Mexico Connect
Forums  > General > Living, Working, Retiring
First page Previous page 1 2 Next page Last page  View All


jennifer rose

Feb 28, 2008, 7:06 PM

Post #26 of 34 (1313 views)

Shortcut

Re: [JohnBleazard] FM3 Rumor du jour

Can't Post |
Look at the pages of your FM-3 which are headed up with Primer Prorroga, Segundo Prorroga, etc. On the pages will be printed something like "per el pazo de un año que principio el die [INSERT DAY] del mes de [INSERT MONTH] de [INSERT YEAR], concluye el dia [INSERT DAY] del mes de [INSERT MONTH] de [INSERT YEAR]. Notice that dates inserted are one year less one day one year ahead of the first dates shown. The latter date is the expiration date.

Print out Ley Aduanera, Article 106 (IV) (a), which can be found at http://www.diputados.gob.mx/LeyesBiblio/pdf/12.pdf

If you are stopped by the fiscal police, feel free to pull out your copy of the Ley Aduanera and show that to them, along with your FM-3 or a copy thereof.

When you get your car permit, don't waste your time debating any points of law with the car permit folks. It's not their job to know and interpret the immigration law. Just get your permit, keep your mouth shut, and go on your way.


JohnnyBoy

Feb 28, 2008, 7:12 PM

Post #27 of 34 (1312 views)

Shortcut

Re: [jennifer rose] FM3 Rumor du jour

Can't Post | Private Reply
I never, ever debate or in any way attempt to reason with, convince, persuade, nada de eso. I knew long before I came to Mexico, probably as a result of living in Italy for several years (my Mexican friend says "Italians are just like Mexicans, except they [the Italians] have nicer cars") that that would probably only make matters worse.

I never do that.

Isn't whipping out a copy of the law and showing it to the policeman tantamount to arguing with him about the law? But I will get a copy of it and try to read it.

My FM3 has never been renewed so those pages are still blank.


(This post was edited by JohnBleazard on Feb 28, 2008, 7:17 PM)


Rolly


Feb 28, 2008, 7:19 PM

Post #28 of 34 (1309 views)

Shortcut

Re: [JohnBleazard] FM3 Rumor du jour

Can't Post | Private Reply
John, look here: http://rollybrook.com/article_106.htm

The one and only time I had a cop challenge my registration, I showed him a copy of Article 106, and he backed down.

Rolly Pirate


(This post was edited by Rolly on Feb 28, 2008, 7:30 PM)


Ed and Fran

Feb 28, 2008, 8:04 PM

Post #29 of 34 (1298 views)

Shortcut

Re: [JohnBleazard] FM3 Rumor du jour

Can't Post | Private Reply
I have a valid FM3 visa, but no where in the visa is there an expiration date.

Both times the officials there got all verklemmt because my FM3 visa does not have an expiration date in it.


And, as they stated: "We can only issue a permit up to the time your visa expires." Both times they formed a small committee there in the office to determine which of the two dates stamped and legible in the visa to use: the date the visa was issued in San Francisco, or the date when I first crossed into Mexico.


Well, I don't think that your FM3 is any different than any other. They don't show an expiration date, prior to the first renewal. The first line on page 4 should read "Este documento faculta a su titular a permanecer en el pais, en calidad de No Inmigrante...' and a duration, typically "Un año, 365 días". So you are allowed to remain in country 365 days. On page 3 the date is stamped when you entered the country. That's when the clock starts running on your 365 days.

Let me rephrase that. My local INAMI office interprets the 365 days as starting the day you get the FM3 document stamped at the border.

Just one more data point.

Ed


bournemouth

Feb 29, 2008, 6:21 AM

Post #30 of 34 (1277 views)

Shortcut

Re: [Ed and Fran] FM3 Rumor du jour

Can't Post | Private Reply
"Let me rephrase that. My local INAMI office interprets the 365 days as starting the day you get the FM3 document stamped at the border".

