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macmember

Dec 7, 2007, 11:02 AM

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Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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Since Carol and Norma (from "Falling in Love with San Miguel") just returned from their trek to McAllen Texas for Medical and Car reasons, I thought I would tell you our experiences in McAllen. Carol and I have had a conversation, via Email, about the difference in the way we both feel about McAllen.

We had thought about moving to Mexico for an inexpensive retirement and have made a couple of trips there for research. There were friends in the Dallas Texas area that had been to McAllen several Winters for the more temperate weather. We decided to go and check it out. Compared to Mexico this is what we found:

1) Very cheap Real Estate, we preferred the 55+ gated mobile home communities, for the activities, amenities and no families w/children * see list below
2) Very good Medical care, that allows you to use Medicare
3) Every kind of restaurant you could ask for with very reasonable prices and Sanitation Laws
4) From Sept to April, tremendous amount of inexpensive entertainment (similar to Branson) while the Snowbirds are there.
5) Public services and safety net in case of emergency
6) Tremendous shopping with every American item we are used to having, with no duty and import costs .
7) Property standards/ Noise control/ consistent controlled Electricity/Potable Water/Good Telephone Service/Animal Control/Real Postal Service/less corrupt Police.
8) Mexican Dentists, Prescriptions and cheap Liquor are about 3 miles away, over the Border. Retirees go across for inexpensive Haircuts & Permanents too.
9) You do not have to speak Spanish in order to handle any business . There is not the red tape and bribes involved in getting services.
10) The Ocean 1 hour and 15 minutes away
11) You can work full or part time if you need the extra income.

* activities and amenities in the park we liked were: pot luck suppers, pancake breakfasts, ice cream socials, cards, dominoes, movie nights, bingo, all kinds of arts and crafts, water aerobics, libraries, exercise rooms, woodworking shops, pool rooms, horseshoes, shuffleboard, all types of dancing (polka, salsa, Line Dancing, Square dancing, Round Dancing, ballroom, 50's music, Country and Western etc), Spanish lessons, Bible classes, Book Clubs. You can also join others in volunteering in different Charities. They have beginner lessons for all of the types of dancing.

Also the area has the McAllen Civic center, Weslaco Visitor Center, Harlingen Municipal Auditorium, Mercedes Showgrounds, just to mention a few. From Sept to April they have all kinds of shows from groups that appear in Branson and Las Vegas. The prices are very reasonable.

These types of things interest us. Carol and Norma have been there, done that and hated it. Some people are into the more Cultural activities and love it. There is always going to be people that have different interests and thank goodness we are all different. It would be too crowded if everyone went where we like to go.

I know that the people in Arizona are having high Crime due to the Illegal Aliens crossing there. We did not see or hear of high crime in McAllen. They do have the same amount of car theft that we have in the Dallas area. The Retirees use the Mexico crossing at Progresso rather than the Reynosa because they say it is set up more for the Americans. I can't explain that.

Our plans, when my Husband gets to retire in 2009, are to buy a place in McAllen, stay there Sept - March or April. Close it up and go to Mexico during what will be the low season, to rent there. We will stay in higher altitudes April and May (until the night rains come) and then go to areas like Lake Chapala and or San Miguel Allende for the rest of the Summer.

We do not even have to drive if we choose not to. You can take an Executive Bus to any town in Mexico directly from McAllen or you can take a cab over the Border and catch an Executive Bus there. We really enjoyed the Long Distance Buses when we travel Mexico. They are as nice as a First Class seat on most Airlines and have small restrooms and Movies. This would keep us from having to buy Mexican Car Insurance and the possibility of getting involved with the Police for an accident or them just needing a bribe. We feel as safe on the Buses as anyone is, on the highways and streets in Mexico.

Of course all of these plans are contingent on us not winning the lottery. If we win the lottery then we will move to SMA the next week and buy a beautiful Hacienda.

McAllen will never compare to SMA for ambiance or Cultural Activities but it is what we can afford at this time.

