Forums  > General > Living, Working, Retiring
For those of you with UCD plates...




addtocart

Jun 2, 2015, 7:21 AM

Views: 11502

    

For those of you with UCD plates...

|
For the people who fell for the UCD method of keeping your cars here, Sonia has an interesting post on her Facebook page:

https://www.facebook.com/...onia/252211011634302



Gringal

Jun 2, 2015, 7:33 AM

Views: 11498

    

Re: [addtocart] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
"If it looks too good to be true............."

Right now, I heard there is a moratorium on nationalizing cars at the border. There are some people who are are honest and reliable who will buy your car and take it North. Some of them post on here, so a search could work.
If I'm wrong about that moratorium, please correct me.



playaboy

Jun 2, 2015, 9:52 AM

Views: 11470

    

Re: [Gringal] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
There is no moratorium. 2006=07 NAFTA built cars can be imported at the border by Mexicans (presta nombre?). Takes about 3 days. Virtual imports are all dead in the water.



cbviajero

Jun 2, 2015, 9:58 AM

Views: 11466

    

Re: [addtocart] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
Google (ucd fraude guanajuato) for more info on the UCD.



playaboy

Jun 2, 2015, 6:54 PM

Views: 11402

    

Re: [cbviajero] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply

In Reply To
Google (ucd fraude guanajuato) for more info on the UCD.


There has been corruption and fraud going on at a lot UCD branches all over Mexico. It has been going on for years. A lot longer than our expat car issues have been around.

Some of the articles go back over a decade. Quite a few articles are from the last 18 months.

My Spanglish isn't great but it seem most of the articles relate to auto nationalization problems and ongoing leadership battles. When you google the people named in the articles you find a lot more corruption articles.

I wonder what caused the Federales to start enforcing the "real" car registration laws?



chinagringo


Jun 2, 2015, 7:48 PM

Views: 11392

    

Re: [playaboy] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
"I wonder what caused the Federales to start enforcing the "real" car registration laws?"

Could it be that the Federales have recognized that various "fascillitators" have been bending, twisting or otherwise manipulating the laws for their own personal monetary benefit?
Regards,
Neil
Albuquerque, NM




playaboy

Jun 2, 2015, 7:54 PM

Views: 11389

    

Re: [chinagringo] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply

In Reply To
"I wonder what caused the Federales to start enforcing the "real" car registration laws?"

Could it be that the Federales have recognized that various "fascillitators" have been bending, twisting or otherwise manipulating the laws for their own personal monetary benefit?


I don't think the Federales even know that facilitators exist. There must be another reason. Someone "Upstairs" must have ordered this.



chinagringo


Jun 3, 2015, 7:24 AM

Views: 11343

    

Re: [addtocart] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
Just one of many articles regarding UCD fraud:

http://translate.google.com/...egion%26Itemid%3D729

As always, how you choose to interpret and apply this information is up to you.
Regards,
Neil
Albuquerque, NM




playaboy

Jun 4, 2015, 5:15 AM

Views: 11259

    

Re: [chinagringo] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply

In Reply To
Just one of many articles regarding UCD fraud:

http://translate.google.com/...egion%26Itemid%3D729

As always, how you choose to interpret and apply this information is up to you.


That article is very recent. 7000 cars with bad paperwork working with UCD Coahuilla is a lot of cars.

Here is another article from April where UCD is refunding money to people caught up in the nationalizcion mess.

http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Felreporterodetamaulipas.com%2F2015%2F04%2F15%2Fucd-suspende-nacionalizacion-de-vehiculos-americanos%2F.



addtocart

Jun 4, 2015, 6:22 AM

Views: 11242

    

Re: [playaboy] For those of you with UCD plates...

|
I guess you gotta hand it to Sonia for posting this on her own Facebook, since she has been touting UCD as the answer to the car problem for a long time. She could have just hoped no one noticed.



slainte39

Jun 4, 2015, 10:43 PM

Views: 11175

    

Re: [addtocart] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
  
Some people are conspicuous by their absence.
Since a frequent poster on this board only claims nationalizing/legalizing 89 cars, you can not be laying blame for 7,000.


(This post was edited by slainte39 on Jun 4, 2015, 10:52 PM)



AlanMexicali


Jun 5, 2015, 7:37 AM

Views: 11145

    

Re: [slainte39] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply

In Reply To

Some people are conspicuous by their absence.
Since a frequent poster on this board only claims nationalizing/legalizing 89 cars, you can not be laying blame for 7,000.



I really wonder when ADUANA fines those involved in the many fraudulant nationalizations and especially the amparos that were issued by importers given by paid off federal judges etc. what will they do with the Pedimentos of all these vehicles. Will they ignore how they were actually gotten by used car dealers and individuals or cancel some or work out a fine to keep them legal etc.?



playaboy

Jun 5, 2015, 7:44 AM

Views: 11144

    

Re: [addtocart] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
If you search out articles online you will find that many recent news stories show a pattern of corruption and abuse. In the last 2 years, since the expat car issues started, there are many articles about UCD.

