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Hound Dog

Apr 3, 2010, 9:36 AM

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San Cristóbal de Las Casas (1528-1990)

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We found a copy of the book; San Cristóbal De Las Casas; Su Historia Urbana, Demográfica Y Monumental, 1528-1990 by Andrés Aubry (1927-2007) which chronicles the unique development of the city over the past nearly 500 years.

There is a wealth of information about Chiapas and San Cristóbal in this book which some of you might find interesting but for now just what I find to be an interesting statistic from 1778 when the town had a population of 4,531 people the demographic breakdown of which I quote in the vernacular of the day with no politically correct scrubbing of the language by your faithful correspondent.

Of the 4,531 people identified in the 1778 census, the following demographic profile was published:
1,708 were classified as "indios"
1,522 were classified as "mestizos".
707 were classified as "negroes".
494 were classified as "whites" of which 70 were Spanish.

All the people classified as "Spanish" meaning not of mixed bloodlines, were men and the Spanish population was substantially less in 1778 than it had been in the past.

More later but no time right now.

(This post was edited by Hound Dog on Apr 3, 2010, 9:38 AM)

raferguson

Apr 3, 2010, 7:12 PM

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Re: [Hound Dog] San Cristóbal de Las Casas (1528-1990)

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Sounds like an interesting book.

I noted that there were more negroes than whites in that 1778 census.

The common myth is that Mexicans are a mixture of white Spaniards and native Indians, but they imported a lot of negro slaves as well. I don't know that the negroes are a secret, but it is not something that is often discussed or recognized.

Richard

http://www.fergusonsculpture.com

tonyburton

Apr 4, 2010, 12:19 PM

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Re: [raferguson] San Cristóbal de Las Casas (1528-1990)

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See http://www.mexconnect.com/...ico-a-brief-overview and
http://www.mexconnect.com/...rds-until-after-1810

(This post was edited by tonyburton on Apr 4, 2010, 12:21 PM)

La Isla

Apr 4, 2010, 2:56 PM

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Re: [raferguson] San Cristóbal de Las Casas (1528-1990)

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In Reply To

The common myth is that Mexicans are a mixture of white Spaniards and native Indians, but they imported a lot of negro slaves as well. I don't know that the negroes are a secret, but it is not something that is often discussed or recognized.

Richard

Yes, the common myth is that modern-day Mexicans are a mestizaje of indigenous peoples and Spaniards, but if you dig a bit into the facts, the presence of a number of African slaves in colonial-era Mexico is an acknowledged fact (acknowledged at least by historians). In most cases, there was a great deal of intermarriage with the native and Spanish population, so in most parts of the country, the African heritage of some Mexicans is not apparent to the eye. However, in some coastal areas, it is obvious. I remember on a trip to the city of Vera Cruz and alrededores , in a village outside the city, I ran into locals who obviously had some African ancestors. I believe that the same applies along the Costa Chica of Oaxaca and in some areas in Guerrero.

Hound Dog

Apr 4, 2010, 3:05 PM

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Re: [tonyburton] San Cristóbal de Las Casas (1528-1990)

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My thanks to Tony and Richard for their posts.

Dawg is not going to bore you folks with too much information from the book about the architectural and demographic history of San Cristóbal De Las Casas detailed in the above book which was the inspiration for this thread. Tony´s post added some historical context for understanding why there were so many people of African heritage living in San Cristóbal in 1778 but now I will try to entertain you with a facile history of San Cristóbal with the reminder to you that a little knowledge is a dangerous thing.

The Spanish, it seems, came to the high Jovel Valley in order to escape the rath of the Chiapas Indians who produced notably fierce warriors according to historians and kicked the collective Spaniard Butt down along what is now known as the Grijalva River near present day Chiapa de Corzo and convinced them of the efficacy of moving up the escarpment to the Jovel Valley, then populated by indigenous groups who also were hostile to the idea of a European takeover of their productive high mountain valley. Well, the Spanish, not being total fools, also brought along their African slaves and indigenous allies so they could establish their new regional capital in the valley and they came up with what I would call a successful plan. The Spanish immigrants rousted the indigenous farming the valley floor at that time and started their settlement which I believe they then called Villa Real surrounding that small settlement with permanent encampments/barrios of friendly indigenous communities who then formed, along with the rivers, human and natural barriers to invasion by the local, highly irritated indigenous communities surrounding them on neighboring hillsides and dedicated to the total annihilation of every Spaniard who ever set foot on the North American continent and their allies as well.

Today, the San Cristobal De Las Casas you see if you come here is a pretty decent replica of what the Spanish and their indigenous allies built in those days some 500 years ago. The small Spanish colony built their then small burg along a path now anchored by the ex-Convento Santo Domingo on one side and the Del Carmen Tower on the other and surrounded themselves with settlements they designated as barrios to fortify the natural defensive barriers constituted by adjacent rivers that rearly surrounbded the settlement. Then dispersed barrios were, in turn, surrounded by open cultivated fields and swamplands which became declared no-man´s lands as measures to discourage invasions by the surrounding hostile indigenous communities. Today, the historic center and then dispersed barrios have grown together into one moderately sized city so the notion of dispersed and diverse barrios of indigenous communities dedicated to various specific vocational activities is not readily apparent without study but keep in mond that each barrio and the historic center are graced by a church and plaza or plazuela so one can still discern the historic importance of this original urban plan and we'll have to go into that later.

Hound Dog

Apr 4, 2010, 4:13 PM

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Re: [tonyburton] San Cristóbal de Las Casas (1528-1990)

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Please allow me to comment on Tony Burton´s post entiltled, "Did You Know That Blacks (in Mexico) Outnumbered Spaniards Until 1810?"

From that post, I excerpt:

Recognizing the potential in 1831 (of U.S. slaves immigrating to Mexico)...Mexican Senator Sanchez De Toro. a signatory to the Act of Independence, called for assistance to any blacks wanting to move south on the grounds that this movement would possibly prevent Mexico being invaded by white Americans."

Senator Sanchez De Toro was rightly concerned about the nascent political movement in the United States in the mid-Nineteenth Century among U.S. imperialists to annex Mexico to the United States on the grounds, and I am quite serious here, that the Mexican homeland was one of the richest terrains upon the planet only deprived of proper exploitation for enrichment by capitalists by mismanagement by the governance of a combination of "... (incompetent) Spaniards, Negroes and Indians...." and that the only thing standing between Mexico becoming one of the greatest lands on the planet or continuuing as a back-water cesspool was management of those of Northern European ancestry from the United States. I promise you, dear reader, that if there was one positive outcome of the U.S. civil war beyond the end of sanctioned human bondage, it was the fact that the U.S. did not annex more of Mexico than it did because it was too busy re-annexing itself.

(This post was edited by Hound Dog on Apr 4, 2010, 4:15 PM)