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Rosalinemg

Oct 12, 2008, 7:29 PM

Post #1 of 29 (8165 views)

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Retiring on a small budget

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A little while back there was an inquiry about living in Mexico on a restricted budget. I think that the person was wondering if it can be done on Social Security alone. Found a sight by a couple that is doing just that and thought others may be interested in how they are doing it. This sight is www.mexicalimaryann.com Great site and very interesting.

JohnnyBoy

Oct 12, 2008, 10:49 PM

Post #2 of 29 (8124 views)

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Re: [Rosalinemg] Retiring on a small budget

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Their blog is pretty nice. Better than mine. I can't seem to find time to update mine.

Unfortunately, like most people from NoB, they do not want to disclose specifics about their income and some other things that might make the information more meaningful to people who are searching for answers. For example, the new rental.

And your post almost had me writing: "Here we go again..." in that managing to live/survive "on Social Security alone" or "on a small budget" is just so vague as to be meaningless. Some people on Social Security get very little...maybe $150-$200 per month. Others get a lot more, as I understand, well over $2000 per month. So living on Social Security/small budget might mean as little as $300 per month for this couple, which I think most of us can agree is probably not doable. Or it could mean they are living on $4000+ per month, which we will agree is more than enough.

The problem is that people who read these posts about "Retiring and Living in Mexico on Social Security" say "Hey, I get Social Security" ergo I can retire and live in Mexico. Well, maybe. But maybe not. So what's the point of posting such meaningless information? I know you said "on a small budget" but you also mentioned doing it on Social Security alone. And you said their blog explained how they do it. I did not read the entire blog but among what I did read was no explanation of how they do it. No hints at how much Social Security gives them. They did not even state how much the new rental costs. So how can this blog explain to anyone how to live in Mexico on a small budget or on Social Security?

Again, I say, the blog is nice and interesting and might be helpful to someone investigating Mexico. But not the vague claim that you can do it "on Social Security alone" or "on a small budget."

I have stated in earlier posts that I will toot my horn on this topic any time I come across it. Why? Because too many people jump to the conclusion they can live well on very little, and in my opinion they cannot. So I encourage people to know the facts, to know their numbers, and not get sucked into a dream of sunny skies, warm beaches, cheap food, maids, gardeners, etc., etc. all "on Social Security alone."

Toot. Toot.

ken_in_dfw

Oct 13, 2008, 7:43 AM

Post #3 of 29 (8091 views)

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Re: [JohnBleazard] Retiring on a small budget

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Mary Ann does disclose more details about their budget and their expenses in comments following one of the early posts on her blog.
It sounds tight, but do-able. One advantage I see for retirees is that Medicare is right across the border, as Mary Ann says, in Calexico. As long as the law-and-order element stays orderly there, it's probably not a bad setup.

Ken

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Our budget is $1,500 a month - that’s what you need to get a one-year visa (which you really don’t need if you are willing to just cross the border and come back, once every 6 months. In Mexico, no one seems to check, and we could’ve come without a visa. Our first house (two bedrooms) was $350 a month. With our dog and cat it was a bit small, so we moved to a bigger place (1,000SF) for 5,500 pesos a month - splurging for us. Several months ago that was $550, but with the fall in the peso, it comes to $420 a month - a bit steep, but not a budget breaker. We have four bedrooms, two tiled baths (one is huge), a large living-room kitchen, a two-car garage with an automatic garage door, and a walled back yard of 500SF. Central A/C. We love it! Our food bills are less than the US, about $400 a month, gas is about $80 (cheaper here), TV & Internet about $70. Utilities run more when it’s hot, but average out to $150 (last water bill was $4.00) We eat out now and then. A neighbor lady has an outdoor restaurant, where we can get dinner for two for ten bucks. We see American movies in English at the very fancy Cinepolis, which is ten buck FOR TWO. Medicare is right across the border. So we are just barely making it, but life in the US would be nothing like this, at least for us. The pros - Mexico is a cash economy, so no one gives a hoot about a credit crunch. The cons - it gets hot in the summer.

