico City and Puebla. Continue eastward from there on tolls past Villahermosa in the state of Tabasco, and on to Chetumal, Quintana Roo. My other recommendation is to purchase, if you don't already have one, a good Mexico map.... specifically a Guia Roji Por las Carreteras Mexico 2011 (and Belize). IMO, one cannot drive the distances you are suggesting without either this or comparable map of Mexico.

Hope this helps you and enjoy your trip.

Altahabana

Feb 4, 2011, 3:38 PM

Post #4 of 27 (11179 views)

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Re: [Reefhound] Safety of west coast route through MX?

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This does not directly address the OP's questions, but it is close enough to put here because I think it is a fairly significant event. The newly appointed (01/01/2011) director of the municipal police force for Nuevo Laredo, Manuel Farfán, a retired army general, was ambushed and killed along with three of his chief aides while driving home from work on Wednesday night.

There have been a number of incidents in the city over the past two weeks which are raising concerns that the CDG (Gulf cartel) is beginning to operate in Nuevo Laredo. This article from the Houston Chronicle is about the Farfán assassination, but it has a good, concise overview of what is driving the violence in Tamaulipas and Nuevo Leon.

Nuevo Laredo Police Chief Killed on Street
http://www.chron.com/...politan/7411329.html

chinagringo

Feb 4, 2011, 3:53 PM

Post #5 of 27 (11171 views)

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Re: [justystewart] Safety of west coast route through MX?

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Going back to the Hwy 15 question. Like most major routes from the US border, Hwy 15 has had its share of problems. You will note from the Tony Burton supplied chart attached, Sinaloa has the second highest rate of drug war related deaths in the sampling. Mazatlan recently lost most or maybe all of the cruise ships that have typically made that resort a port of call due to rising violence in the area.

Just one incident, but according to the article which follows a body was left hanging from a road sign directly on Hwy 15:
http://www.blogdelnarco.com/...cutados-en.html#more

Any of the routes can basically be a "crap shoot"!
Regards,
Neil
Albuquerque, NM

Attachments:

drug-war-deaths-selected-states.pdf (45.3 KB)

DavidHF

Feb 4, 2011, 6:34 PM

Post #6 of 27 (11143 views)

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Re: [justystewart] Safety of west coast route through MX?

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We prefer Hwy 15. Over the last few months many friends have made that trip, in both directions, without incident. Several friends have made used the route thru Laredo and the worst that has happened is a couple of them were shaken down for $1000 peso mordida for alleged infractions that were total BS.

Reefhound

Feb 4, 2011, 7:13 PM

Post #7 of 27 (11135 views)

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Re: [Altahabana] Safety of west coast route through MX?

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The NV police chief assassination was upsetting as he was part of a new team employed by the governor, a former brigadier general bringing a military background and discipline.

Now as far as statistics go and people making a trip without incident, obviously your statistical chances of being a victim are low. Even if ten people a day were being killed on a highway the odds of you being one of them from the thousands on the highway are low. But would you want to ride down that kind of highway? Hey, the odds of me being struck by lightning may be one in a million but I still get off the golf course or out of the pool when there is lightning. You could tell me you've swam and golfed during storms lots of times and never got struck but I'd still consider it a foolish risk.

I would also be hesitant to proclaim that any given highway has gone months without any incidents. For one thing, many victims simply do not report incidents but prefer to forget it or deal with it privately (obviously homicide is not so easy to not report). For another, even if victims do report it the media seldom reports it unless the incident is simply too large to be ignored.

justystewart

Feb 5, 2011, 1:38 AM

Post #8 of 27 (11098 views)

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Re: [justystewart] Safety of west coast route through MX?

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Thanks for the replies. Seems that 57 is still the way to go currently. We'll keep checking in here and elsewhere as our leave date approaches.

surebought

Feb 9, 2011, 4:41 PM

Post #9 of 27 (10877 views)

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Re: [justystewart] Safety of west coast route through MX?

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I just did the Mexicali to Guadalajara and then on to Puebla trip in my car and had no problems. I was surprised that there weren't any soldiers south of Sonora. Just a few AFI retens. We never felt threatened at all. Some people say we're the bravest people in the world.

ryan8889

Apr 26, 2012, 11:58 PM

Post #10 of 27 (6696 views)

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Re: [surebought] Safety of west coast route through MX?