Here is another article I found dated right before the Aduana shutdown.

http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.oem.com.mx%2Felsoldeleon%2Fnotas%2Fn3502409.htm


Has anyone found out why the Federales are now going after UCD plated vehicles? Could it be that the States want their license and registration money? Tamaulipus UCD is refunding money to clients, are other State UCD going to start refunding money soon?



slainte39

Jun 5, 2015, 8:02 AM

Views: 11136

    

Re: [playaboy] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
Maybe Sonia will enlighten the public as she claims to be well connected to UCD.....and Aduana.



playaboy

Jun 5, 2015, 8:25 AM

Views: 11129

    

Re: [slainte39] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
Slainte, I could care less about Sonia/John and their claims. If people like what she/he says and want to follow their advice, they take their chances. She/he quit posting here. Let's not make this thread about them and stick to facts.

Alan, why would the Mexican government make an accommodation to people that tried to side step the legal process of nationalizing? I would think a government will fine people for attempting to skirt the process and make them follow the legal procedures.

People that listened to ALL the different facilitators promising nationalization from the comfort of their Lazy Boy got or will ultimately lose their money. Tio Corp, GDL airport with all the different people that claimed to be the "exclusive" facilitator, Mr. UC, the lawyer in Ajijic, and others charged inflated prices and gave them worthless paper. Those are the ones I am familiar with, I am sure there are many others out their screwing people.

It is so predictable for people to look for the easy way out of a tough situation, that they quit using their brains.

Anybody want to guess how many millions of pesos Mexicans and Expats lost the last 2 years using facilitators to nationalize their cars from home?


(This post was edited by playaboy on Jun 5, 2015, 8:27 AM)



AlanMexicali


Jun 5, 2015, 8:56 AM

Views: 11115

    

Re: [playaboy] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply

In Reply To


Alan, why would the Mexican government make an accommodation to people that tried to side step the legal process of nationalizing? I would think a government will fine people for attempting to skirt the process and make them follow the legal procedures.

People that listened to ALL the different facilitators promising nationalization from the comfort of their Lazy Boy got or will ultimately lose their money. Tio Corp, GDL airport with all the different people that claimed to be the "exclusive" facilitator, Mr. UC, the lawyer in Ajijic, and others charged inflated prices and gave them worthless paper. Those are the ones I am familiar with, I am sure there are many others out their screwing people.



Part 2 of my wondering:

Maybe for fraudulent Pedimentos but I was also wondering about all the importers that got Amparos from the federal judges by paying them off. Will these not be legal Pedimentos but easy for SAT and ADUANA to track them and fine the owners or might the government simply let them stay legal?


(This post was edited by AlanMexicali on Jun 5, 2015, 8:57 AM)



cbviajero

Jun 5, 2015, 9:15 AM

Views: 11103

    

Re: [playaboy] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply

In Reply To
.

Alan, why would the Mexican government make an accommodation to people that tried to side step the legal process of nationalizing? I would think a government will fine people for attempting to skirt the process and make them follow the legal procedures.

People that listened to ALL the different facilitators promising nationalization from the comfort of their Lazy Boy got or will ultimately lose their money. Tio Corp, GDL airport with all the different people that claimed to be the "exclusive" facilitator, Mr. UC, the lawyer in Ajijic, and others charged inflated prices and gave them worthless paper. Those are the ones I am familiar with, I am sure there are many others out their screwing people.

It is so predictable for people to look for the easy way out of a tough situation, that they quit using their brains.

To be fair,there were supposedly reputable facilitators and brokers like Oscar Angulo and Grupo Cuevas offering those services.
Is it unreasonable that some people thought that by scanning and sending their documents to these brokers on the border that they could virtually import their vehicles?
I doubt that anyone attempting to import their vehicle this way was trying to get over on the Mexican government,personally I would be happy to write the Aduana a check tomorrow...


(This post was edited by cbviajero on Jun 5, 2015, 9:23 AM)



AlanMexicali


Jun 5, 2015, 9:25 AM

Views: 11096

    

Re: [cbviajero] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply

In Reply To

In Reply To
.

Alan, why would the Mexican government make an accommodation to people that tried to side step the legal process of nationalizing? I would think a government will fine people for attempting to skirt the process and make them follow the legal procedures.

People that listened to ALL the different facilitators promising nationalization from the comfort of their Lazy Boy got or will ultimately lose their money. Tio Corp, GDL airport with all the different people that claimed to be the "exclusive" facilitator, Mr. UC, the lawyer in Ajijic, and others charged inflated prices and gave them worthless paper. Those are the ones I am familiar with, I am sure there are many others out their screwing people.

It is so predictable for people to look for the easy way out of a tough situation, that they quit using their brains.

To be fair,there were supposedly reputable facilitators and brokers like Oscar Angulo and Grupo Cuevas offering those services.
Is it unreasonable that some people thought that by scanning and sending their documents to these brokers on the border that they could virtually import their vehicles?



The 2 importers you mentioned did in fact always want the vehicles in their possession at the border. Oscar was quoted very near the end as doing faxed virtual nationalizations by one or two expats. I wonder if that was really the case.

