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tonyburton / Moderator


Jan 18, 2007, 4:25 PM

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Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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The Mexico Connect Forums have had several threads over the years about the number of retirees or seniors residing in Mexico. As previous discussions have usually concluded, figures are hard to come by, and many figures are decidedly suspect.
By way of a more academic offering, I have just realized that the Washington, D.C.-based Migration Policy Institute's website has an article entitled "America's Emigrants: US Retirement Migration to Mexico and Panama" by David Dixon, Julie Murray, and Julia Gelatt, in its Migration Information Source, dated September 1, 2006. This article is based on a longer study, available as a pdf file via a link at the bottom of the article.
Both the article, and the study, make for some fascinating reading.



morgaine7


Jan 19, 2007, 10:16 AM

Post #2 of 28 (3204 views)

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Re: [tonyburton] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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Tony, thank you very much for the reference! I wonder how all this will look in another ten years ...

Kate


cdubee

Jan 20, 2007, 8:45 AM

Post #3 of 28 (3143 views)

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Re: [tonyburton] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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Very interesting article. Thank you!


Bloviator

Jan 21, 2007, 6:21 AM

Post #4 of 28 (3096 views)

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Re: [tonyburton] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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Pretty consistent with what one reads here on the forum when discussions about moving to Mexico come up. I think, though, that the report would have been better had the total Mexican input not been from just San Miguel Allende.

It seems to me that the expat population there is probably not typical of the expat population throughout Mexico. If my impressions are right, it is skewed economically - more upscale that typical - and geographically - more from Texas and Florida than is typical.


Gringal

Jan 21, 2007, 8:57 AM

Post #5 of 28 (3067 views)

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Re: [dlyman6500] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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San Miguel de Allende is anything but typical, says she who lives there. We get our fair share of Canadian and cold-state snowbirds, a deluge of people from D.F. on weekends and the Texans and Floridians on and off, year around. There are a number of retirees of modest means, but I have been noticing an influx of the very wealthy who are building McMansions in the outlying gated communities as well as on the view spots above town. House-flipping speculators are now on the scene. Gridlock has arrived downtown.

This is no longer the town of Tony Cohan's "On Mexican Time". Tony lives in Guanajuato now, I hear. Hmmm.


arbon

Jan 21, 2007, 9:22 AM

Post #6 of 28 (3061 views)

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Re: [Gringal] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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"House-flipping speculators are now on the scene"

I reckon House-flipping speculators, AKA Equity Barons, have been "team tagging" for quite some time in SMA, and every other place on Earth where it is allowed without any hindrance of law.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~



Gringal

Jan 21, 2007, 9:36 AM

Post #7 of 28 (3055 views)

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Re: [arbon] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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Interesting side note re the speculators: I read on another forum an (unsubstantiated) posting that as of Jan 1, 2007, the seller must have lived in a house for five years in order to take full advantage of rules to avoid capital gains, but that this applies to houses selling for 5 million pesos and up. Another post claims that rich and influential folks have already figured ways around that.

Since my casa just ain't in that class (yet), I'm not losing sleep over the question, but I would like to know if the change in rules is really so.


morgaine7


Jan 21, 2007, 10:36 AM

Post #8 of 28 (3036 views)

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Re: [Gringal] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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Quote
This is no longer the town of Tony Cohan's "On Mexican Time".

Regardless, I love that book, even though I first read it 20 years after the era described, have never seen SMA, and am moving to an even less "typical" part of Mexico. Sorry to digress, but I just felt like getting that out ;-)

Kate


jwp_007

Jan 23, 2007, 11:57 AM

Post #9 of 28 (2911 views)

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Re: [Gringal] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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In Reply To

Since my casa just ain't in that class (yet), I'm not losing sleep over the question, but I would like to know if the change in rules is really so.

http://www.sat.gob.mx/...ma2006/134_9008.html


(This post was edited by jwp_007 on Jan 23, 2007, 11:59 AM)


Gringal

Jan 23, 2007, 12:12 PM

Post #10 of 28 (2902 views)

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Re: [jwp_007] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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For those of us who are Spanish language impaired, would you please either provide a translation or a synopsis? Muchas gracias.


Brian

Jan 23, 2007, 12:34 PM

Post #11 of 28 (2892 views)

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Re: [Gringal] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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It's not the best, but I would suggest that anyone who is Spanish language impaired, download the Google toolbar for either Internet Explorer or Firefox. The toolbar has an option to install a translation button which, when clicked, will translate the entire page into English for you.

