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Hound Dog

Feb 27, 2010, 11:50 AM

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Religious Violence in Southen Mexico

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Daily on Google news I get a news recap of Chiapas State events as a sub-heading because I requested that that sub-heading be added to my personal daily opening news recap over Google but, normally, the news stories that appear there are of no particular consequence to those not living in or near Chiapas as do we much of the year.

There was this morning, however, a news story with a supplemental video that I believe some of you may find interesting even though the news source is the clearly biased Christian Broadcasting Network (CBN). The reason this story and accompanying video is interesting is that it concerns the ongoing high level of violence in indigenous communities between the traditional Catholic community and the evangelical protestant community as more and more community members opt for the messages of protestant evangelical missionaries which are disruptive of traditional village political structures intertwined with the traditional Catholic church.

I am not, by publishing this information taking sides in any way. I simply think the news story and accompanying video, which are totally biased toward the protestant view of the struggle, are, nevertheless, instructive for those who are curious as to just what is going on down here and the reasons these political/religious internecine struggles are so critically important in this region and result in so much violence.

I write this on Saturday, February 27th. To view the news story and accompanying video, go to Google news and request news of Chiapas. You will find a story headlined "Christians Under Continued Attack in Chiapas, Mexico". That story is about an attack by certain community factions CBN claims are allied with the EZLN and other leftist groups against Evangelical Christians in the Chiapas town of Tumbala. At the bottom of that news story, which was published by evangelical protestant oriented CBN and, is thus biased as expected, is a video also published by the network and produced by one Greg Musselman and concerns violence in the Chiapas indigenous community of Chamula and elsewhere. The subcontext of that video reads, "Greg Musselman of the Voice of the Martyrs Canada Recently Went to Chiapas" and this is his report.

Despite the clear and overwhelming bias of this report, discerning viewers will come away with some notion of how serious the struggle between the traditional Catholic heirarchy and those they view as evangelical usurpers is without being swayed by the fundamentalist filter. Many have and will die and become the victims of violence on all sides. This struggle is about more than Catholics against evangelical protestants or warring Christian factions; it is about power and tradition and disruptive if well intentioned evangelical zeal and who will prevail in the long run. I see no easy or short term resolution to this struggle but I am simply an outside observer.

(This post was edited by Hound Dog on Feb 27, 2010, 3:38 PM)

frito

Feb 27, 2010, 5:31 PM

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Re: [Hound Dog] Religious Violence in Southen Mexico

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It doesn't help that Pope John Paul II spoke out against evangelicals when he visited Latin America. I'm sure he wasn't inciting men to violence, but few things get people riled up like suggesting their particular beliefs are false. I think where protestants go wrong(and I'm one) is trying to convert Catholics as opposed to approaching people outside of Christendom. And if it was up to me Christ would be promoted through good works over a long period, not intense theatrical sessions designed to strike fear if they don't act immediately.

joaquinx

Feb 27, 2010, 6:56 PM

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Re: [Hound Dog] Religious Violence in Southen Mexico

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Hound Dog

Feb 28, 2010, 6:54 AM

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Re: [joaquinx] Religious Violence in Southen Mexico

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Many of these villages rest on common land, owned and worked by the community. The glue that holds the community together is a common culture. Once the culture is fractured, even a little, it eventually breaks down. Next will be a demand for individual plots of land and the failure to contribute to the maintenance of the community. Streets, community buildings, their own social welfare system all begin to suffer from the cultural breakdown. Change is very damaging to a culture that is frozen in time.

Well and succinctly put joaquinx.

Regardless of one's religious views or lack of same, that short paragraph sums up the seriousness of the social disruption caused by incursions by foreign missionaries and subsequent ongoing mission development by their local disciples in a way those not directly involve can understand. Regardless of whether or not the observer is sympathetic with the cause espoused by the teams of protestant missionaries from outside the affected communities whose message is antithetical to the teachings of the traditional church and community elders , the fair observer cannot deny that the message is revolutionary in nature - even seditious. That same observer may view that message as a good or a bad thing or even a manifestation of ineluctable change but it is important to understand that movements that attempt to destroy traditional order in communities the world over breed violence. That's life. Think of what would happen in your own small community with a social order and wealth and power distribution based, say, upon traditional capitalist dogma, if missionaries favoring radical social, political and religious change that would revolutionize that order showed up one day and took to your streets with their disciples in tow threatening what you considered your well-being spiritually, economically and within the existing social/political order. Maybe you would fight back, no?