Gringal

Oct 13, 2008, 7:53 AM

Post #4 of 29 (8084 views)

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Re: [JohnBleazard] Retiring on a small budget

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John: Information is available re the minimum Social Security benefits, and it is easy to find on the Gov't. web site. I'd suggest that would be a good first step before discussing it.

If memory serves, the minimun SS benefit is over $500 us. If two people have it, then it's enough to live in Mexico on a tight budget if their rent is low. No luxuries there, but surviving on that in the U.S. would be even harder.

As has been pointed out, web posts are in no way confidential. Most people would not post details of their finances for others to read, as a matter of prudence.

bournemouth

Oct 13, 2008, 8:08 AM

Post #5 of 29 (8080 views)

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Re: [kenhjr] Retiring on a small budget

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One of the advantages of living in Mexicali (if you disregard the terrible heat!) is that you could cross the border each 6 months to get a new FMT and not have to qualify for an FM3. However, drug violence has now reached into Mexicali and it would not be my option for retirement. However, different strokes for different folks.

esperanza

Oct 13, 2008, 8:38 AM

Post #6 of 29 (8072 views)

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Re: [bournemouth] Retiring on a small budget

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Because Mexicali is in the free border zone, you don't need an FM-T, and FM-3, or an FM-2 to live there. Lots of USA citizens live full time in the Mexican border zone and commute to the USA to work. Maryann and her husband chose to spend the money to acquire an FM-3, but they needn't have done it.

http://www.mexicocooks.typepad.com

bournemouth

Oct 13, 2008, 8:40 AM

Post #7 of 29 (8071 views)

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Re: [esperanza] Retiring on a small budget

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Actually Esperanza - you can stay in the free zone for up to 72 hours but after than you need an FMT - I'm sure many people skip that step but it is the requirement.

Rosalinemg

Oct 13, 2008, 10:03 AM

Post #8 of 29 (8044 views)

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Re: [JohnBleazard] Retiring on a small budget

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John, they do, as Ken points out, tell how much they are receiving in SS. They also go into detail of their monthly costs. My reason for posting this site was to give another point of view, it was, by not means, intended to encourage anyone to do this. However, if they have already decided to make the transition then this site would give them information. Of course on that income they would not be able to live in one of the tourist towns, but they seem to have chosen where they live so that they may live better than they could on that income NOB. For some people they live here because they can stretch their SS to live a little better and not merely survive - as would probably be the case if they stayed NOB. I am fortunate to have house that is paid for. However, I too am living on a very small pension - $750/month. It is a very tight budget, but should I have stayed in Canada I wouldn't even survive.

You are right that, for those who think that they can live here with maids, gardeners, and unlimited social activities on social security, it would not be possible. But for those who chose to live here without the luxuries we probably never had it is an option. We can still enjoy sunny skies, and depending on our person tastes, cheap food. And, if we choose to live in non-tourists areas, like this couple, we can rent at unheard of prices NOB.

As I said my reason for posting this site was to give another point of view and also because I found it very interesting.

BajaGringo

Oct 13, 2008, 11:12 AM

Post #9 of 29 (8021 views)

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Re: [Rosalinemg] Retiring on a small budget

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I always read these types of posts and yet seldom do I respond. It is like judging a contest for the most beautiful baby.

Your cost of living in Mexico can range from a few hundred dollars per month to several thousand. It all depends on where you live, whether you own/rent, how large a home/apt, diet, lifestyle, creativity and ability to speak Spanish. I know of a gentleman here in Baja that has a small, 2 BR house just a few blocks from the beach up on a hill with a great ocean view, internet, VOIP and cable. He receives $650 USD a month in SS benefits and teaches English to locals a few hours a week for some extra cash. His utilities are very low as he uses no heat or A/C with the local mild weather year round and tells me that he still manages to put away at least $100 USD a month into savings. He eats and shops like the locals and is not afraid to use public transportation to save gas and wear and tear on his pickup. I know of a retired couple who receive a combined $3800 USD per month in SS and pensions and they are struggling to make ends meet on that budgeted amount. They choose to live in a large home next to the beach with daily maid service, 2 car payments, eat out almost every day and refuse to use public transportation.