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nice post................

careyeroslib

Apr 27, 2012, 4:15 AM

Post #11 of 27 (6683 views)

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Re: [ryan8889] Safety of west coast route through MX?

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Hi Justystewart: I think Bridge II (Laredo) and toll roads by Matejuala is great route, but as David mentioned above, we also know people who regularly drive the Coastal Route because it´s more convenient We just drove that two weeks ago (enroute between Laredo and Puerto Vallarta) and was impressed with the quality of the roads and general pleasantness of the trip.

A personal tip. We like to drive in border areas during regular business hours, not really early or really late. Lots of hustle and bustle and people going about their regular lives. Also, going south there isn´t much of a border wait. The roll roads are excellent. I´m not sure where you plan to stop but, if you find yourself in a position where you want to stop in Matejuala, I would recommend Las Palmas Midway Inn. There is a great restaurant across the street called La Noria. Breakfast lunch and dinner 7 days per week. Truly excellent and very reasonable. (Thanks to Robert65 for suggesting it in a previous post).

Buen viaje!

(This post was edited by careyeroslib on Apr 27, 2012, 4:18 AM)

HarryinNM

May 10, 2012, 10:19 AM

Post #12 of 27 (6271 views)

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Re: [justystewart] Safety of west coast route through MX?

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This is purely anecdotal, and based on a single very recent trip. We drove from Cuyutlan (So. of Manzanillo) on 15 through the crossing at Nogales last week. We neither saw nor experienced any difficulties. The crossing was the quickest we've experienced, with only a handful of vehicles in front of us and after a simple screening we were on our way. FYI, total tolls were about $140USD.

newbie

May 14, 2012, 1:09 PM

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Altahabana

May 14, 2012, 6:32 PM

Post #14 of 27 (6044 views)

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Re: [Swiss Garry] Safety of west coast route through MX?

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Gary--Most questions related to highway security in the border regions especially are prompted by concerns about drug cartel violence rather than regular criminal activity. The incident near Monterrey you mentioned is part of a fight between two cartel groups--the Zetas and a coalition of the Gulf/Sinaloa cartel --for control of the trafficking routes in northeast-northcentral Mexico.

newbie

May 14, 2012, 8:16 PM

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Altahabana

May 15, 2012, 6:10 AM

Post #16 of 27 (5993 views)

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Re: [Swiss Garry] Safety of west coast route through MX?

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I thought your earlier comments and observations were very insightful as are the ones you make here. Most people who live in the Frontera (border area) follow the advice you gave here which is "Avoid areas where you know there have been problems even if the chance of something bad happening is slight."

donemry

May 15, 2012, 8:27 AM

Post #17 of 27 (5965 views)

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Re: [Swiss Garry] Safety of west coast route through MX?

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Gary, I think you are overlooking many other opportunities to avoid risk. Below are some statistical figures on the odds of dying from various causes. There is scant evidience to place a tourist in Mexico in the proper place on this list. These figures should not viewed as absolute but are useful for relative comparisons.

All figures below are for U.S. residents.

Cause of Death Lifetime Odds

Heart Disease 1-in-5

Cancer 1-in-7

Stroke 1-in-23

Accidental Injury 1-in-36

Motor Vehicle Accident* 1-in-100

Intentional Self-harm (suicide) 1-in-121

Falling Down 1-in-246

Assault by Firearm 1-in-325

Fire or Smoke 1-in-1,116

Natural Forces (heat, cold, storms, quakes, etc.) 1-in-3,357

Electrocution* 1-in-5,000

Drowning 1-in-8,942

Air Travel Accident* 1-in-20,000

Flood* (included also in Natural Forces above) 1-in-30,000

Legal Execution 1-in-58,618

Tornado* (included also in Natural Forces above) 1-in-60,000

Lightning Strike (included also in Natural Forces above) 1-in-83,930

Snake, Bee or other Venomous Bite or Sting* 1-in-100,000

Earthquake (included also in Natural Forces above) 1-in-131,890

Dog Attack 1-in-147,717

Asteroid Impact* 1-in-200,000**

Tsunami* 1-in-500,000
Fireworks Discharge 1-in-615,488

** Perhaps 1-in-500,000
SOURCES: National Center for Health Statistics, CDC; American Cancer Society; National Safety Council; International Federation of Red Cross and Red Crescent Societies; World Health Organization; USGS; Clark Chapman, SwRI; David Morrison, NASA; Michael Paine, Planetary Society Australian Volunteers

careyeroslib

May 15, 2012, 9:51 AM

Post #18 of 27 (5946 views)

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Re: [Swiss Garry] Safety of west coast route through MX?

