Forums  > Areas > Central Pacific Region
This Just in From Vallarta...




esperanza

Feb 25, 2012, 10:29 AM

Views: 12995

This Just in From Vallarta...

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http://overheadbin.msnbc.msn.com/...?chromedomain=usnews

http://www.mexicocooks.typepad.com










chinagringo


Feb 25, 2012, 10:35 AM

Views: 12989

Re: [esperanza] This Just in From Vallarta...

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Just so people don't jump to the conclusion that this is just another sensational story from the NOB media, here is a link to a report in INFORMADOR:

http://translate.googleusercontent.com/...C3_93OAMCcWlMCssBSMw

On then from today's INFORMADOR, the blame game has already started:

http://translate.googleusercontent.com/...TUyQhKDZA-v-1mA1-n1w
Regards,
Neil
Albuquerque, NM




chicois8

Feb 25, 2012, 5:14 PM

Views: 12922

Re: [chinagringo] This Just in From Vallarta...

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You have to wonder why not more of these easy pick-en robberies, you have ships and tour companies enticing the adventure tourist to visit pure nature where no other tourists visit, lovely out of the way pieces of hidden paradise.
I guess they do not think the bandidos can't read...guess those visitors will have some stories to tell.......
Ocanahua, Jalisco
San Mateo, California



esperanza

Feb 25, 2012, 5:32 PM

Views: 12917

Re: [chicois8] This Just in From Vallarta...

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Puerto Vallarta and El Nogalito are hardly "out of the way places". This is the well-trodden tourist path for cruise ship visitors. It's a very sad situation. Fortunately there was no loss of life.

http://www.mexicocooks.typepad.com










chicois8

Feb 25, 2012, 5:55 PM

Views: 12907

Re: [esperanza] This Just in From Vallarta...

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This is what one of the PV papers say about El Nogalito:

You are literally in the jungle next to the river, listening to the water and looking out into the trees. When you park, you’re not sure quite where you are or where you’re going, and I’m glad I was there with friends who knew the right path for where to go. You sort of walk, and look, and see a crazy jungle insect, and look some more, and walk…and then you come out all in a beautiful jungle sanctuary overlooking the river.

I do not know where the robbery took place,maybe highway 200?

My point is if you advertise these hidden gems maybe un rata gets an idea to rob in and isolated area......
Ocanahua, Jalisco
San Mateo, California



Vichil

Feb 25, 2012, 7:08 PM

Views: 12892

Re: [chicois8] This Just in From Vallarta...

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They have a few places like that between Concha China and Mismaloya, it is not as isolated as it seems and it is the beauty of it for the tourists and the thieves who can take off in the hills and disappear.



bfwpdx

Feb 26, 2012, 6:15 AM

Views: 12833

Re: [chicois8] This Just in From Vallarta...

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So you are admitting that no place outside the major urban centres are safe anymore???



donemry

Feb 26, 2012, 7:09 AM

Views: 12814

Re: [chicois8] This Just in From Vallarta...

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Just for giggles, I googled "tourists robbed at gunpoint". 271,000 hits, the first four were Waikiki, West Palm Beach, Daytona Beach and SanFrancisco. What conclusion should one draw from this?



cbviajero

Feb 26, 2012, 7:46 AM

Views: 12795

Re: [donemry] This Just in From Vallarta...

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In Reply To
Just for giggles, I googled "tourists robbed at gunpoint". 271,000 hits, the first four were Waikiki, West Palm Beach, Daytona Beach and SanFrancisco. What conclusion should one draw from this?

Maybe the mexican state dept.should issue a travel warning for the U.S.
Chris



Bennie García

Feb 26, 2012, 7:49 AM

Views: 12789

Re: [donemry] This Just in From Vallarta...

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Try "asaltan turistas" and see what you get.



arbon

Feb 26, 2012, 7:59 AM

Views: 12785

Re: [donemry] This Just in From Vallarta...

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In Reply To
Just for giggles, I googled "tourists robbed at gunpoint". 271,000 hits, the first four were Waikiki, West Palm Beach, Daytona Beach and SanFrancisco. What conclusion should one draw from this?



Looks like you used the US Google, I just used the UK Google and got....