These are two cases on opposite extremes and your reality will probably fall somewhere in-between. Life in Mexico is what you make it and is largely influenced by your creativity, flexibility, adaptability and lifestyle expectations. I continue to say, if you are coming to Mexico only to save money you will probably not be happy with the lifestyle you end up with. If the savings in cost of living are more of a bonus to you, you may do very well here. You just need to be honest with yourself and what you expect to find...

Our House Building Project in Mexico...
Lomas de San Martin
Loving Life on the Baja Peninsula

Gringal

Oct 13, 2008, 12:15 PM

Post #10 of 29 (7998 views)

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Re: [BajaGringo] Retiring on a small budget

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Good post, Baja Gringo. It IS all about expectations. And, saving money is nice, but you'd better be happy in Mexico with the way Mexico is, or you'll have a world of frustration. Expats do a lot of "shoulding" about the way things are. A total waste of time. There are always reasons, and some of them don't make sense to the NOB mind, where "time is money" and money itself is so important. Your worker doesn't show up as promised. Turns out it was a family event, so even though he won't get paid for the day....it's first things first. You can either pace or shrug. If you can shrug.....life will go easier.

If you can get used to the eating options, it's going to save a bundle and provide a culinary adventure. Who says that life is about steak and potatoes?

Clothing options: same thing. You don't have to run around in a huipile, but why not adopt some of those comfy cottons that are available everywhere and give up on the "tailored" look. You'll feel cooler, and they'll be kind to your figure, too. Not to mention, no dry cleaning bills...and usually no ironing.

The money is part of it all..but it's tied into those other things, too.

JohnnyBoy

Oct 13, 2008, 12:16 PM

Post #11 of 29 (7997 views)

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Re: [Rosalinemg] Retiring on a small budget

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I knew I should have thoroughly read all the information on that blog. I just did not have time to read it all and also to write a rant about what has otherwise often been what I consider very misleading information.

In this case I am apparently wrong. And I admit it. In this case these people apparently have enough income, even from Social Security alone, to live in a fashion that is acceptable to them, in a location they like.

I probably forgot to thank you for your post and bringing these people's blog to our attention. This type of information is also good for some us already living in Mexico to see. So thank you.

The post by BajaGringo is also excellent. Your attitude about living in Mexico, your real motivations, and accepting a lower cost of living as a bonus, can surely make a world of difference.

BajaGringo

Oct 13, 2008, 12:38 PM

Post #12 of 29 (7991 views)

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Re: [JohnBleazard] Retiring on a small budget

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I really think that the greatest service we can offer folks considering a move to Mexico is honesty. Mexico is not for everybody any more than Alaska, Montana, Arizona or Costa Rica are. Each place has its good/bad/different and each person needs to make an informed choice based on their circumstances, needs, tastes. I love living in Mexico and couldn't imagine living anywhere else at this point in my life. But I am a crazy Gringo, fluent in Spanish and extremely flexible. The little inconveniences and unexpected twists and turns life throws at me here don't upset me a bit and I have learned to just accept my life here for what it is. Being able to eat fresh fish and lobster daily with a panoramic ocean view on my limited budget far outweighs anything that is less than perfect in my life down here. But that is me and others may have a very different view / experience. If you stop trying to make it just like your life NOB and accept it for what it is, you might come to really enjoy it. I believe that adapting to life here in Mexico has added another 20 years to my life.

But what do I know???

YMMV...

Our House Building Project in Mexico...
Lomas de San Martin
Loving Life on the Baja Peninsula

Rosalinemg

Oct 13, 2008, 1:10 PM

Post #13 of 29 (7981 views)

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Re: [JohnBleazard] Retiring on a small budget

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It does take a lot of personal changes to live here. It is true that it also depends on your expectations. Every day I thank God that I made the decision to move to Mexico. I dread to think of how I would be surviving in Canada on my pension now. Actually I doubt if I would be able to.

My taxes on this house are $30 a year, the utilities cost about $40 a month. In Canada these would probably eat up my pension. Of course the groceries are cheaper and I very seldom eat out. I am an excellent cook and prefer to eat my own cooking. I buy all my clothes in the stores where the Mexicans shop and do not worry about the latest fashion. I only use my car on the average of once a week to go to Walmart and do errands. I do use the public transport, not only to save gas, but also because I love the experience. My one extravagance are my dogs - all five adopted from the street. They cost me $60/month on average.