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Garry, most of us who drive in Mexico have already made a decision to drive and are looking for the best and safest routes, i.e., we are minimizing risks of driving at any given time. I know I personally really appreciate the concrete knowledgeable advice of people such as Altahabana with respect to Texas crossings as well experiences of recent travellers.

I think the Original Poster was looking for similar advice with respect to the west coast routes which tend to be focussed on less on this Forum, probably we don't have a west coast equivalent of Altahabana who is right there on a daily basis.

sandyr

May 18, 2012, 11:55 AM

Post #19 of 27 (5771 views)

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Re: [justystewart] Safety of west coast route through MX?

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We have traveled Mex 15 many times over the years from the US border to Puerto Vallarta. This spring we made the trip again. As usual, we had a wonderful time in P.V. . The drive itself was pretty much as it has always been and that means other than a flat tire, we had no problems. Our drive back was during the first week of May. Of course, we use common sense and only drive during daylight hours. In my opinion, the biggest risk with driving in most of Mexico is traffic accidents. Many people think of Mexico as being laid back, but that is not true when it comes to driving. Too many on the Mexican roads are very aggressive and therefore one has to always drive defensively. I believe that is by far the biggest risk when driving in Mexico.

newbie

May 19, 2012, 8:43 AM

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sandyr

May 21, 2012, 10:18 AM

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Re: [newbie] Safety of west coast route through MX?

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I am not aware of the state department warnings having any effect on auto insurance rates or coverage. My Mexican auto insurance rates are the same as they have always been. I personally think the state department warnings exaggerate the dangers of traveling in Mexico when one is primarily using the toll roads. These roads are busy and monitored. Furthermore, the warnings are for specific areas and I would not hesitate to drive even on regular roads outside of these warning areas. There have been reports of robberies when spending the night at Pemex gas station parking lots, but this is kind of like spending the night in an interstate rest area. I wouldn't do that either.

I have researched the internet quite a bit. I would disagree with your assessment that "criminals on these roads are targeting nob travelers with a fair degree of impunity and regularity". We have driven Mex 15 between the border and Puerto Vallarta at least four times a year for the last eight years. We have talked to many people that drive Mex 15 without any problems. My opinion is obviously different from yours but I also believe reasonable people can disagree.

YucaLandia

May 21, 2012, 12:21 PM

Post #22 of 27 (5543 views)

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Re: [sandyr] Safety of west coast route through MX?

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The route between Matamoros and Vera Cruz was determined to be risky enough that several Mexican auto insurers had a formal policy of denying coverage for US and Canadian SUV drivers traversing the route roughly 6 months ago.

Have the insurance companies re-started covering expats traversing the Matamoros-Vera Cruz route? lo no se...

Safety conditions on the rural sections of highways in Tamaulipas and Vera Cruz were very poor around the time they replaced the Vera Cruz police. Hopefully they have improved.
steve
-
Read-on MacDuff
E-visit at http://yucalandia.com

sandyr

May 21, 2012, 12:54 PM

Post #23 of 27 (5529 views)

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Re: [YucaLandia] Safety of west coast route through MX?

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Interesting. In March of this year, I purchased Mexican auto insurance that is good for the entire country. I was not aware that some insurance companies prohibited driving in certain parts of Mexico.

YucaLandia

May 21, 2012, 2:35 PM

Post #24 of 27 (5508 views)

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Re: [sandyr] Safety of west coast route through MX?

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If you did not enter Mexico at Matamoros, then you likely would not have faced the restriction. We haven't had any more notices posted on our local Yucatan forum on this in the past 2 months, so, I suspect that Sanborns and the other company have lifted the restriction in the meantime.
-
Read-on MacDuff
E-visit at http://yucalandia.com

Reefhound

May 21, 2012, 2:44 PM

Post #25 of 27 (5507 views)

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Re: [sandyr] Safety of west coast route through MX?

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As I recall the insurers would write policies but were either claiming exclusions for total theft coverage or making it difficult to collect on claims. Every policy I've ever seen, USA or Mexico, has exclusions for war and insurrection. When the military is deploying thousands of troops to an area to specifically combat cartel violence in a public "war" on drugs, it could be argues that cartel vehicle jackings fall under this.

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