Cuevas Brothers website stated they would nationalize any year vehicle by first getting it exported from the US. Next the owner sells it to a local car dealer in Tamaulipas. They nationalize it for the dealer. Then the owner buys the vehicle from the dealer and pays another 16% IVA. I did not notice where they did virtual nationalizations.


(This post was edited by AlanMexicali on Jun 5, 2015, 9:28 AM)



Gringal

Jun 5, 2015, 9:26 AM

Views: 11094

    

Re: [cbviajero] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
Yes, I think it's highly unreasonable to suppose that kind of incredible shortcut would be legal, as opposed to taking the vehicle itself to the border.

People need to be very cautious here in Mexico about many things: for instance, when they buy a house in Mexico.
Back in the States, there were 25 or so pages of disclosures legally required when they dealt through R.E. brokers. Here, there is NOTHING. Home inspections? Joke. Builders of new homes? Another joke.

Same deal with "facilitators". What are the requirements to become a "facilitator"? I don't know, and I'll bet few others do.
Lawyers do need credentials. That doesn't mean there aren't a few "lawyers" around who have none.

In Mexico, watch your back and check things yourself. Some people resent the "nanny state" NOB, but the reality is that some of the nannies were checking things for you and protecting you from some financial disasters like have happened to all the folks who have been relieved of their money trying to nationalize their cars.



addtocart

Jun 5, 2015, 9:30 AM

Views: 11090

    

Re: [Gringal] For those of you with UCD plates...

|
Some of would have been very happy to pay a big fee to the gob'mint at the local Aduana to get the paperwork straight and legal, whether it be to legalize a J-car or just not to have to drive across this country.



playaboy

Jun 5, 2015, 9:31 AM

Views: 11089

    

Re: [AlanMexicali] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
Those are tricky questions.

On one hand, there was a legal Amparo in place to allow nationalization outside of normal channels. The people and their cars that were nationalized were done legally using that Amparo. I don't see how the Mexican gvernment could rescind those pedimentos. Then again this is Mexico, so who knows?

The other hand is the corruption, which is not surprising. How does Mexico usually handle corruption? Has anyone heard of anything new since they busted the Judges, Aduana officials, and customs brokers last year?



playaboy

Jun 5, 2015, 9:43 AM

Views: 11085

    

Re: [addtocart] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
The Governments, Mexico and USA for export, did have very clear cut rules on what can be imported and how to import a used car. Problem is that the Mexican government did not make your ideas on how you wanted to handle this as one of the importing options. It would have been a lot easier on Expats to go to the local Aduana office and pay the pesos to import anything they want, when they want.


(This post was edited by playaboy on Jun 5, 2015, 12:41 PM)



Gringal

Jun 5, 2015, 9:44 AM

Views: 11085

    

Re: [addtocart] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
Of course that's true. I'd rather pay a fat fee to get things legal, too.
The bummer is when a fat fee is paid and people didn't get legal.

Friends went the bad route because the border trip would have been tough on their failing health. Getting old can be the pits. They could ill afford the money they lost in the process.



cbviajero

Jun 5, 2015, 9:56 AM

Views: 11081

    

Re: [AlanMexicali] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
Claudia,the person I spoke to last year at Grupo Cuevas told me it was possible,quien sabe..



cbviajero

Jun 5, 2015, 10:12 AM

Views: 11075

    

Re: [Gringal] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply

In Reply To
Yes, I think it's highly unreasonable to suppose that kind of incredible shortcut would be legal, as opposed to taking the vehicle itself to the border.

We disagree,it seems perfectly reasonable to me that in this computer/internet age that that sort of (tramite) could be handled locally or even online.



cbviajero

Jun 5, 2015, 10:16 AM

Views: 2789

    

Re: [playaboy] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply

In Reply To
The Governments, Mexico and USA for export, did have very clear cut rules on what can be imported and how to import a used car.

Clear cut..seriously??
Didn't they just recently change the rules so that now only 2006-2007 vehicles can be imported?


(This post was edited by cbviajero on Jun 5, 2015, 10:36 AM)



YucaLandia


Jun 6, 2015, 5:53 AM

Views: 2722

    

Re: [cbviajero] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
We've gone far afield from the problems with "UCD plates", but it's a fun discussion.

VIN verification for non-border imports: Friends of ours explained that the last amparo for "paper-only" imports (that functioned, producing legitimate pedimentos) had a requirement that the VIN of the vehicle be confirmed/certified - with fotos of the front, back, and sides of car - plus a foto of the VIN, before Aduana would process the "paper-only" import.

This amparo worked without using a car-dealership intermediary.

The most recent news in May that we've had from a licensed customs broker at the Belize border says that "paper-only" import applications for 8-9 year old NAFTA vehicles are trickling through, and that VIN verification and fotos are required.

???
steve
-
Read-on MacDuff
E-visit at http://yucalandia.com



playaboy

Jun 7, 2015, 8:59 AM

Views: 2638

    

Re: [playaboy] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
This 11/2014 article states that 150,000,000 pesos or more have been stolen fraudulently in this car mess by members of UCD. It also appears that there is a leadership civil war going on.

http://translate.google.com/...e-de-su-ex-dirigente


(This post was edited by playaboy on Jun 7, 2015, 10:27 AM)



cbviajero

Jun 7, 2015, 9:47 AM

Views: 2630

    

Re: [playaboy] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply

In Reply To
This 11/2014 article states that 150,000,000 pesos or more have been stolen fraudulently in this car mess at by members of UCD. It also appears that there is a leadership civil war going on.

http://translate.google.com/...e-de-su-ex-dirigente

Google translate really does suck,they're translation for pesos is..dollars..