How has my life changed. Well, I had an executive job in Canada, lived in a downtown condo, never used public transport, ate out most days, and went out often. I was living what is considered "the good life." Had I brought the expectation of that life with me I would not be able to live here. However, I did not, and chose instead to integrated with the Mexican society.

Do I feel I made the wrong decision? Absolutely not! Am I saying that everyone should do it? Absolutely not! But I am glad I chose to because I love this country and the people. I feel that in moving here I changed my life for the better. My friends back home say they envy me. But actually what they are saying is that they could not do it because they would have to change and they cannot. So, for them they are happy where they are. And, that is okay!

wendy devlin

Oct 13, 2008, 1:20 PM

Post #14 of 29 (7980 views)

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Re: [Rosalinemg] Retiring on a small budget

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This is a topic, constantly revisted on forums like this one.

Note that this particular blog is 'new', September o8 new.

Personally, enjoy reading more the blogs, of ex-pats who have been in Mexico, over the years, blogging 'da good, da bad and da ugly'.
When BajaGringo says that he really thinks that the greatest service we can offer folks considering a move to Mexico is honesty, he mirrors my long-standing conviction and committment in my comments. And in the past, my articles.

And his statement: " Mexico is not for everybody any more than Alaska, Montana, Arizona or Costa Rica are." could not ring, truer in my mind.

Also on record, as advising, people, not to 'burn completely' any of their significant bridges from whatever homeland, they hail from before living in Mexico, full-time, at least a minimum of two years.

That people, not come to Mexico, seeking a panacae for whatever, they find overwhelmingly challenging where they are from. For not, will they face the old challenges, in a new form, but newer challenges to their expectations that they probably did not imagine.

Money in itself, will not buy happiness(as my dad used to say)
To which as a sassy teen replied, "But it helps!"

However, even though a person can live a simpler life perhaps then they are used to where they are from, do not underestimate the importance, of a 'nest-egg' from which to withdraw, when the unexpected, crops up.

So 'much' of Mexico, in my opinion, reveals itself, only, over time. The same kind of time, it takes to rebuild a 'new' life anywhere, with new friends and fresh challenges.

BajaGringo

Oct 13, 2008, 1:23 PM

Post #15 of 29 (7978 views)

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Re: [Rosalinemg] Retiring on a small budget

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I have find that many fear change in life and that is what keeps most folks right where they are. I think that a Bohemian spirit is a great trait as well to "enhance" your live experience south of the border. I stopped living my life based on what is considered "normal" by most years ago and it was one of the most liberating moves in life I ever made. Sounds like you have found that "freedom" as well...

Our House Building Project in Mexico...
Lomas de San Martin
Loving Life on the Baja Peninsula

jerezano

Oct 15, 2008, 1:24 PM

Post #16 of 29 (7860 views)

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Re: [Gringal] Retiring on a small budget

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Hello Gringal,

Social Security is based on the individual's earnings. Therefore there can be and are payments lower than $500 a month. My gross SS income is $376.40 a month. From that my Part B premiums are deducted but because of some regulation which says that full premium increases cannot be assessed if the net amount will drop, my net receipt is $271 a month. It has been in the neighborhood of that $270 figure now for more than 4 years. My monthly SS income usually increases a dollar a year because of the cost of living increase.

jerezano

Gringal

Oct 15, 2008, 3:52 PM

Post #17 of 29 (7824 views)

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Re: [jerezano] Retiring on a small budget

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Guess I had that minimum wrong. Thought it was more these days. Well, I COULD have checked the government website, couldn't I have?? Blush.

magoo4me

Oct 17, 2008, 9:20 AM

Post #18 of 29 (7727 views)

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Re: [Gringal] Retiring on a small budget

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As I understand it, a US resident, citizen or not under some circumstances, is eligible for Supplemental Security Income depending on age, state of residence, disability or lack thereof, assets, etc., and can get additional $$ on top of their social security payment. So, it looks like Jerezano and Gringal are both right. The minimum might be about $500 when including SS and SSI, but could be less if only based on the receipent's earnings.

jerezano

Oct 17, 2008, 11:06 AM

Post #19 of 29 (7702 views)

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Re: [magoo4me] Retiring on a small budget

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Hello:

magoo4me wrote about Social Security Supplemental Income:>> As I understand it, a US resident, citizen or not under some circumstances, is eligible for Supplemental Security Income depending on age, state of residence, disability or lack thereof, assets, etc., and can get additional $$ on top of their social security payment. So, it looks like Jerezano and Gringal are both right. The minimum might be about $500 when including SS and SSI, but could be less if only based on the receipent's earnings.