Brian




interested

Feb 8, 2007, 12:59 PM

Post #12 of 28 (2768 views)

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Re: [tonyburton] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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Thanks for the article reference. I'm looking for information on how American/Canadian retirees decide where to move in Mexico and where most the retirees come from within the US/Canada. Do most do their own research or do they rely on outside companies? Any insight?


Papirex


Feb 8, 2007, 2:17 PM

Post #13 of 28 (2751 views)

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Re: [interested] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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Interested, I think everyone has their own story about how they ended up in Mexico, although some people probably just followed the herd to an ex-pat area. I donít believe many people would use the services of a private company for something as important as moving to a different country than their own.

I once attended a goodbye party here in Cuernavaca for an English/American woman that was moving back to Guatemala. She had spent most of her adult life living, and working in Latin American countries.

There were 40 or 50 Americans and Canadians at the party. All of them had lived, and worked, or owned businesses in Mexico for several decades. Our host told me that if you ask any of them how they ended up in Mexico, They would all begin their answer in the same way. ďWell, thatís a long story- - -Ē All of their stories were different.

I donít think the majority of ex-pats still living here chose to live in Mexico as the result of doing research or by using the services of a private company. If you donít have family here, I think making many visits at different times of the year to different areas of the country, would be the best way to find a place where you can be content here.

Rex
"The supreme happiness of life is the conviction that we are loved" - Victor Hugo


interested

Feb 8, 2007, 2:52 PM

Post #14 of 28 (2735 views)

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Re: [RexC] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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That's helpful, thank you. Do you know the names of some of the retirement communities in the area? Perhaps I can get in touch with them directly. Also, what do people do about healthcare?


esperanza

Feb 8, 2007, 2:54 PM

Post #15 of 28 (2731 views)

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Re: [interested] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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Retirement communities as in sorta like Sun City retirement communities, for foreigners? In Mexico? None that I've ever heard of--and I've lived here for 26 years.


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interested

Feb 8, 2007, 3:05 PM

Post #16 of 28 (2727 views)

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Re: [esperanza] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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But it sounds as though there are areas/cities with large numbers of retirees, ie Lake Chapala. Yes? How does one learn more about those types of areas?


esperanza

Feb 8, 2007, 3:22 PM

Post #17 of 28 (2722 views)

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Re: [interested] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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One can read a zillion posts on MexConnect, if one wants. Look in the Jalisco forum, which includes the Lake Chapala area, and the BajŪo forum, which includes San Miguel de Allende and the state of Guanajuato as well as the state of MichoacŠn.

One can subscribe to other on-line magazines, such as http://www.mexico-insights.com, which is a monthly subscription ezine with several years' archives of articles as well as current articles about Living at Lake Chapala (the name of the magazine).

One can bring oneself to Mexico and do the research, as CNN insists on saying, on the ground.

With all due respect...what one cannot do is expect those of us here on MexConnect to spoon feed you the answers. You'll have better questions after you do more of your own research, and we may be able to help you more then.


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bournemouth

Feb 8, 2007, 3:24 PM

Post #18 of 28 (2720 views)

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Re: [interested] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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Without being unduly trite, might I suggest using Google. I entered the words "Lake Chapala area" and got 103,000 results. Those alone could keep you reading for some time. Do the same for the popular coastal areas like Puerto Vallarta, Mazatlan etc and see what comes up. Good luck - you're in for some entertaining reading.


Brian

Feb 8, 2007, 4:26 PM

Post #19 of 28 (2695 views)

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Re: [bournemouth] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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This is a good source of information about retirement in Mexico:

http://www.mexico-newsletter.com/


Ed and Fran

Feb 8, 2007, 4:38 PM

Post #20 of 28 (2690 views)

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Re: [interested] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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But it sounds as though there are areas/cities with large numbers of retirees, ie Lake Chapala. Yes? How does one learn more about those types of areas?


Yes, the Lake Chapala area in general has a lot of expats living there. So does San Miguel Allende. As Esperanza mentioned, going through the back posts of the Jalisco and Bajio area forums will yield a ton of info, including a lot of threads regarding how people chose Mexico. Go through the back posts on the General and Living,Working,Retiring forum also. In fact, each of the area forums is a storehouse of misc data on the area in question.

There are some concentrations of expats on the west side of Baja California, and some along the Sea of Cortez also, but we don't have as many MexConnect members from there so you won't see that many references to those areas.