(This post was edited by cbviajero on Jun 7, 2015, 9:59 AM)



playaboy

Jun 7, 2015, 9:58 AM

Views: 2623

    

Re: [cbviajero] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply

In Reply To

In Reply To
This 11/2014 article states that 150,000,000 pesos or more have been stolen fraudulently in this car mess at by members of UCD. It also appears that there is a leadership civil war going on.

http://translate.google.com/...e-de-su-ex-dirigente

Google translate really does suck,they translated (150,000,000 pesos into 150,000,000 dollars...


Your Spanish is better than mine. Google translate is better than nothing for someone like me. I knew it meant pesos not dollars.

Putting that figure into dollars it is 10 million in stolen money just dealing with car nationalization. That is a lot of money What percentage of that money came from expats in the last couple of years? 5-10%?

If any one does a little research they will see that there is a long history of problems and FRAUDULENT car issues at UCD. Why would any intelligent expat consider going that route with their car issue and even try to deal with UCD?


(This post was edited by playaboy on Jun 7, 2015, 11:17 AM)



Gringal

Jun 8, 2015, 9:13 AM

Views: 2534

    

Re: [playaboy] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
Simple answer as to why? Because it's easier, and perhaps a little cheaper.

My advice to those who need to have a Mexican plated car: Sell yours the legal way. Buy a Mexican car of your choice through a legit dealer and avoid the aggravation. Buy something practical for these miserable cobblestone streets. Tires go to hell fast here.



slainte39

Jun 8, 2015, 11:14 PM

Views: 2476

    

Re: [playaboy] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
Another reason why, is that the program (UCD), was allowed to be hyped to the nth degree on some boards, which fit perfectly with people feeling desperate for a solution to a problem. Something akin to all sorts of cancer treatments, that produce negligible or negative results.


(This post was edited by slainte39 on Jun 8, 2015, 11:20 PM)



Gringal

Jun 9, 2015, 7:03 AM

Views: 2448

    

Re: [slainte39] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
Furthermore, the postings were protected to the point that questioning of the legitimacy was not permitted. Most criticism was deleted or posters reprimanded for doing so.

IMO, this is not serving the purpose of a public web board, which is to not only permit, but to encourage posters to questions matters they are unsure of .
Had the questions been allowed, there may well have been a lot of money saved by people who can ill afford to make mistakes.

I was outraged by the situation and on here, there appears to be a policy of seeking the truth. I, personally, was not a victim of the scam since I am very cautious about putting my money in places I'm unsure of.
I got my Mexican plates the legal way: sent my old car north and bought a Mexican plated car. No worries.


(This post was edited by Gringal on Jun 9, 2015, 7:11 AM)



addtocart

Jun 9, 2015, 7:10 AM

Views: 2444

    

Re: [Gringal] For those of you with UCD plates...

|

In Reply To
Furthermore, the hype was protected to the point that questioning of the legitimacy was not permitted. Most criticism was deleted or posters reprimanded for doing so.

IMO, this is not serving the purpose of a web board, which is to not only permit, but to encourage posters to questions matters they are unsure of .

Had the questions been allowed, there may well have been a lot of money saved by people who can ill afford to make mistakes.

I made many posts outlining the problems with running UCD plates on your car, and was summarily flamed for my trouble.

I stand by my posts. If you really think that joining an organization, that was created to help poor campasinos drive their old trucks around the farm, will solve your foreign-plated vehicle problem, then drive on. I'm just surprised the Federales haven't stepped in before now.



slainte39

Jun 9, 2015, 1:17 PM

Views: 2401

    

Re: [addtocart] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
Well, to this board's credit, the UCD facilitator was warned to hold down the hype and solicitation. Not so, on another board where they ran full steam with advertising and self backslapping, as if they owned the board.
If you were flamed, it was probably by paid shills, as any thinking person with a fourth grade education, would conclude exactly what you stated.......it was a program for campesinos and the rural farm area.


I also remember all the thank you, thank you's to the perpetrator, for the wonderful service and help in perpetuating the UCD program/scam, that was like God's gift to Moses. Some of the same hypocrites, will probably complain about the corruption in Mexico.


(This post was edited by slainte39 on Jun 9, 2015, 1:34 PM)



RickS


Jun 9, 2015, 1:22 PM

Views: 2399

    

Re: [Gringal] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
"IMO, this is not serving the purpose of a public web board, which is to not only permit, but to encourage posters to questions matters they are unsure of."