If you have any questions about McAllen , you can Email me at macmember@verizon.net

(This post was edited by macmember on Dec 7, 2007, 2:00 PM)

Gringal

Dec 7, 2007, 2:29 PM

Post #2 of 32 (2780 views)

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Re: [macmember] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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Am I missing something here? You described the pleasures of living in a senior mobile home park in Texas, but at the end, said that if you won the lottery, you'd scoot to San Miguel and live the good life there. Wouldn't you miss the mobile park life?

Ron Pickering W3FJW

Dec 7, 2007, 2:58 PM

Post #3 of 32 (2773 views)

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Re: [Gringal] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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If I won the lottery, you'd find me on a small island in the South Pacific............
Getting older and still not down here.

macmember

Dec 7, 2007, 3:22 PM

Post #4 of 32 (2769 views)

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Re: [Gringal] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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Gringal..... the difference would be the money, to be able to live nicely in SMA. The price in Real Estate is a big factor.

If I had all the money I would ever need, I would probably go for the big Hacienda and be able to pay to have people handle all my problems. I could afford the water purification system, a whole house electrical voltage system, to pay for all my Medical care out of pocket, not need a part time job, eat at the nice $$ restaurants and go to all of the entertainment without considering the cost.

What I was trying to show was that you could live so much cheaper in McAllen than the nicer areas of Mexico because you don't have to worry about so many things. The Real Estate and the Medicare is a huge part of the equation.

I was also making the point that there are many things to do in McAllen that are less expensive altho they are different.

Anonimo

Dec 7, 2007, 3:54 PM

Post #5 of 32 (2761 views)

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Re: [macmember] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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Did anyone mention the McAllen, TX weather. Or the "scenery"?

"En Boca Cerrada No Entran Moscas."

Saludos,
Anonimo

macmember

Dec 7, 2007, 5:15 PM

Post #6 of 32 (2747 views)

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Re: [Anonimo] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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Anonimo.........I think I did say that there was no comparison in the ambiance. :-)

If I were looking for "cheap living", scenery would not be a consideration for me. It might be something others would consider. Like I said, we are all different.

As far as Weather, it does get hot in McAllen in the Summer, that is why we are planning on going to the "Highlands of Mexico" during that time and renting a small place. It is not any hotter than Dallas in the Summer, where I have lived all my life. We go from the house to the car to the store and back, all in air conditioning here and would do the same if we were in McAllen, only living a lot cheaper.

The title was "Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen". Never, did I say which one I would prefer to live in. I guess I did when I said, winning the Lottery would allow me to buy a Hacienda in Mexico. But since the odds of that are slim, looks like I will have to live within my Budget.

I did not mean to ever run down any town in Mexico, just stating the facts that helped us make up our minds.

(This post was edited by macmember on Dec 7, 2007, 5:20 PM)

esperanza

Dec 7, 2007, 9:02 PM

Post #7 of 32 (2712 views)

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Re: [macmember] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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Macmember, it's hot even in Mexico's Central Highlands during the last part of March, all of April and May, and the first part of June. Don't count on relief from McAllen's heat by going to higher altitude during those months. Guadalajara and the area around Lake Chapala, at approximately 5200 feet, often hit 90 degrees or more. Morelia, at 6400 feet, is about the same. San Miguel de Allende will be as hot. It's not at all humid here during that season of the year, but it surely is hot.

http://www.mexicocooks.typepad.com

GueroPaz

Dec 7, 2007, 10:33 PM

Post #8 of 32 (2698 views)

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Re: [Gringal] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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If the only choice were between McAllen and SMA, I'd pick San Miguel. I lived in Brownsville and Port Isabel, and found the Lower Rio Grande Valley of Texas to (generally) be a very depressed area economically and socially. Maybe McAllen is the exception. Seniors are lucky to make $10 an hour; my full time wage in 2002 was only $7.50 for accounting work in which I was overqualified. And the same wage applied to fluent, bilingual, inbound telemarketers on the night shift! There just aren't many jobs in the valley.