We're either typical or untypical, depending how you view it. I worked a number of years on projects down here, and Fran's family is from Tuxpan. So we retired here having had lots of previous Mexican experience and the family tie to decide on where. If the family wasn't here we'd probably be somewhere in the country where the climate is a bit better, but hey you have to make some compromises.

btw, this is not one of those areas with a large number of expat retirees, so you can start by marking Tuxpan off your list.

Good luck in your search,

Ed & Fran


Papirex


Feb 8, 2007, 4:40 PM

Post #21 of 28 (2689 views)

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Re: [interested] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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Esperanza has given you some good advice. I have never heard of an American style retirement community here either. There might be some unpublicized condo associations that come close, but buying a condo in Mťxico has itís own set of perils that you must navigate.

In the Ajijic area, there is the Lake Chapala Society. Some members of these forums praise them, others donít. I donít know anything about them.

You will need to do your own research to find your place here, if it exists. It is hard to impossible to find Paradise here, or a permanent vacation spot. Life anywhere here is filled with day-to-day living.

If you canít find a place where you will not be overly frustrated with many of the inconveniences here, you will be heading back across the border in a couple of years.

Imagine that every store and government agency only has people working there that speak a different language than you do, and no one cares about speaking your language. It will drive you mad in the beginning; it takes a lot of effort to live here at first even when you are married to your own interpreter.

Healthcare is something that each person has to find his or her own answer to. There is no one size fits all. I pay our health costs out of pocket, but neither of us has any chronic problems yet, or needs to take any expensive medications. Do a search of the forums, that topic has been covered a lot on Mexconnect.

Rex


"The supreme happiness of life is the conviction that we are loved" - Victor Hugo


esperanza

Feb 8, 2007, 7:01 PM

Post #22 of 28 (2665 views)

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Re: [RexC] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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Esperanza has given you some good advice. I have never heard of an American style retirement community here either. There might be some unpublicized condo associations that come close, but buying a condo in Mťxico has itís own set of perils that you must navigate.

In the Ajijic area, there is the Lake Chapala Society. Some members of these forums praise them, others donít. I donít know anything about them.

You will need to do your own research to find your place here, if it exists. It is hard to impossible to find Paradise here, or a permanent vacation spot. Life anywhere here is filled with day-to-day living.

If you canít find a place where you will not be overly frustrated with many of the inconveniences here, you will be heading back across the border in a couple of years.

Imagine that every store and government agency only has people working there that speak a different language than you do, and no one cares about speaking your language. It will drive you mad in the beginning; it takes a lot of effort to live here at first even when you are married to your own interpreter.

Healthcare is something that each person has to find his or her own answer to. There is no one size fits all. I pay our health costs out of pocket, but neither of us has any chronic problems yet, or needs to take any expensive medications. Do a search of the forums, that topic has been covered a lot on Mexconnect.

Rex



Go back and re-read Interested's first post. S/he isn't...umm...interested in moving to Mexico. It appears to me that s/he is doing research, possibly for an article or a book, about why and how folks chose the places in Mexico where they're living.

It's one thing to give (and happily) advice to a newbie who's just starting out to find his/her dream-spot retirement, and something else again to give free information to someone who wants to pick our brains for his/her personal profit.

The latter does not sit well with me.

/end rant


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Gringal

Feb 9, 2007, 2:09 PM

Post #23 of 28 (2575 views)

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Re: [esperanza] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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I rather enjoyed the rant. Seems like there was somebody doing research along the same lines about a year ago, except she was offering a free lunch to go with the brain picking.


Septiembre


Feb 9, 2007, 8:49 PM

Post #24 of 28 (2516 views)

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Re: [esperanza] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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"It's one thing to give (and happily) advice to a newbie who's just starting out to find his/her dream-spot retirement, and something else again to give free information to someone who wants to pick our brains for his/her personal profit. "

That's a big leap from a simple question.


esperanza

Feb 9, 2007, 9:02 PM

Post #25 of 28 (2509 views)

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Re: [Septiembre] Numbers of Retirees / Seniors in Mexico.

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You're right, Septiembre, it is a big leap.

But you know what? I've been around the block once or twice on these and other online forums. I've seen this sort of post before, even here on MexConnect, and it's not too difficult to read between the lines.

Plus of course I do have that crystal ball, right here on my desk.

I hope Interested will come back and prove me wrong. When s/he does, a dinner of crow would be fine with me.


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