I couldn't agree with you more, Gringal. The problem is there has to be some decorum exhibited whilst permitting said questioning, and that's sometimes a fine line. But some folks just can't address a 'premise/question/statement/conclusion without immediately flaming or being unnecessarily rude, attacking the Poster or sending them inflammatory PMs. Mexconnect has a long-standing Policy that it is OK to 'question' the thing but it is NOT OK to attack the person who proposed it... even if the proposer's position seems to be invalid, questionable, boastful or otherwise not according to another's viewpoint. There are civil ways of doing this and then there are childish ways. I don't see that Policy changing in order to appease the few attacker's desires, public web board or not.

Mod



Gringal

Jun 9, 2015, 1:23 PM

Views: 2398

    

Re: [slainte39] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
I agree with Rick S. that there are civilized ways to question matters without getting personal. No excuses for boorish behavior, and yes, there was some of that.

However, in this particular case, I saw both kinds of behavior. Simple questions, doubts, non-personal........all were out of bounds. That's my objection to the way it was handled.

I don't think you'd need any education beyond the simplest reading comprehension to realize that a program intended to help poor farmers was not suitable for expat retirees and should be at least somewhat vetted before being.....let's call it what it was.......heavily advertised to the benefit of one facilitator.

Are any refunds for "facilitating" going to be forthcoming to the folks who paid fees and didn't get the promised results? If not, why not?


(This post was edited by Gringal on Jun 9, 2015, 1:37 PM)



slainte39

Jun 9, 2015, 1:48 PM

Views: 2393

    

Re: [Gringal] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
Oh they got results alright, they can operate their vehicles in GTO, down on the farm.
When this program was questioned, and maybe the facilitator too, which as Rick says, is not allowed, the pushback was, the questioners were all foreigners married to, I guess abused Mexican women, and also that there was some evil bias against Mexican women from indulging in a perfectly legitimate business enterprise.(eyes rolling)



Gringal

Jun 9, 2015, 1:52 PM

Views: 2391

    

Re: [slainte39] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
Sainte: STOP THAT. I could injure my self from ROFLMAO.



tonyburton / Moderator


Jun 9, 2015, 4:18 PM

Views: 2369

    

Re: [RickS] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
At my advanced age, it is astonishing how many things come round full circle, if you only wait long enough. The UCD situation in Guanajuato was/is a very close cousin indeed to the almost identical movement in Jalisco some twenty five years ago. I know all about that particular operation, not because I ever had UCD plates/stickers, but because the local office in Jocotepec for such paperwork was run by a relative of our then landlady and occupied a rental space which had formerly been our garage...



AlanMexicali


Jun 9, 2015, 6:00 PM

Views: 2355

    

Re: [tonyburton] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
https://translate.google.com/...it-text=&act=url


I lived about 7 years ago for a couple of years and visited Mexicali for decades. There were/are California plated vehicles with expired tags there, some from as long ago as 2006. Not thousands but many and mostly beaters. The police didnīt care. Some people I knew drove them, They said they didnīt get stopped. They said when this one dies I sell it to a dismantler and buy another one for about $1000 US.

For the first time it looks like the SAT peopl care about them.


(This post was edited by RickS on Jun 10, 2015, 9:49 AM)



slainte39

Jun 9, 2015, 6:56 PM

Views: 2342

    

Re: [AlanMexicali] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
SAT never used to care about small underground businesses either but they are on a 10 year plan to bring those into the tax base fold.
Nothing is forever.



chinagringo


Jun 9, 2015, 8:02 PM

Views: 2331

    

Re: [slainte39] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
Won't sit well with many Americans but fact of the matter is that there is a prevailing sense of entitlement whereby American imports to Mexico feel there must be an easy way out of this most recent thorn in their sides! If we take the Lake Chapala area as an example, that same one or two day drive that many took driving down through Laredo is of similar length and maybe even has a shorter drive time? But all of a sudden, it has become a hardship or imposition that just might disrupt lives for a few days. Hell, the relatively simple drive into Guadalajara seems to have become a real hardship to many?

So now many have gone an alternate route and finding out they have been screwed while others chose to wait it out while attempting to find an easy way out. And where is everyone positioned at this stage? There are those who cannot get their vehicles nationalized because of the many abuses and the fact that these procedures have been halted. Then there are those who became firmly convinced that they were smarter than the system and have paid dearly for paperwork with virtually no validity. I know that I certainly would be upset with the Guadalajara Airport scam or the Guanajuato UCD scam where I can no longer drive my vehicle outside of the State out of fear what might happen with the Federales!
Regards,
Neil
Albuquerque, NM




playaboy

Jun 10, 2015, 7:13 AM

Views: 2289

    

Re: [AlanMexicali] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply

In Reply To
https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=es&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=es&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.uniradioinforma.com%2Fnoticias%2Fbajacalifornia%2F343935%2Fdesde-el-lunes-vienen-con-todo-operativos-contra-autos-chocolates.html&edit-text=&act=url


For the first time it looks like the SAT people care about them.


I have taken over a dozen cars out of the country during the last year or so. I have been stopped by different authorities at checkpoints many times. They have included the SAT, PGR, INM, Federales, Fiscales, Army and Navy, transitos and State cops. Almost all of them have and are playing with smartphones. It is very easy for them to be online, almost anywhere in MX. They can run your VIN number to check on the vehicles status. They have the means to enforce the laws now.