(This post was edited by Hound Dog on Feb 28, 2010, 6:57 AM)

raferguson

Feb 28, 2010, 2:28 PM

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Re: [Hound Dog] Religious Violence in Southen Mexico

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My understanding is that if one is a member of an indigenous community, and converts to an evangelical church, one is likely to be thrown out of the community. I understand that there are whole villages outside of San Cristobal of people thrown out of their villages.

Part of the issue is that the indigenous community requires that you contribute to the cultural/religious festivals. These festivals tend to involve drinking. Evangelicals are very opposed to alcohol, even though Jesus converted water to wine. So if somebody is not willing to contribute, that alone could get one thrown out.

The religion in the traditional villages is kind of a synthesis or mixture of Catholicism and the pre-Columbian religion. If you walk into the church in San Juan Chamula, you can see the strange mixture.

Richard

http://www.fergusonsculpture.com

Vichil

Feb 28, 2010, 9:18 PM

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Re: [raferguson] Religious Violence in Southen Mexico

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The type of Catholicism practiced in the villages around here is called Tradidional Catholicism.
The villages all have private and communal land. The villages are run by a group of elders who are tied in to the church. All charges are linked to the church as well. People are drafted or chosen after their wedding into the cargo system.

The indigenous villages draft their people into various services to serve the community. The services vary from police to garbage pick-up , to grave digger, to be danzante, to keep the church clean and supplied with flowers ,taking care of Santos and so on.
It is an honor to be chosen for a cargo. The cargo varies from 1 to 3 years. The first cargo has to be performed by the chosen person. There is usually a period of rest between cargos and the second..third and so on cargo can be assumed by someone the happy chosen pays to do the work, if he cannot perform his duty. It is a way of paying taxes...
Much alcohol is used but it is not the source of the problem with the evangelists. The problem is that the evangelist refuse to perform the cargo as they are linked to the Catholic church.
I know a village where the problem started as the evangelists did not want to work in the cemetary as it was a catholic cemetary,because they did not want to work there,
they were denied the right to be buried there and so on...
Many people live on communal land and lose the land and the house when they are expulsed. They also end up loosing their land even if privately own as it is too dangerous for them to go back.
It is said that 45 000 people lost their home and land and moved around San Cristobal and started new villages.
The Evangelists are known for 3 things prohibition of alcohol, cleanliness, they are tought to wash clothes often and their villages are known to always have laundry out drying. and the importance of reading and writing.
The land that is seized back by the village gets redistributed to the friends of people in power .
A friend of mine who is a man whose family was kicked out of Chamula 15 years ago tells me that Chamula is now allowing Evangelists to live in the municipality. He may be correct but we still see a lot of problems beeing reported in the newspapers about
Evangelists being attacked on the street or when starting a church in the municipality. A couple of weeks ago there were troubles in the municipality of Zinacantan as well.
A month ago there was a demonstration in the street of San Cristobal about expulsion and attacks of Evangelists. The problem is not over yet as far as I can see and cannot be resolved as long as the high degree of intolerance and ignorance are present.

I know of Zapotec villages tin Oaxaca that are known to be very tradtional but have resolved most of these problems by making changes to accomodate the Evangelists showing it is possible to work out problems .

Not so in Chamula and in may villages in Chiapas.The Chamulans strike me as very intolerant and violent;or a couple of years ago , a new law was passed changing the number of years the local government would serve. I think they added one year to the currant administration. This was the cause of a huge riot in Chamula and the newly elected administration took over the government by force.
The battle took place in the middle of town and PRI fought PRI and the old President had to go. They decided the new laws violated customs and usage and refused to follow it.
The municipality of Chamula has over 100 000 people so it is a force to reckon with and a really hot potatoe around here.

I truly hope the religious problems can be solved but I am not too hopeful.