My point, politely, is that there are far more choices. Here in Thailand, expats act as if the only places to live are Bangkok and Pattaya, or Phuket Island. There's far more to Mexico than San Miguel or Lake Chapala. We have dozens, or even hundreds of choices, just as Americans can choose between hundreds of cities.

bournemouth

Dec 8, 2007, 6:39 AM

Post #9 of 32 (2671 views)

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Re: [esperanza] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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But - it does cool down at night in the highlands, which it does not in Arizona (depending on the elevation of course) and I'm sure Texas too. We do not find the heat in the Lake Chapala area to be a problem but that is after many years of living in the desert of Arizona - it all depends where you come from is probably my point.

esperanza

Dec 8, 2007, 6:44 AM

Post #10 of 32 (2667 views)

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Re: [bournemouth] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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Bournemouth is right. It does cool down at night in the Central Highlands during the heat of the spring. Daytime highs can be in the 90s, but (a) it's a very dry heat with humidity as low as 10% or less and (b) it cools down at night to the mid-60s.

http://www.mexicocooks.typepad.com

jerezano

Dec 8, 2007, 7:50 AM

Post #11 of 32 (2653 views)

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Re: [esperanza] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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Hello macmember and others,

Macmember has described pretty much in detail all the advantages of living in a trailer park in McAllen, Mission, Pharr, San Juan, or any of the other towns all the way to Harlingen and Brownsville. He describes McAllen since that is where they have lived. But the same advantages are there in the other towns. Those advantages are real. I have lived in both McAllen and Harlingen and my present permanent residence is now in Harlingen, although for all practical purposes I live permanently in Jerez, Zacatecas, Mexico.

Their plan to rent in Mexico in the Highlands to get out of the heat of the Rio Grande Valley in the spring and summer s a good one. I would suggest that they consider the mountain town of Galeana (my first recommendation)at the top of the San Roberto canyon, or if they should want to be closer to Monterrey but still out of the contamination area perhaps Huachachil or Lirios or San Antonio? or any of the small towns in the Apple growing region. They would definitely be out of the heat and at altitudes sufficiently high to maintain pleasant summer temperatures. Too, all these towns would be sufficiently close to the border that within 5 to 7 or 8 hours at the most they could be back in McAllen should an emergency arise. Those mountain towns around Saltillo are overlooked by many people fleeing the heat and running to the highlands of Mexico. It is not necessary to go deep into Mexico to find comfortable mountain temperatures. A bit farther into Mexico would be on the mountain in back of Cd. Victoria. From there to McAllen would be a good 9 to 10 hours.

If I won the lottery I would buy a mansion in Hawaii, but my daughter would buy in Tahiti. This difference is due to personal experiences. I have never been to Tahiti. We can all dream.

Adiós. jerezano

Gringal

Dec 8, 2007, 9:14 AM

Post #12 of 32 (2632 views)

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Re: [macmember] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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I guess that if I won the lottery, I'd be living right where I am. The pleasant December sun is on my sala, and though the lake is polluted, it's sparkling. Ahhh. I might have a "second home" over on the coast during the cooler months of the year. I'd have a fatter "medical savings account" to cover the worst case scenarios and save me from the prospect of submitting to the U.S. medical establishment. I don't want the hacienda lifestyle, complete with maids and gardeners. I don't need the foodie pleasures of high end dining more than once in a while. Burp.

My point is that there really is no fair way to compare cheap living in Mexico with cheap living in McAllen, TX.

It's strictly about priorities. Ambiance, good climate and some fine scenery are so high on my list that they trump most other, possibly more sensible, considerations. My idea of Retirement Hell would be, to be honest, a seniors' mobile home park in Texas. They would probably toss me out of the Bingo game for being a smartass, and I wouldn't blame them. These discussions about where it's cheaper are, to me, completely hopeless because of the basic difference in peoples' needs, desires and dreams.