Do expats believe those websites that Intercasa and Sonia recommend to check if your car is legal are for expats? Those websites are for the aurthorities including the cops

Didn't Intercasa post about a client getting stopped, car impounded, and fined 15,000 pesos?

Most of my local friends are hoping for another amnesty program soon. They have been waiting for the election to be finished.



cbviajero

Jun 10, 2015, 7:40 AM

Views: 2286

    

Re: [AlanMexicali] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply

In Reply To
https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=es&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=es&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.uniradioinforma.com%2Fnoticias%2Fbajacalifornia%2F343935%2Fdesde-el-lunes-vienen-con-todo-operativos-contra-autos-chocolates.html&edit-text=&act=ur

For the first time it looks like the SAT peopl care about them.

Yep,they care about them,first they confiscate them,then they auction them off according to the article you linked.
Que bonito....


(This post was edited by cbviajero on Jun 10, 2015, 7:51 AM)



RickS


Jun 10, 2015, 9:56 AM

Views: 2255

    

Re: [AlanMexicali] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
Well I for one, using THAT google translate, could not definitively say exactly what was being said. Maybe the gist but surely not a good flow of the essence.



addtocart

Jun 10, 2015, 10:05 AM

Views: 2252

    

Re: [cbviajero] For those of you with UCD plates...

|

In Reply To
Yep,they care about them,first they confiscate them,then they auction them off according to the article you linked.
Que bonito....

Figures. They confiscate the chocolate cars because they bite too hard into the used car business in Mexico. Then they turn around and auction them off into the same market. The used car dealers, I suppose, buy most of the cars for their own inventories and somehow that increases the number of buyers who can afford to buy them?



cbviajero

Jun 10, 2015, 10:08 AM

Views: 2252

    

Re: [RickS] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply

In Reply To
Well I for one, using THAT google translate, could not definitively say exactly what was being said.

Neither could I,but the original Spanish version was pretty clear.
My personal favorite Google translation from a newspaper article;"They encountered wives and goat horns in the suspicious vehicle"...


(This post was edited by cbviajero on Jun 10, 2015, 10:36 AM)



playaboy

Jun 10, 2015, 10:43 AM

Views: 2237

    

Re: [addtocart] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply

In Reply To

In Reply To
Yep,they care about them,first they confiscate them,then they auction them off according to the article you linked.
Que bonito....

Figures. They confiscate the chocolate cars because they bite too hard into the used car business in Mexico. Then they turn around and auction them off into the same market. The used car dealers, I suppose, buy most of the cars for their own inventories and somehow that increases the number of buyers who can afford to buy them?


I don't think protecting the used car business is SAT first thought. I believe auctions are about getting the money they would when somebody legally imports and pays the taxes. SAT wants the MONEY.

I agree with Rick about the translation. CB, Alan or anybody else care to helps us out?

Can you imagine what would happen if SAT and IMN set up a checkpoint in Ajijic?

I have tried to avoid saying anything about Sonia/John I didn't want this thread locked. Check out Sonia's latest Facebook post. First she deleted her post that Addtocart started this thread about and then....... Just go read for yourself. The only other thing I want to say about them is; if you look at the dates of some of the UCD articles posted here or when you search Google, they were published at the height of their solicitations online. (MOD's if this is over the line than delete it but don't lock the thread)

Just saying!!!



cbviajero

Jun 10, 2015, 11:34 AM

Views: 2232

    

Re: [playaboy] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply

In Reply To

I don't think protecting the used car business is SAT first thought. I believe auctions are about getting the money they would when somebody legally imports and pays the taxes. SAT wants the MONEY.

SAT can have my money,I'll gladly pay them the import fees.
I think it's the Mexican car manufacturers and dealerships that are behind this and as the article points outs the most affected are Mexicans who can't afford to buy new or semi-new vehicles from their dealerships.


(This post was edited by cbviajero on Jun 10, 2015, 11:38 AM)



Gringal

Jun 10, 2015, 11:59 AM

Views: 7403

    

Re: [cbviajero] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
Look at the bright side:
Back in around 2010 when we needed to buy a car, and as far as I know it's still true, they got rid of the onerous law that had you paying a heavy tax for ten years if you bought even a modestly priced new car. This encouraged us to go ahead and buy one, and no doubt others were benefited as well.....especially the car dealers.

Like most governments, many laws are made or eliminated to help business prosper. There's no advantage to the new and used car dealers in expats having an easy route to "legalization", so it's no surprise the authorities are coming down on such processes like a load of cement.

I was amused by the recent era when there were more South Dakota license plates in the grocery store parking lots than there are residents of Clay County, South Dakota. Grin. And yes, a lot of expats have an unbelievable sense of entitlement. It's time they got over it.



cbviajero

Jun 10, 2015, 12:21 PM

Views: 7397

    

Re: [Gringal] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply

In Reply To
.

Like most governments, many laws are made or eliminated to help business prosper. There's no advantage to the new and used car dealers in expats having an easy route to "legalization", so it's no surprise the authorities are coming down on such processes like a load of cement.

Re-read the article,there was no mention of ex-pats,we are an insignificant drop in the bucket..
The most affected are Mexicans.