Ed - the same for the office in Guadalajara. The guys at KL 21, Nogales know that an FM3 is good for 365 days - they can still issue the car permit for the time remaining from the day the FM3 was issued, even if that is not the actual date of expiry and the permit would remain valid as the FM3 is valid.



jerezano

Mar 4, 2008, 7:50 AM

Post #31 of 34 (1227 views)

Shortcut

Re: [JohnBleazard] FM3 Rumor du jour

Can't Post | Private Reply
Hello John,

I cannot believe the stupidity of the people you are dealing with about your FM3 and your temporary vehicle import permit.

Your FM3 on page 3 clearly states the date of entry into México.

Your FM3 on page 4 clearly states the date of expiry.
On mine is the statement: Fecha de vencimiento: 14 de noviembre de 2008 en virtud de la fecha de su vencimiento de su FM3 anterior No. ... etc.

Just below on line l of the printed document is the statement in Spanish that This document (FM3) allows me to remain in Mexico as a Non Immigrant but as a Visitante Rentista for 365 days.

If your FM3 does not have the expiry date typed in, as does mine, the next statement about 365 days will automatically set the expiry date at midnight of the day before you entered México, eg, if you entered on November 15, your FM3 will expire on November 14 at midnight.

What could be clearer? What more could that office want?

Can't you just show them page 3 of your FM3, and then page 4? Can't they do a bit of math?

Adiós. jerezano.


JohnnyBoy

Mar 4, 2008, 8:16 AM

Post #32 of 34 (1222 views)

Shortcut

Re: [jerezano] FM3 Rumor du jour

Can't Post | Private Reply
Actually, Jerezano et al, I think that is exactly what they eventually have done. They do finally piece that logic together and they issue the permit for a certain number of days that they calculate from one of the official dates they see stamped in my FM-3 visa.

Both times this has occurred it was not at Km21 rather at Empalme. Both times when I went there to get vehicle permits it was a Saturday afternoon and I was the only customer there. The second time a couple arrived just as I was wrapping up. The point is, they don't seem to get a lot of business there and I think they are more accustomed to dealing with FMT visas than FM3 visas.

The young man there showed me the place in my visa where HE said the expiration date should have been stamped by the office here in Hermosillo when I registered the visa locally. That was his opinion. And that place is on page 4 right above there it says: "Este documento faculta a su titular a permanacer en el pais........."

I have not yet renewed my FM3 visa, so the dates that others of you have described as expiration dates are not yet in my visa.

This is all quite the little tempest in a teapot anyway, at least for me. I am rarely outside the Sonora Free Zone anyway, where I do not need a vehicle permit. But I do like to stay legal so I got the two permits for a couple of brief and rare occasions when I was venturing outisde the Sonora Free Zone. I probably won't have to do that again until early next year. By then I will have renewed my FM3 visa. I am going to get a copy of the pertinent Mexican document and keep it in my car.

If I get stopped and dinged for the "expired" vehicle permit and showing them the document does not help, I suspect the fine won't be as much as a new vehicle permit anyway, and I will just pay it.


jerezano

Mar 4, 2008, 8:54 AM

Post #33 of 34 (1218 views)

Shortcut

Re: [JohnBleazard] FM3 Rumor du jour

Can't Post | Private Reply
Hello John,

You said:>>One could argue that if I renew the FM3 visa before it expires, as I intend to do, it won't expire and so the vehicle permit won't expire either. I don't think I want to try to explain that technicality to a Mexican policeman any time soon.<<

You should not have to ever explain that to any policeman. They should know it already. But just in case, see below.

You should carry in your car a copy of the appropriate section of the Law Aduanero. That law states very clearly that the temporary importation permit for the car remains in effect so long as your Immigration status is effective. Go to Rolly's site to download a copy of that section, print it out, and keep it in your car. I used to carry one all the time before I got a Mexican-plated car and I did have to show it twice years and years back, before the adueneros were so well instructed.