Some people are miserable without the safety net provided by the Medicare, Medicaid, and emergency poverty care systems. They should no more consider moving to Mexico than they should take up bungee jumping.

Oscar2

Dec 8, 2007, 12:19 PM

Post #13 of 32 (2598 views)

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Re: [macmember] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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I got a phone call this morning from an elderly lady with a squeaky but certain voice who asked me to identify myself and after doing so, she as a matter of fact, informed me that I had hit the lotto for a 950 million dollars tax free.

Shocked, bewildered and shaken to the roots of my existence, not knowing what to do, I contacted a lawyer, hired one of the best international social directors available, an international property manager and excellent pilot for my new jet, and one for my helicopter who had exceptional talent in landing safely on my new yachts helipad.

Known and in keeping with my conservative and very modest lifestyle aspirations, of coarse I’d remain low key and restrict my large bashes to weekends only. My homes in the highlands of Mexico would complement my beach villas facing the open sea and adjacent to a harbor where my helicopter could fly us to my awaiting yacht for whimsical cruises.

Ahh, the simple life, it has always had a special appeal for me. And its all so easy, especially when I can just lie on my hammock and a kaleidoscope of dreams can visit with just the closing of the eyes.……

Gringal

Dec 8, 2007, 1:04 PM

Post #14 of 32 (2591 views)

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Re: [Oscar2] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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Hot dang ! You go, Oscar. The great thing about dreams: They're price-less.

(This post was edited by Gringal on Dec 8, 2007, 1:15 PM)

Oscar2

Dec 8, 2007, 1:29 PM

Post #15 of 32 (2579 views)

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Re: [Gringal] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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I knows it...

Ron Pickering W3FJW

Dec 8, 2007, 2:36 PM

Post #16 of 32 (2564 views)

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Re: [Gringal] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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But they can also cause deep depression when way down deep you know it will never happen..........
Getting older and still not down here.

cristalhombre

Dec 8, 2007, 9:39 PM

Post #17 of 32 (2503 views)

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Re: [Ron Pickering W3FJW] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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Its reported here in Washington State that approx 30% of state Lotto winners will declare personal bancruptcy before the end of the 20 year annuity payout is completed. Sure.......... a little extra cash would be nice for anyone, but the downside for many Lotto winners is, fairly horrific. People just out spend their earnings. Big Time!! Drugs, alcohol and other BAD karma follow along.

There was a lengthy article in the Seattle Times several years ago and it sure made me think twice about what I might wish for. Same goes for you dreamers of SMA living without a FAT wallet.

Personally, I would rather have a place in SMA than the casa I have in Ajijic, simply because I find SMA more 'interesting and alive' (OK I have only spent a couple of weeks in SMA, so Gringal you can set me straight on this limited observation, you having lived in both) but I did like it, REALLY LIKED IT!!!.........BUT clearly I can NOT afford it. Specifically to live in the Centro area without a car (by choice).

So the runner up, Ajijic, is where I visit and will spend winters one day. Now that is NOT to say I have any beef with Lakeside. Just liked what I saw and engaged in, while a part of the SMA cultural creativity scene. It sorta has that Sante Fe feel to it, where Ajijic reminds me of Mesa, AZ (great weather, nice folks......... limited on the introspective side of life)

OK..........I am not trying to generate HATE mail. Just my personal observations.

For the record I have been to McAllen, visiting former neighbors from my Midwest days as a youngster. Jim and Marge are inside one of those HUGE trailer parks escaping Green Bay, Wisconsin in the winter. They LOVE it too. Not for me, but we all value different things, and I have a BIG "Arts" appetite to satisfy, so Bridge and Scrabble get old pretty quick. BUT.....If my only options were Good Sam trailer village or Lake Michigan lakeshore in January.........I'd take that double-wide in a flash! One advantage to McAllen, you can ride a three wheel bike with a HUGE basket on it to the store......very FLAT, that's about the only benefit I noticed.

I guess it really does come down to what one can afford.