The problem with the Social Security Supplemental Income program is that the money is given to the States and each State then establishes its rules and regulations for distribution. Thus each State has different rules and regulations. I understand that most States will not issue SSSI to non residents. So, a resident in Mexico must then maintain residence in the state fn which he lived before moving. Can be done, clearly, but many times with difficulty.

Also other rules. I, because of other assets, cannot qualify for Supplemental Income in the state of Texas even though I do maintain residence there.

The point I was making with Gringal is that Social Security payments are based on a minimum number of quarters worked and the amount of money contributed to SS during those quarters. If the money contributed is minimum, then the SS payments can be really low. When I was still young working full time for the US Government (no Social Security coverage) I worked part time as a tax consultant and at other covered activities just to get in the necessary quarters. l did qualify but my contributions were minimum. While my SS income is a pittance those Medicare benefits have been really worth while.

jerezano

Brian

Oct 17, 2008, 11:56 AM

Post #20 of 29 (7693 views)

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Re: [jerezano] Retiring on a small budget

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jerezano

My situation is similar to your's. I worked for the government for thirty years without making SS contributions. I had, however, several quarters earned as a youngster delivering papers and working during school. When I retired, I chose to live just south of the border in Mexico so I could work three years part-time as an usher for the San Diego Padres. This gave me a total of 40 quarters and a SS pension of $375 per month. It would have been more except for government offsets for having both my wife and I with government pensions. We also qualified for Medicare.

maryannx

Feb 20, 2009, 9:45 PM

Post #21 of 29 (7457 views)

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Re: [kenhjr] Retiring on a small budget

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Thanks for disclosing where, on my website, I disclose my expenses. Now, with the peso approaching 15 to the dollar, my expenses are much much less.

MitchMan

Mar 7, 2009, 12:26 PM

Post #22 of 29 (7035 views)

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Re: [BajaGringo] Retiring on a small budget

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I think a great way to retire or live in baja is to find a beach town in Baja that you like and buy really cheap lot and build a small house on it. There is a lot of land for sale at really great prices if you are willing to go up to 1 mile inland from the beach. How long does it take to drive 1 mile to the beach? about 5 minutes.

You can find a residential lot of about about 300 sq meters (about 3,200 sq ft) with city services (sewer, running water, electricity, telephone) which is one mile from the beach for about $20,000 USD. You can hire a Mexican contractor to build a 1 bedroom house of 600 sq ft for about $43,000 USD. That's a total of about $63,000 USD. Utilities (propane, running water & electricity) for two people will run about $30 USD per month. Property taxes will be about $40 USD a year. Food budget will differ greatly (two people could cost anything from $200 to $600 USD per month) depending on your tastes and ability to cook and ability to know food prices. Costs for internet access and satellite TV is about $70 per month (learn Spanish to enjoy local TV broadcasts and eliminate Satellite TV, go to a local internet cafe for internet access and eliminate internet access from your house). For telephone communications, buy a Mexican cell phone and get a prepay plan and limit local calls to $20 USD per month. My plan allows me to call the USA in 20 minute blocks for only $1.20 USD per block. You can afford to have your 4 wheel drive giant truck or SUV because you won't need to drive it much. I only spend about $30 in gas per month for my truck.

Bottom line is, two people can live very comfortably on $5,000 a year in Baja for all the basic living expenses mentioned above. The $5,000 includes all the above monthly expenses plus Mexican Health Insurance for two people, and the cost of the Mexican Trust annual fee for the ownership of your home (about $550 per year). Expenses above the aforementioned $5,000 would be travel to and from the USA, hobbies, clothes, maintenance and repairs, monthly/annual rent for the residential dwelling you live in if you don't own a home, enterntainment, booze, and meals at restaurants. What you spend your money on depends on YOU completely.