Gringal

Jun 10, 2015, 12:27 PM

Views: 7394

    

Re: [cbviajero] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
Wouldn't deny that for a minute. On this and other expat-leaning forums, the howling we hear is from expats, which was the point of my post. We are, indeed, a drop in the bucket and of course the laws are primarily aimed at the general population.



slainte39

Jun 10, 2015, 1:07 PM

Views: 7384

    

Re: [Gringal] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
I agree that the "howling", or the potential market, by the ex-pats has very little to do with the car dealers "howling" and the government crackdown. The entitlement you mentioned is augmented by an over inflated value of the ex-pat influence, by ex-pats, on anything. In reading these so called ex-pat forums, you would think Lake Chapala was the center of the universe.
Most car dealers could care less if there was an easy road to legalization for foreigners or not, and more importantly, there hasn't been, as it has been fraught with scams, scandals, rip offs,.....you name it.
BTW...the onerous tax you mentioned is/was called tenencia, and is still in effect in some states.


(This post was edited by slainte39 on Jun 10, 2015, 1:14 PM)



Gringal

Jun 10, 2015, 1:23 PM

Views: 7376

    

Re: [slainte39] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
I thought (perhaps erroneously) that the "tenencia" was federal, and that it still is levied on the more expensive vehicles. No?

Re the point of the thread, I wonder what proportion of Mexicans to expats used the UCD plates system to get by? Those who would know probably aren't talking, but it certainly was well advertised on at least one expat-leaning forum. Which ones?
Hint: the ones who are posting in English.


(This post was edited by Gringal on Jun 10, 2015, 1:27 PM)



slainte39

Jun 10, 2015, 1:57 PM

Views: 7366

    

Re: [Gringal] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
Nope, tenencia is/was estatal. I do believe there is some sort of luxury tax on high end vehicles now, but not sure if that is federal or estatal, as I haven't purchased new in 10 years.
There was a time when FM2/Inmigrado status, which preceded Permanente, was exempt from tenencia, but that ended in the early 1990's. When the tenencia was in effect in Jalisco, it was a progressively descending tax over the 10 year period.
One of the facilitators pushing UCD "legalization" for foreigners, laid claim to 89 successful work throughs, so it would be a small pct. in my estimation.



Gringal

Jun 10, 2015, 2:10 PM

Views: 7363

    

Re: [slainte39] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
Thanks for the clarification.

89 is indeed, a drop in the bucket. A painful drop in some buckets.



playaboy

Jun 12, 2015, 5:26 AM

Views: 7272

    

Re: [slainte39] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
 Tenencia were started to pay for the Mexico City Olympics in 1968? Here is an article about it's origins.

http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.elsiglodetorreon.com.mx%2Fnoticia%2F395625.tenencia-vehicular-historia-de-un-impuesto-mu.html


If Sonia's 89 expats were able to receive a GOOD pedimento, a GOOD factura, and license plates from their home States all from the comfort of their homes, Congratulations. You were able to beat the system. Good for you.

The rest are in a holding pattern.

How many expats have gotten stung in this car mess? A lot more than 89.



chinagringo


Jun 12, 2015, 6:52 AM

Views: 7257

    

Re: [playaboy] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
Since so few of these people who have paid their money up front and are now in a holding pattern with nothing but promises - I have to wonder if they aren't saying anything with the hopes that new money coming will allow refunds for those who have been "on hold"? Isn't that how Ponzi schemes are structured and ultimately crumble?
Regards,
Neil
Albuquerque, NM




addtocart

Jun 12, 2015, 7:00 AM

Views: 7254

    

Re: [playaboy] For those of you with UCD plates...

|

In Reply To


If Sonia's 89 expats were able to receive a GOOD pedimento, a GOOD factura, and license plates from their home States all from the comfort of their homes, Congratulations. You were able to beat the system. Good for you.

The rest are in a holding pattern.

How many expats have gotten stung in this car mess? A lot more than 89.

If she is talking about 89 UCD plates, they got NO pedimento, NO factura, and NO plates in their home states. They didn't beat the system, they just joined a corrupted organization that ultimately cheated the poor campesinos it was designed to help.



slainte39

Jun 12, 2015, 8:00 AM

Views: 7238

    

Re: [addtocart] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
 
As this mess unfolds (even more), maybe she was misquoted and meant to say, "it was only 8 or 9 UCD legalizations" LOL



RickS


Jun 12, 2015, 9:42 AM

Views: 7218

    

Re: [addtocart] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
If she is talking about 89 UCD plates, they got NO pedimento, NO factura, and NO plates in their home states. They didn't beat the system, they just joined a corrupted organization that ultimately cheated the poor campesinos it was designed to help.

I know it's not popular on many on the forum to report this, but of course she is not talking about 89 UCD plates. Her virtual importing, whether deemed good or bad, resulted in a pedimento and a factura and ultimately plates for the state wherein the owner resided.


(This post was edited by RickS on Jun 12, 2015, 10:12 AM)



addtocart

Jun 12, 2015, 10:10 AM

Views: 7207

    

Re: [RickS] For those of you with UCD plates...

|

In Reply To
If she is talking about 89 UCD plates, they got NO pedimento, NO factura, and NO plates in their home states. They didn't beat the system, they just joined a corrupted organization that ultimately cheated the poor campesinos it was designed to help.