"NOT ALL WHO WANDER ARE LOST...."

macmember

Dec 9, 2007, 10:16 AM

Post #18 of 32 (2455 views)

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Re: [cristalhombre] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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Cristalhombre......I have seen television shows about the disasters you mentioned, that beset people that have come into large amounts of money. It is very sad, but you have trouble feeling sorry for them. Anytime drugs & alcohol are involved, no amount of money is enough.

I had a talk with God and said, "Lord, just give me a chance to show you, that money will not change me." LOL

Gringal

Dec 9, 2007, 11:22 AM

Post #19 of 32 (2445 views)

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Re: [cristalhombre] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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Geesh. Who could get into hate mail over questions about where to live? Sad case, if so.

A little comparison re San Miguel and the Lakeside area:

San Miguel is a true "tourist town" that gets the full brunt of the large number of holiday visitors from Mexico Sity and elsewhere. Restaurant prices are "tourist" prices. Wish I could say the food justifies them. Not, on the whole. If you like crowds jostling for parking, sidewalk space and a table at a restaurant, you'll love it.
Traffic is beyond terrible. No stop lights, and busses, taxis and private vehicles move at a glacial pace through town, spewing pollution. Cough, cough. However, these are the very things that help create the magic "buzz."

At first glance, a person would think that living in Centro within walking distance to "everything" would be ideal. Then comes the sticker shock. You discover that the mediocre place downtown is way over a half mil. There are, however, plenty of houses for under $300K, many of them newer, and within a 15 minute walk to downtown. It is easier to sleep there, too, since your working neighbors need to rise early.

You can live in San Miguel about as cheaply as in the Lakeside area. You can't listen to real estate salesmen who tell you that you need to have an $800K house to live there. You can check the real estate websites to verify this. Premier and Coldwell Banker have extensive listing pages.

As for the population, many people come to San Miguel to "find themselves" or "reinvent" themselves. I have limited patience with those folks, but some people really get into that and love that sort of environment. There are endless seminars willing to relieve such people of their money to help them on their journeys. Strangely, this all contributes to the "buzz". You know, like when the circus comes to town: a sense of endless possibility.
The Lakeside area has their fair share of creative types, too. Because there is such a large expat population here, there is a soup for every taste, culturally.

My advice to anyone is RENT for awhile. Six months to a year, at least. I lived in SMA over three years. In Ajijic since last spring. They are both fine places to live. I do know what you mean about that double wide in Arizona looking pretty good, compared to a winter in Michigan - but what do I know? I'm from California.

(This post was edited by Gringal on Dec 9, 2007, 11:47 AM)

Anonimo

Dec 9, 2007, 11:32 AM

Post #20 of 32 (2440 views)

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Re: [macmember] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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In Reply To

We live relatively cheaply here, about 8 miles out of Pátzcuaro, in the countryside. We can't shop for much though, as there are only two, small tiendas within walking distance. For serious shopping, we drive or take a combi van into Pátzcuaro. Once a month or so, we do Costco and such in Morelia, 40 minutes drive.

Of course, everyone has their own priorities and needs. Ours are inexpensive living in a decent climate. It's a real plus that the scenery is so beautiful here also. The people are friendly, and welcome us, for the most part. However, most of our social life is with other North American (U.S. and Canada) retirees and expats.
http://www.pbase.com/panos/las_cuevas

"En Boca Cerrada No Entran Moscas."

Saludos,
Anonimo

RickS

Dec 9, 2007, 2:43 PM

Post #21 of 32 (2401 views)

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Re: [macmember] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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Well, macmember, I guess I too could shoot about 50 holes in your informational post... but instead I'll just say 'thanks' for taking the time and effort to post it. It's an alternative that may have some benefit to someone (obviously to no one here, but I guess this is a Mexico-Interest forum....). And at least you went out of your way to make sure you 'informed without suggesting it was the only way to go'. Hope you enjoy your upcoming and probably well earned retirement.... in both the US and Mexico.

macmember

Dec 9, 2007, 2:54 PM

Post #22 of 32 (2400 views)

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Re: [Anonimo] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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Anonimo......correct me if I am wrong. Isn't the Patzcuaro area colder than a Well Digger's A-s in the Winter? I read Michael's Blog and he talks about how cold it is there and the Shops/Restaurants do not provide heat. I hear that the scenery is beautiful but the town does not provide many comforts.