By the way, most people who have become accustomed to living in the Baja adopt the common Mexican practice of spending a lot of time outside of the house. This will cut down on electricity quite a bit during the summer use of air conditioning and the amount of electricity for lights. Also, since the Baja is warm for 9 months out of the year, the pilot light in the 15 gallon water heater will keep the water hot enough for 24 hours for showering. Actually, I only turn on my water heater for 20 minutes a day and then for the rest of the 24 hours I put it on pilot flame only. Additionally, I barbecue fish and chicken and meat and certain vegetables as often as I can. I use mesquite wood as it grows wild in the Baja and I have an unexhaustible supply of it - saves on propane gas. Man I love this life style - it feels so real!

Carron

Mar 7, 2009, 1:17 PM

Post #23 of 29 (7012 views)

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Re: [MitchMan] Retiring on a small budget

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I agree with most of your budgeted items. Very realistic. We live basically on small SS income--less than $1200 US per month for the two of us. It is certainly doable with some significant adjustments in our lifestyle which we could never have made back in the US.

My question is about whether foreigners can actually purchase property in the area you are recommending?? Or does it require a long-term lease which is then serviced by a bank for an additional annual fee??

Septiembre

Mar 8, 2009, 9:23 AM

Post #24 of 29 (6907 views)

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Re: [Rosalinemg] Retiring on a small budget

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Just a comment that you should not evaluate your finances as applied to Mexico on the basis of the current exchange rate. Not all that many months ago, the rate was below 10 pesos to the buck. The reasons given for that at the time were the budget deficits of the U.S. Federal government and the trade deficits of the country as a whole.

Needless to say, those are still very much with us. What you are seeing now IMO is the result of a flight to cash as a result of the economic problems and the opinion of investors about the new administration. As for budget deficits, you probably already know those are far higher under said new administration.

I'd base my economic evaluation on 10 pesos to the buck if I were you.

MitchMan

Mar 8, 2009, 10:33 AM

Post #25 of 29 (6894 views)

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Re: [Carron] Retiring on a small budget

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Hi Carron,
In the Baja, the way to own real estate as a foreigner is in the form of a 50 Year Mexican Trust called a "fideicomiso". Currently, there are generally three types of property in Mexico 1)"Prohibited Property" which simply means Mexican real estate that is within 100 Kilometers (approx 62 miles) from a Mexican international border or is within 50 Kilometers of an ocean coast. That definition means that "all" of the Baja is considered "Prohibited Property" and such property requires ownership by foreigners to be in the form of a 50 year Mexican Trust. 2) Mexican real estate that does not fall within the definition of Prohibited Property and is NOT "Ejido" property. 3)"Ejido" property which is land grant property orignially given to Mexican peasants after the Mexican revolution where the government took away land from wealthy and/or large land holding families and redistributed to the poor citizenry. Ejido property has a poor title history and has important restrictions on who can own it and under what conditions. This type of property is not good for foreigners to buy as getting good title is extremely "iffy", especially due to the poor condition of title history and title records for that type of property.

The 50 year Mexican trust can be renewed at the end of the 50 year trust term by merely filing the correct documents and such renewal is considered to be absolutely perfunctory. This trust mechanism was created by the Mexican government to facilitate and encourage foreign ownership and investment in Mexican real estate. The way the trust works is that you are the beneficial owner (trustor of sorts) of the real estate with every and all rights of ownership including but not limited to the ability to re-sell it, rent it, build on it, exclude or allow access to anyone you want, and use it within the normal allowed usage of any real estate. You are the beneficial owner and you must select and have a Mexican bank be the trustee. This costs anywhere from $440 per year for every year of the trust's existance payable annually to the selected bank to $650 per year depending on which bank you select.

For non "Prohibited" real estate you can own it as a foreigner as "fee simple" ownership.

Caution, avoid buying ejido property. Hope this helps.

(This post was edited by MitchMan on Mar 8, 2009, 10:39 AM)

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