As to renewing your FM3, you should be advised that you have 30 days in which to do it before your FM3 expires. And in most regions you cannot apply for renewal before that 30 day period begins. I understand that in exceptional circumstances, the Immigration Service MAY let you make the application early. It depends upon the flexibility of your local office.

As I mentioned in an earlier post somewhere in answer to one of your earlier postings, my immigration office here in Zacatecas on a renewal FM3 always types in the expiry date of the renewed FM3. Your office may or may not. But again, the expiry date is as of midnight the day before you entered Mexico for the first time on your FM3. It is NOT the date of issue, as your Aduanero people there in Sonora have decided in the past. Nor is that expiry date on your temporary import certificate of any effect (or use, or importance) so long as you maintain your immigration status. Your FM3 is what determines when the temporary import certificate runs out.

As to getting a new permit to enter Mexico every time I leave here (which I do at least 4 times a year) I personally cannot advise that. Why pay extra money and go through the hassle for something that is not necessary? Of course, if you are worried about theft of your vehicle or some such, then why not? But I have enough to worry about without asking for more.

You also said:>>If I get stopped and dinged for the "expired" vehicle permit and showing them the document does not help, I suspect the fine won't be as much as a new vehicle permit anyway, and I will just pay it.

If you have a copy of the appropriate section of the Ley Aduenero and show it to the "policeman" you will not be fined. But if he insists that would be a mordida. My Mexican friends tell me that it is well recognized here all over Mexico that the maximum mordida is $200 pesos. Do not pay more than that. The policeman making the demand will no doubt accept that. If not, become adamant and roll with the punches. You can always report name rank and number to the Department of Tourism which believe it or not, does have some weight and will get back to that policeman sooner or later. And he knows it.

By the way, for what it is worth, I am now driving a Mexican plated vehicle and the last 5 times I have reentered Mexico with my FM3 in my hand, that FM3 has NOT been looked at, nor even asked for. I have just been waived on through. So, it just might be worth while to pay the extra money for a Mexican vehicle. Temporary liablility insurance for the USA is cheap.

Adiós. jerezano.


(This post was edited by jerezano on Mar 4, 2008, 9:45 AM)


tashby


Mar 4, 2008, 3:37 PM

Post #34 of 34 (1189 views)

Shortcut

Re: [tashby] FM3 Rumor du jour

Can't Post | Private Reply
Update: Well, I got my FM3 at the Seattle Consulate today. Frankly, it could not have been much easier. Assuming you meet the criteria outlined in my previous post in this thread, and if you in fact need an FM3 and are within the Seattle Consulate's jurisidiction, there's no reason not to get it here.

After gathing the documentation they require (specified earlier in this thread) I went there yesterday. Spent about 15 minutes waiting in line in the very crowded main room, then once I reached the window and showed my completed app with support docs was told I needed to go next door, ring the buzzer for entry and when asked via the speaker on the buzzer, mention the super-secret password to gain access. I kid. It is, I guess, currently the name of the Consular agent who is in charge of FM3s. I enter the much quieter, less crowded/hectic room, and drop off my application to the man who had, weeks prior, given me the info and application in the first place. This was late morning on a Monday. He told me to come back around 11am the next day. I did, wondering whether I'd be receiving my FM3 at that point, or whether I'd be told my application was denied.

Returned the next day, went straight to the controlled via doorbell room as instructed, and went to the counter. He was helping others so I sat down. 15 minutes later he was taking my photo and fingerprints, along with the $134 fee - CASH ONLY at this time - and said to return at 1:30 to pick up my Visa.

And I did.

Don't think I ever spent more than 15-20 minutes at the Consulate during any of those three visits. Fantastic. The Seattle Consulate makes it E-Z.


(This post was edited by tashby on Mar 4, 2008, 3:41 PM)
First page Previous page 1 2 Next page Last page  View All
 
 
Search for (advanced search) Powered by Gossamer Forum v.1.2.4