I know it's not popular on many on the forum to report this, but of course she is not talking about 89 UCD plates. Her virtual importing, whether ultimately good or bad, resulted in a pedimento and a factura and ultimately plates for the state wherein the owner resided.

OK, my mistake, but her post on Facebook in the last week stated that only 2006-2007 Nafta vehicles could be imported at the border, but by using "her method" you can import any Nafta vehicle older than 2009, no trip to the border required. What do you think she meant by that?

Just wondering.



RickS


Jun 12, 2015, 10:16 AM

Views: 7200

    

Re: [addtocart] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
I'm not a Facebook follower of hers, but I suspect that is old boilerplate. It is my understanding, but could be wrong, that no one is importing anything, virtual or otherwise, other than 2006-2007 cars and those only at the border.


(This post was edited by RickS on Jun 12, 2015, 10:17 AM)



playaboy

Jun 12, 2015, 10:26 AM

Views: 7194

    

Re: [RickS] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
This has nothing to do with popular.

The claim is that using contacts at UCD, the 89 cars were legally imported into Mexico with all the proper Mexican paperwork to support it without going to the border. So far, so good for those folks.

That is a totally different program than driving with UCD paper plates.



addtocart

Jun 12, 2015, 10:40 AM

Views: 7190

    

Re: [playaboy] For those of you with UCD plates...

|

In Reply To
This has nothing to do with popular.

The claim is that using contacts at UCD, the 89 cars were legally imported into Mexico with all the proper Mexican paperwork to support it without going to the border. So far, so good for those folks.

That is a totally different program than driving with UCD paper plates.

Would these "contacts" at UCD be the same people accused of millions of pesos/dollars in corruption as recently reported on this and other boards?



playaboy

Jun 12, 2015, 10:50 AM

Views: 7189

    

Re: [addtocart] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
UCD frauds have only recently been reported here. Not to many other expat forums have talked about it. I don't think the Chapala forums discuss all the UCD fraud we have here.

Chapala expats have had scams thrown in their direction since the very beginning when INM announced their changes. I believe the very first scam was Tio Corp in Lake Chapala.



RickS


Jun 12, 2015, 11:12 AM

Views: 7185

    

Re: [addtocart] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
Would these "contacts" at UCD be the same people accused of millions of pesos/dollars in corruption as recently reported on this and other boards?

Well, none of us on any forums could answer that question but asking the question that way might be insinuating that they were.... just like using the word 'scam' (not you) when addressing Sonia's past importing business might be a little underhanded or at least leaving the impression to readers that all is not well for those folks who got their cars imported through her process. None of us currently know whether the process was 'clean' or whether there might be hidden perils awaiting but to insinuate there definitely is, is in my books, not being forthright.



addtocart

Jun 12, 2015, 11:39 AM

Views: 7177

    

Re: [RickS] For those of you with UCD plates...

|

In Reply To
Would these "contacts" at UCD be the same people accused of millions of pesos/dollars in corruption as recently reported on this and other boards?

Well, none of us on any forums could answer that question but asking the question that way might be insinuating that they were.... just like using the word 'scam' (not you) when addressing Sonia's past importing business might be a little underhanded or at least leaving the impression to readers that all is not well for those folks who got their cars imported through her process. None of us currently know whether the process was 'clean' or whether there might be hidden perils awaiting but to insinuate there definitely is, is in my books, not being forthright.


So maybe I don't read between the lines of my own posts, I'm not insinuating anything, it was just a question. Seems like her contacts at UCD would have to be at a high level to get it done when no one else can.

What I have stated in the past and will stick with, is that a program designed to help poor campesinos drive their trucks around the farm should not be used for gringos to skirt the nationalization rules. I have no dog in this hunt. I bought a new car from a local dealer and it is wearing Mexican plates in my home state with the factura and all paperwork safely locked away. I just never could see any good that could come of the UCD route.



cbviajero

Jun 12, 2015, 11:53 AM

Views: 7173

    

Re: [playaboy] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply

In Reply To
I believe the very first scam was Tio Corp in Lake Chapala.

And they are a Canadian company that never repaid the the losses suffered by their clients.



Gringal

Jun 12, 2015, 2:26 PM

Views: 7152

    

Re: [cbviajero] For those of you with UCD plates...

| Private Reply
The TioCorp "system" resulted in some serious losses to those who used it. I don't know if the Sonia/John system was or was not a legal way of getting Mexican plates which can be valid in any state. So far, the information out there is not very helpful.

I do know that it was not covered thoroughly on any board as yet, and on one of them, it was forbidden. People were on their own to vet the matter. This is true of anything one sets out to accomplish in Mexico, whether it's getting legal status, buying a house or getting a car permitted.

For most things of this nature, I pay for the services of a lawyer whose job it is to get the facts, and who has a good reputation for doing so. It's been worth it, every time. "Do-it-youself" methods are very chancy in Mexico and scams of every kind abound.


(This post was edited by Gringal on Jun 12, 2015, 2:28 PM)