I had several years in the Countryside in Texas. It was 5 1/2 miles from a loaf of bread. I'm afraid I could never live in a rural area again. Small town people with small town mentality. If you were not born and raised there, you were considered an outsider.

Again, one man's Heaven is another man's Hell. :-)

Being in our 60's, we have to take into consideration that we may not be able to drive long distances forever. We plan on traveling as long as we can, but need a home base that offers everything close by, that we will need in our old age.

(This post was edited by macmember on Dec 9, 2007, 2:55 PM)

macmember

Dec 9, 2007, 3:15 PM

Post #23 of 32 (2390 views)

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Re: [RickS] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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RickS......Thanks. You are correct, I would never say one was better than the other, just that there are alternatives for those folks that are really having to live on a small SS check.

Some people have come to this forum asking if they could live in Mexico with a $500. SS check. They are told that it would be extremely hard, but don't expect the Government to help you if things go wrong.

Fortunately we don't have to live just on that SS check, but I would like to tell others that there is a place in the US where they could live frugally and have safety nets (food stamps, Medicare etc).

Mexico has enough people living in poverty, I don't think they need any more.

Gringal

Dec 9, 2007, 4:01 PM

Post #24 of 32 (2374 views)

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Re: [macmember] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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I can imagine degrees of frugality if necessity hits, but I can't wrap my mind around how a person could live on a $500 SS check in the U.S. The costs of food and any kind of shelter would make that a very daunting task.

I know someone who is nearing retirement age, anticipates a check of around $700 SS with no other income and is very worried about how he's going to manage. In his case, the plan is to come to Mexico on an FMT and keep renewing it. Since his Spanish is fluent, he intends to find cheap digs in a non-tourist destination and "live like poor people do in Mexico" . He thinks his $700 would actually go farther here. Time will tell.

Mexico does try to keep the poor from coming here to live by having income requirements that must be met in order to get a FM-3 visa. Trying to avoid these by repeatedly using a tourist visa would be tough, though I know it's been done.

macmember

Dec 9, 2007, 4:32 PM

Post #25 of 32 (2363 views)

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Re: [Gringal] Cheap Living in Mexico vs Cheap living in McAllen Texas

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Gringal, you may be correct. It might be easier to get by in Mexico on that small amount. What my thought was: depending on your income, and I think $500- $700 a month would qualify you for....

Section 8 housing and in some places, Senior housing for a very small amount.

They have commodity programs in some areas where you can get basic food products free.

You can get Food Stamps.

You can get WIC (Woman/Infant/Children) coupons for cereal, eggs, milk, beans, cheese etc,.

If you can not afford Medicare Part B, you may qualify for Medicaid, which is free Medical Care and prescriptions.

If you are disabled, they will send a Bus to pick you up at your door and take you to the store or Doctor's appointments.

If not, you can buy Bus Cards, where your fee is very small for Seniors.

Normally there are community Church programs that support the needs of the elderly and poor.

Even the Utility Companies have programs for the poverty level clients.

These are the "Safety Nets" I know they have in the Dallas area and I am almost sure it extends to McAllen, since they are all Federal & or State programs.

Another thing we saw in the McAllen area were Farmers Markets where the prices were great, compared to the Grocery Stores. McAllen is a tremendous agriculture area. I was told that there are Charity groups that are allowed to glean the fields after harvest. They in turn give this to the poor people. I guess you have to be in the "know" as to how to receive this.

Your friend being able to speak Fluent Spanish would allow him to live in less expensive areas of Mexico. Hopefully it will work out for him. God Forbid that any of us would ever need this much help, but in a way, we have paid for it as workers in the USA.

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