Tourists robbed at gun point in Nassau, Bahamas
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~




whynotwrite

Feb 26, 2012, 8:37 AM

Views: 12770

Re: [donemry] This Just in From Vallarta...

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 Those were all flukes..(. HA! Good catch! ) . . . BUT..... it is way more scary and dangerous in Mexico. My neighbors told me so..... Did you hear about the 85 year old guy who was car jacked (at a 7-11 store at 10am), left with a broken leg and people walked around him, not wanting to give aid or help to call police...sorry, that was Detroit yesterday.



JRinPV

Feb 26, 2012, 8:59 AM

Views: 12768

Re: [esperanza] This Just in From Vallarta...

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El Nogalito is about 1.25K off the main highway and that access road is pretty isolated. Good place for an ambush.



Vichil

Feb 26, 2012, 10:05 AM

Views: 12743

Re: [whynotwrite] This Just in From Vallarta...

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Detroit is not a main tourist destination and comparing the two is absurd.
Any bad publicity for resorts areas hurt their economy and that is the point. It is pretty sad to think you cannot go 1/2 mile off the main road in a tourist area without having to think you may get assaulted because it is "remote".
I guess hat puts the zoo and the Chico place on the danger zone too...



chinagringo


Feb 26, 2012, 10:12 AM

Views: 12740

Re: [donemry] This Just in From Vallarta...

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The constant need to rationalize or minimize by pointing out what goes on in another country may be one of the lamest discussions ever. It wouldn't even be valid if you compared Cancun or Acapulco. Treat each location and whatever incident happened as an individual discussion and don't drag in information which means nothing.
Regards,
Neil
Albuquerque, NM




careyeroslib

Feb 26, 2012, 11:33 AM

Views: 12728

Re: [chinagringo] This Just in From Vallarta...

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I´m in Puerto Vallarta. Here are some local links which I hope may be somewhat helpful. People can draw their own conclusions.


1) Link re: the recent incident involving the tourists. Note that the article said this was another indication of the ineffectiveness of the administration of the current Mayor. A meeting of local officials was called on Thursday evening (23 de feb. de 2012)

http://www.noticiaspv.com/archivo/188011


A bit of background on El Nogalito.


1) In October 2010, the proprietor of the only restaurant in El Nogalito was arrested in a major sting operation. He was, at the time a major local kingpin for the Sinaloa cartel. Note that his nephew was at the time a municipal official. See this link.

http://www.vallartaopina.net/...cat=loc&ele=8937



2) In November 2011, another known Puerto Vallarta narcotraficante was found murdered in El Nogalito--a village of 170 people. See this link.


http://www.vallartauno.com/...UNODICIEMBRE2011.pdf


(This post was edited by careyeroslib on Feb 26, 2012, 11:47 AM)



chicois8

Feb 26, 2012, 2:23 PM

Views: 12685

Re: [bfwpdx] This Just in From Vallarta...

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In Reply To
So you are admitting that no place outside the major urban centres are safe anymore???


I admit nothing,I see nothing, I hear nothing!!!!!

But when large tour companies tell the world where tourists will be taken so they really can be taken........
Ocanahua, Jalisco
San Mateo, California



JRinPV

Feb 27, 2012, 8:41 AM

Views: 12590

Re: [Vichil] This Just in From Vallarta...

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In Reply To
It is pretty sad to think you cannot go 1/2 mile off the main road in a tourist area without having to think you may get assaulted because it is "remote".
I guess hat puts the zoo and the Chico place on the danger zone too...

This implies that 'banditos' are laying in wait for anyone to come by, which is ridiculous. This was a well planed robbery, no tourists have had any problems at all in that area, the only other incident was several years ago in another remote area, close to Las Palmas - nearly 50K away from Nogalito, when a horseback tour was held up. The road to the zoo is surrounded by the village of Mismaloya and Chico's is on the main highway.



Vichil

Feb 27, 2012, 11:31 AM

Views: 12561

Re: [JRinPV] This Just in From Vallarta...

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The name may not be Chico but it is the place that is past the zooon what used to be a dirt road not the place on the main road.
Considering what is happening in El Nogualito it is not as tranquil as you make it sound. If tours are going there the roads could be patrolled. In Chiapas when there were lots of problems on the San Cristobal Palenque route they put in armed police on the buses and killed 2 of the 3 thieves that were assaulted the buses. They used to have armed guards as well on buses going through La Selva Negra. These things come and go in waves and hopefully, they will discontinue tours there or clean up the area.


(This post was edited by Vichil on Feb 27, 2012, 11:36 AM)



JRinPV

Feb 27, 2012, 1:26 PM

Views: 12533

Re: [Vichil] This Just in From Vallarta...

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It's Chino's Paradise, not Chico's.
One bus maybe twice a week (when cruise boats that sell that tour are here) doesn't warent a guard and anyway, it should be the responsibility of the tour operator. We don't have banditos in the hills, this isn't Guerrero !
Also one incident in, god knows how many years ? doesn't warent anything.
Apparently it was one guy with a gun and a knife.
As usual the crazy American Media is blowing it all out of proportion, sadly.



Poncho32

Feb 27, 2012, 2:09 PM

Views: 12515

Re: [Vichil] This Just in From Vallarta..

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If tours are going there the roads could be patrolled.
We live 1.5 miles south of the intersection of highway 200 and the turn to the east into El Nogalito.

As stated in one of the other comments here, from that point to the restaurant way back in the jungle its a good mile of one lane dirt road and quite ruff in places with no turn arounds let alone places to pass.
To think this road can be patrolled is foolhardy at best.

This incident that happen last wednesday is not the first time that bus loads of people are robed way back in there.

The tour buses get a rake off from the restaurant, thats why they go there , the cruise line tour directors need to wake up and stop booking these kinds of tours, no differently than if these types of occurrences were in the U.S. and they are there also.



JRinPV

Feb 28, 2012, 9:41 AM

Views: 12431

Re: [Poncho32] This Just in From Vallarta..

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The latest 'chisme' is that they have caught the guy and that he was a waiter at the restaurant in El Nogalito.



donemry

Feb 28, 2012, 10:05 AM

Views: 12424

Re: [Poncho32] This Just in From Vallarta..

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In Reply To
If tours are going there the roads could be patrolled.
We live 1.5 miles south of the intersection of highway 200 and the turn to the east into El Nogalito.

As stated in one of the other comments here, from that point to the restaurant way back in the jungle its a good mile of one lane dirt road and quite ruff in places with no turn arounds let alone places to pass.
To think this road can be patrolled is foolhardy at best.

This incident that happen last wednesday is not the first time that bus loads of people are robed way back in there.

The tour buses get a rake off from the restaurant, thats why they go there , the cruise line tour directors need to wake up and stop booking these kinds of tours, no differently than if these types of occurrences were in the U.S. and they are there also.

When did the "last" incident of a mass robbery occur in Nogalitos? I cannot recall any such incidents. Of course the tour companies and restaurants work together, but that is incidental to the trip itself and provides a certainty of quality and price for the tourists. You may argue the quality and price if you wish, but many tours include the meal in the package.



Poncho32

Feb 28, 2012, 1:19 PM

Views: 12393

Re: [donemry] This Just in From Vallarta..

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The tour buses get a rake off from the restaurant, thats why they go there , the cruise line tour directors need to wake up and stop booking these kinds of tours, no differently than if these types of occurrences were in the U.S. and they are there also.
When did the "last" incident of a mass robbery occur in Nogalitos? I cannot recall any such incidents. Of course the tour companies and restaurants work together, but that is incidental to the trip itself and provides a certainty of quality and price for the tourists. You may argue the quality and price if you wish, but many tours include the meal in the package.

First of all price has nothing to do with the problem.
What I was pointing out is the reason that tour bus goes there.

Lastly, the same thing happened last year, along with a murder and not at the same
time.
As I closed below( the cruise line tour directors need to wake up and stop booking these kinds of tours) The latter is the real point.



Poncho32

Feb 28, 2012, 1:21 PM

Views: 12390

Re: [JRinPV] This Just in From Vallarta..

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He could of been the same guy last year, there is a fool born every minute.



JRinPV

Feb 28, 2012, 2:51 PM

Views: 4059

Re: [Poncho32] This Just in From Vallarta..

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It's not the 'tour busses' getting a kick-back it's the cruise lines themselves, every place they take the passengers has to pay the cruise line. Some restaurants they go to have a different menu (prices) for the the cruise ship customers, I've seen them, higher prices to compensate for what they have to pay the cruise line, which sends an employee around when the ship is in dock to collect, I have seen that also.



Poncho32

Feb 28, 2012, 3:02 PM

Views: 4055

Re: [JRinPV] This Just in From Vallarta..

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Like I stated in my last, the price or who gets it is not the real point here, its the location and because of the jungle and ruff roads is why the bus had no protection and would be very difficult to protect.

Go there I have and you'll see what I mean.



JRinPV

Feb 28, 2012, 7:50 PM

Views: 4020

Re: [Poncho32] This Just in From Vallarta..

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But the hold-up had nothing to do with the bus, it was on the hike they were held up!



chinagringo


Feb 28, 2012, 8:28 PM

Views: 4016

Re: [JRinPV] This Just in From Vallarta..

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JR:

The following story contradicts your statement:

http://www.borderlandbeat.com/...ngers-robbed-in.html
Regards,
Neil
Albuquerque, NM




tashby


Feb 28, 2012, 9:28 PM

Views: 4009

Re: [chinagringo] This Just in From Vallarta..

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Quote
"At least one Mexican media outlet says..."


Quality reporting, that!

I don't know what happened, but I know it sucks for the people who were victims, it sucks for Mexican tourism, and it sucks for people who rely on Mexican tourism for their daily bread.

Personally, I appreciate hearing details from someone in the Puerto Vallarta area and not just relying on borderland.bet.



Poncho32

Feb 29, 2012, 1:27 AM

Views: 3989

Re: [tashby] This Just in From Vallarta..

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This will be my last comment on this subject.
Here in Vallarta we have skirted to the most part the problem that the drug trade and robberies and so forth that is occurring in greater numbers in other parts of Mexico that is driving business away,we do have our incidents here.

The latter problem here in Mexico is not going to cure itself soon,
In my opinion.
The overall problem is purely economics , until there is a massive movement by a political party here in this country to change that posture and also work with our neighbor to the North and vice versa to help in that strengthening the problem will be around along time.



JRinPV

Feb 29, 2012, 6:40 AM

Views: 3967

Re: [chinagringo] This Just in From Vallarta..

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I don't care what Borderlandbeat says, they are a radical organization, but we are here and get the truth. It was one guy who robbed 22 people on the trail, other to the rear of the group were not affected.



RickS


Feb 29, 2012, 2:10 PM

Views: 3896

Re: [JRinPV] This Just in From Vallarta..

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Why am I not surprised that the initial report said, "At least one Mexican media outlet said the passengers were returning by bus to their ship at approximately 5 p.m. after spending time in El Nogalito, a tourist area known for its lush natural setting. Masked assailants stopped the bus and robbed the cruisers of their money, watches, cameras and other valuables."

Notice the plural of 'assailant'....



JRinPV

Feb 29, 2012, 3:24 PM

Views: 3880

Re: [RickS] This Just in From Vallarta..

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Are you surprised that the Mexican media got it wrong ? The US media just copied what they published, both wrong LOL



wearechange

Mar 1, 2012, 11:09 AM

Views: 3823

Re: [JRinPV] This Just in From Vallarta..

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The interest on this subject is refreshing. Of course everyone has a different opinion. Not unlike on a post a while back on tomzap regarding an ex-pat business owner in Manzanillo who was being being threatened unless he paid a hefty sum each month. Nobody gave a damn.



Brian

Mar 1, 2012, 11:27 AM

Views: 3814

Re: [wearechange] This Just in From Vallarta..

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Borderlandbeat has published a redaccion.

http://www.borderlandbeat.com/...e-line-tourists.html

All BBB bashers can now rest easy lol

Brian


(This post was edited by Rolly on Mar 1, 2012, 12:10 PM)



sparks


Mar 1, 2012, 4:42 PM

Views: 3770

Re: [wearechange] This Just in From Vallarta..

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I was thinking this thread should have been over 50 posts ago. Message boards still amaze me after all these years

Sparks Mexico Blog - Sparks Costalegre



wearechange

Mar 2, 2012, 2:50 PM

Views: 3698

Re: [sparks] This Just in From Vallarta..

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LOL. We are only at post #38!